Tell me about Royal Holloway U L...

[Oldowl]

In general and specifically for Geography, IR and/or Politics.

DD does not want to be in a huge city and would suit a smaller uni with a college feel.

At the risk of annoyin everyone one..... and as someone said above it is not quite up there with those others you mention Durham, Exeter and Oxford so if she could get the grades for those 3 no way should she consider Royal H which is for people who can't get those grades and employers know that too. She will have more career options if she went for one of those other 3 i the order of Oxford, Durham, Exeter. Bristol too and of course the hard London ones like LSE and UCL and King's and Imperial.

Warwick is another modern campus style uni, on edge of Coventry not Warwick, confusingly. Lots of students live out after first year in Leamington, a lovely town. Have known several students there who have all loved it.

Bit harsh Oldie! It is often the insurance for likes of Oxbridge, Durham, Warwick and Russell Group and takes a fair few through Clearing but still requires As and Bs for most courses. A strong Performing Arts scene too.

Russell Groups universities typically have offers of AAB. Places like RHUL have offers of ABB. It's not hard for any fantastic A-level student to drop a few marks and move from A to B.

I wish people were less snobby about universities here.

As for UCAS, there's absolutely no point in putting down five A*AA institutions. I'm a firm believer in having one stretch, two at realistic grades and two insurance.

I studied there, it's a lovely campus & a ton of societies but is a very much campus uni.
Housing is really good off campus & London isn't far.

My tutors were fantastic & classes were smaller than compared to larger universities which they wanted to keep low.

Keele, Uni of Kent in Canterbury, Warwick, small Welsh uni's are definitely small.

I wouldn't go by the uni reputation as it is all about experience now. & what grades they get.
Also it's where they're happy.

I wouldn't go by the uni reputation as it is all about experience now. & what grades they get.

I wish people were less snobby about universities here.

Sadly I think both of these comments are flawed.

If DS2 could have chosen just on geography departments two years ago, his gut feel would have been to firm RHUL rather than Exeter. As I mentioned earlier, there were other factors for him - Exeter play a much better standard of rugby and he wasn't that keen on Egham as a place to live after first year. He's the most unsnobby, down to earth person imagineable - and often the most clueless. But even he worked out for himself (I kept quiet) that a degree from Exeter would be better on his cv than a degree from RHUL. Exeter wanted AAA (and wouldn't shift for DS's friend who applied for the same course and got AAB). RHUL wanted ABB and said at the offer holder day that people shouldn't worry if they dropped a grade or two - so presumably would have taken BBC. That's quite a big gap in entry requirements.

My nephew went to Exeter to do Geography from a top Grammar School 10 years ago. He is now managing a garden centre.

I don't think going to a top Russell Group is always the golden ticket, it helps but getting the right fit uni is more important.

A good course that they are interested in, the type of city they will be happy living for 3 years and offer extra curricular opportunities. DD will probably get top grades, so will be lucky to wide choice.

It is great to hear such positive feedback about RHUL, especially the great lecturers, good facilities and price of rent for the 2nd /3rd year.

Geography, IR and/or Politics

Those are relatively generalist Social Science subjects (although most universities would award them as a BA). TBH, with generalist degrees, as long as your DD goes to a university asking AAB-ABB, then she'll get a very good education. Most UK universities in the top third are all excellent.

The A level grades asked for give you an idea of the combination of challenge of the course (ie the grades are set to give an indication of the level of achievement we expect students to start with) and popularity of the course (A levels can be used as a way to limit intakes).

So then the search for a good selection of 5 universities for the UCAS form comes down to the "feel" of a campus (which you've already articulated), but your DD should also be very sure to do her research on the structure & coverage of specific degree programmes.

You can go beyond the UCAS recruitment web pages for most universities (tbh it's usually easier to do this at the better universities than at the post-92s), and get to the DEpartmental pages which contain information for current students.

Have a look at what staff are specialising in their research: are there people doing researxch, writing books, on things she's interested in?

What is the structure of the course overall? Is there choice? Where & when does the choice come in the degree? Is there the option for a placement or a semester/year abroad?

In geography, is there a lot of maths or science-based stuff in the degree, or is the emphasis on cultural or social geography. Ditto in the Politics/IR degree programmes: sometimes these can be economics/maths based, sometimes more historically oriented.

So it's worth looking at, for example, what are the compulsory core modules for each degree programme she's interested in? Optional modules will change more frequently according to staff interests and availability, but core compulsory modules don't change so much - staff generally rotate in & out of them.

You can do this pretty much all online, before going to umpteen Open Days.

For Politics/IR/History, the key things to look for are: what is compulsory and what is not. If they have choice then is there a good geographical spread (if that's important for her). Many years of studying the Cold War and American foreign policy, relevant as though they are, is not fun. Do they teach Middle East/Africa/Latin America?
Also sometimes a Department with younger staff is better because you get more enthusiastic Lecturers rather than big names who deliver lectures and leave the seminars to their graduate students.

My best friend is studying IR there. It's a lovely uni and it feels like a community, it's also very beautiful!
The only thing I would say is that the town it's in isn't very nice and there's nothing there 👎🏻

Egham is a lovely community

If sdhe might get the trades for Oxford and Durham then RUH would be a good back up choice. I agree there is no point at all in putting 5 universities all equally hard to get into . My twins have just gone to Bristol had had lower offers for their back up choice. One of their friends very stupidly put 5 equally hard choices ( assume again against advice of the school) and didn't get his place.

You keep your options open by going to the best university you can in my view. I don't know many people who would go to RuH rather than Oxford or Durham; whereas for many who would never get into Oxford etc RUh would be a very good choice. There is just that pecking order.

Oldie you have a very judgmental style of writing in your posts.

I'm always bewildered that so many people here think that everyone aspires to Oxford and Cambridge, and must be thick or have some of character flaw if they don't.

Take off your blinkers. It's a big world out there.

I thought the op mentioned those universities? If someone is looking at RH seriously, most people assume they do not expect the grades to get anywhere like Durham or Exeter. There is a difference and I would look at what graduates do afterwards as well. What sort of work does your DC want to do?

There were a lot of Oxford/Cambridge/Durham rejects amongst me and my friends...
I second the advice of having one or 2 'stretch' unis, one or 2 sensible options, and one 'just in case' uni.

Ds had offers from Exeter and RHUL. He chose RHUL as he didn't like Exeter, or the attitude or course at either campus. He got a First at RHUL, was encouraged his tutors, and loved the experience. The History Department at RHUL is very good and he studied exactly what he wanted from Rome to issues of sexuality and gender in the 18th century. He was engaged and motivated throughout.

Bubbles and Oldie Ds has no desire to do law, History is his passion and he wants a career in it, so RHUL and the MA he has just started there have been ideal for him.

I'm not sure how fixated parents & intending students should be about the perceived hierarchy of universities that employers have - for one thing, this will be very different in different professions.

But more importantly, the advice I've been given (as an academic) from Careers Services at several universities I've worked at (all research-led and/or Russell Group - they're not the same thing) is that we should encourage students to get work experience through summer work, supervised placements, work experience, internships. The best thing is relevant experience for the job aimed for, but any record of work is important, so even the Saturday job is significant.

That, plus a good degree, plus evidence of specific interest in the specific firm/body applied to post graduation, seem to be the important things. Simply being labelled "Bristol" or "Durham" or "Cambridge" is not enough.

Good quality work experience is readily available at most universities. We are required to run regular "Employability" events - in my Department we spend a fair bit of our limited discretionary budget on this - although it's depressing when we bring in some of the top employing people in our profession, and 3 students turn up ...

scaryteacher that's great, and shows exactly the sort of thing a lot of us academics on here say about generalist degrees: your DS looked for the details of a course/programme that suited him, and had a terrific experience. If his decision had been the reverse - if he had preferred the Exeter programme & campus - I'm sure he'd have been equally as successful.

Neither university was "wrong" - one was more "right" for him. Both offer an excellent education. We are very lucky in this country that the HE system is a jewel in our crown (if the likes of Andrew Adonis don't continue to wreck it).

The hierachy of universities does not really differ between the higher paid professions at all much. RUH is a perfectly good place but second tier to a few others. Just be aware and make decisions accordingly. Loads of students don't want to earn a lot - my son at Bristol for example his political principles (currently) do not tally with a high paid job or so he says and the bonus of not earning much if you have a loan is you never pay a penny back! Totally free education at the expense of tax payers.

I just want people to be aware of the consequences. I have a friend whose duaghter had the best A levels in her comp, wanted to be a lawyer, however she went to an ex poly with her friends (I cannot understand why her father and school did not stop her) and now of course cannot get hired by a law firm which a 2 minute internet search would have shown her in the sixth form. I think she is now on her second "gap year" after graduation and looking at other things and yes it might all work out fine,. Just make informed choices.

DSS went to look at Loughborough when applying for universities and really liked the small town feel. I don't know about the politics department but the University was very highly ranked in the recent Sunday Times list.

I did a degree in International Relations many moons ago and RH was one of the universities I applied to. I ended up at Birmingham which has an excellent politics and international studies department and although in a big city, much of university life is campus-based and feels quite separate from the rest of the city.

I have a friend whose duaghter had the best A levels in her comp, wanted to be a lawyer, however she went to an ex poly and I would finish that sentence with "got a first and was hired by a Golden Circle firm, and is now on track to become a partner in their NYC office."

That's the experience of a member of my family. Joined one of the largest law firms in the world, from a post-92 university. We could swap anecdotes like this all day ...

We could swap anecdotes like this all day ...

Yes indeed. There will be exceptions to every rule. But the fact remains there is a pecking order of universities which people may ignore for any number of sound or unsound reasons. But best to make informed choices don't you think?

Golden Circle - is it not Magic Circle?

The problem is that not all students realise work experience is important and so is university. There is a reason why there is a "pecking" order and I would like to know if anyone is doing research on why students choose universities which they can get into very easily, rather than stretch themselves.Students who go the top class universities, and do the relevant work experience, stand a better chance of getting to where they want to be if it is high earning graduate employment. At lower tiers of employment the competition is less fierce. I tend to think that a Saturday job does not hack it these days in the higher ranked undergrad entry schemes. Employers do look for relevant work experience in the field that the graduate wants to work in. Stacking shelves may not be relevant, other than for soft skills.