Classed as EU Applicant by Edinburgh Uni - Why???

[CambourneMum]

Has anyone had experience of this? Went on to clearing today and found the perfect course at Edinburgh University. Preliminary to taking details of results etc, DC was asked where he was born (Belgium), and whether parents had worked / lived in an EU country (yes - Belgium). As a result of this, he was told that he would be classified as an EU applicant and that therefore couldn't apply for that perfect course as there was no more room for EU applicants on that course. There was still room for English applicants!

We were stunned because the facts are that DC lived in Belgium for 2 years (age 0-2) and is a British citizen with a British passport, who has lived from 2-18 in England and been completely educated within the English education system. All qualifications are GCSEs and A Levels. Us parents are both British yadda yadda yadda...

This seems bonkers! Is it possible for this to happen or has someone got hold of the wrong end of the stick?

The thing is that technically he could claim "home/EU" fees status as he has accompanied someone back to the UK who exercised Treaty rights. Remember, the Scottish Unis want to give "home" fees status as the fees are so much cheaper-why would you pay 9k plus if you can pay less than 2k? The rules are also designed to penalise English students while giving the best deal possible to everyone else.

I'm not sure who I can contact apart from them as the fees people I've spoken to in person have been categorical about his status and not up for a chat

If you can find an email address for the Edinburgh Uni student advice centre/service, throw them in for luck.

Good luck!

I'm not sure who I can contact apart from them as the fees people I've spoken to in person have been categorical about his status and not up for a chat

If you can find an email address for the Edinburgh Uni student advice centre/service, throw them in for luck.

Good luck!

In order to qualify for ‘home’ fees under this category, you must meet all of the following criteria:

(a) on the relevant date, you must either be a non-UK EU national, or the family member of such a person; or
UK national who has exercised a right of residence for more than three months (as a worker, self-sufficient person, or student) in another EEA member state / Switzerland, or the family member of such a person For UK nationals, the utilisation of a right of residence can include time spent as an employed, self-employed, self-sufficient person, or student, in a country other than the UK of which the student is also a national;
Note: To be considered a family member of a non-UK EU national or UK national, the regulations stipulate that you must be joining or accompanying that person in the UK.

and

(b) you, or the person that you are a relevant family member of, must have been ordinarily resident in the EEA, Switzerland and/or the EU overseas territories for the three years before the relevant date

For the purposes of fee status the UK is part of the EEA.

"One person I spoke to said if DC wanted to wait til next year, they could apply as a home/EU student and pay very low tuition fees...

So someone has said that his status WOULD change for next year. I maintain that that is very odd."

No, you've misunderstood. There are two rates of fees a lower rate that applies to home/EU students ('home' here means Scottish) and higher rate that applies to students from the rUK.

The OP's DS is applying as rUK but is being classed as EU. He can't get on the course because all the EU places are taken. If he deferred until next year he presumably would get an EU place and only pay the reduced home/EU rate, not the higher rUK rate, which would save him thousands.

he is currently applying as an English student and would be applying full fees. They are saying that as he is in fact classed as an EU citizen then next year he could apply as a home/EU student ('home' here means Scottish, but is irrelevant as the DS would be qualifying as being EU) and get the reduced home/EU rate of fees. The only reason he can't do it this year as there are no EU places left.

'home' here means Scottish, but is irrelevant as the DS would be qualifying as being EU) and get the reduced home/EU rate of fees. The only reason he can't do it this year as there are no EU places left.

Right. So if 'home' in Scotland means 'Scottish' (domiciled?) what word do they use for the status referred to as 'home' in the rest of the UK?

RUK ("rest of UK") which, generally, means "English". The system is designed to penalise English Students.

rUK = England/Wales/NI. It is not designed to penalise English students, the Westminster government did that by introducing fees for university.

God it's one layer more complication than I grasped.

Maybe Scotland should hive itself from UCAS etc, then? It's two conflicting systems under one umbrella.

Fair enough, it's just the system isn't great if you're coming from England (or Wales/NI). For Scotland, EU fees status is actually a positive thing as it reduces the fees you have to pay (under 2k rather than 9 plus).

Well, it's usually OK, Dacre. Scots students pay £1.8k fees and are funded through SAAS for tuition and living expenses. rUK students pay £9k+ fees and are funded through SFE and other regional funding bodies. Generally EU students are classes as "home/EU" (so scottish domiciled or EEA) and so pay £1.8k fees. It just gets a bit odd if you're in situations like the OP-but they are comparatively rare, iyswim.

Thanks so much again for all your interesting and supportive comments - we're on the point of accepting an offer from Sheffield uni for the same course. They're going to call us back in half an hour, cos the system went down half way through the offer call!!

DC called Edinburgh one last time and discussed / argued all the points you've raised. The person on the phone had to keep putting it on hold to go off and check things with a supervisor, and the call took around 15 mins, but the upshot was the same. We can appeal if we want to. Don't know if we'll bother - their loss! DC is definitely going to email again pointing out that this is really unclear on their website and cost us a huge amount of time, energy and stress when we could have been checking out other unis.

Still, in a few minutes we'll be able to breathe a sigh of relief and enjoy the feeling - your support helped me keep sane today, and gave DS much needed ammunition in his 'chats' with Edinburgh. Thank you Mumsnetters!

Scots students pay £1.8k fees

These are funded through SAAS so Scots students pay no fees, they only take loans for living expenses.

Gpigs, that is crazy and terribly annoying.

I think you are right to turn to Sheffield. Someone suggested upthread waiting a year -- if your status would still be EU (according to Edinburgh's twisted thinking) then this would likely get you nowhere. They accept VERY few EU students because of the cost. I have advised many EU students hopeful to get into Scottish unis and both Edinburgh, Glasgow and St Andrews have turned away some absolutely stellar applicants from France. Six students last cycle turned down by Edinburgh, Glasgow and St Andrew's are now at Oxford, Cambridge, Durham and Imperial.

Go figure!

shock, you may be right, but then demand is also huge. We have heard of one boy born in Britain but with an Irish passport getting on an Edinburgh medicine degree as an EU student and several other London based Europeans choosing Edinburgh because it is so cheap. I assume that Edinburgh see the current approach as a way of attracting a limited number of tip top students.

In contrast though Edinburgh seems to be willing to offer lower grades than comparable Universities to English students, few seem tempted. But then why would you accept being treated differently than someone who you grew up alongside.

People really enjoy Sheffield, so congratulations.

Sheffield is a fantastic place to be a student.

Unless the rules have changed this year then I'm pretty sure you have been given incorrect information. Even if your son decides not to go there you should complain about this. Make sure you get names and note down conversations etc.

This sounds like absolute madness. Surely Edinburgh has got its interpretation of the rules wrong ?! It must have turned away several English students unnecessarily over this !
Can you escalate it to the vice chancellor's office ? I can't see how this really is the policy. Your DS is English !

This is bonkers!

I am now wondering about my DD. Born in Australia to British parents lived here 16 years. I am now wondering if they will try and charge her international fees.

Needmoresleep there was an initial "loophole" whereby students born and living in say England, but with EU passports (through their parents) were classed as EU students by Scottish unis & thus qualified for lower fees. That loophole was closed a few years ago - but doesn't explain the crazy stance they are taking with the OP's dc

They are wrong but not sure how you can convince them in very short timeframe unless can escalate as PP have advised. UK citizen resident in UK for the last three years is RUK. Some Scottish university websites spell this out more clearly than others (Dundee, Heriot Watt for example). The questionnaire to determine fee status (whIch asks about where born etc) is not even needed when it's clear cut like this.

Decorhate, I am thinking of central London Europeans. Their parents would consider themselves Spanish, French or whatever expats working in London. I may be wrong and would not know on what basis they pay fees, but a very very high proportion of kids we know who chose Edinburgh would not be British passport holders. Given the line taken by Edinburgh in this case, I may not be wrong in my assumption that a major attraction is the low fees.

Yes that would make a difference especially if the children were born outside the UK. Tbh the whole thing is a mess and confusing.

How can it be right that fees are lower for non-UK residents who have never paid taxes etc in this country, than non-Scottish UK residents. Madness.

I thought it was complicated enough last year for dd (born in UK but never got her a UK passport, has an Irish one). The wording on the UCAS form was ambiguous so we were unsure what her status would be. I think she had to send off extra information to the student loan company too. It would be much clearer if they didn't ask for "nationality" as that is open to interpretation.

It isn't relevant where the kids are born. It's whether or not they meet the definition of a home fees /RUK/Eu or foreign student.