Anyone whose DD or DS had a disastrous Oxbridge interview....

[Supermanspants]

..... and managed to get an offer?
Hideous interview today. Grilled on a topic she hasn't even covered in her A level course and based purely on a 7 page academic article she only got half an hour before the interview.
She is so down about it all.

Does Cambridge not offer free accommodation to interviewees?

no they said only in exceptional cicumstances .He didn't live far enough away.But it was impossible to do there and back on the train in a day for him.

That's surprising because the norm at Oxford is that everyone stays in college.
If train times made it tricky I would (or he should) have argued to be given accommodation.

dolly:

1. Thinking about this thread, I asked my son how he feels, four years on, that his interviews went. He confirmed what I thought I remembered, that he didn't fine them gruelling. Admittedly, that was Oxford and a humanities subject, but I don't think it's cut and dried that if you think it went well you haven't got in. It could be that the interview was challenging but the interviewee enjoyed the challenge, rather than the interview being an easy ride because the interviewee was written off as a no-hoper in the first couple of minutes. That must have been what happened with my son, as he got an offer and had a great three years. He isn't an Einstein, either - he didn't get all A*s at A level and wasn't top of his year or anywhere close once he was at Oxford.

1. Given the amount of time and effort Oxford and Cambridge put into their interviews, I'd be amazed if they invite anyone along to make up the numbers. Everybody they invite must be considered a good candidate for interview, on the basis of their actual and predicted results, academic reference, test results, sample pieces of work and personal statement. The interview is the final assessment. It may well be that once they have the candidate in front of them they decide fairly soon that s/he isn't a good fit for the style of teaching at Oxford/Cambridge, but it's impossible for us to second guess from outside the process. Even if the college that interviewed him doesn't make an offer he might still end up getting something from the pool if the interview went well.

Good luck to all applicants and their families! Not long to wait now.

dolly
My ds had an interview at Cambridge for maths and also thought his interviews went well. He seemed disappointed that the questions weren't harder - he said he could answer everything quite easily. He felt they were trying to help him when he didn't need any help! Maybe they were trying to speed him up a bit, who knows. He actually felt he wasn't challenged enough! I was worried that he found it easy and thought it was a bad sign. However, he got an offer.
Unfortunately, he didn't do well enough in the STEP exams despite getting 4 A*s!
Good luck to your ds.

Given that the STEP is the acid test, maybe the Camb interviews are more to see how they would fare in tutorials, as they know the hard questions will be faced in STEP anyway?
Whereas at Ox they know the results of the tests and so may be probing based on those?

Maths at Cambridge is unusual though MrsU - as I'm sure you're aware - in terms of how many offers are made in relation to the number of places. Oxford hasn't got the same latitude.

Got most of the maths questions wrong at my Cambridge interview ages ago and got in. It's hard to read much into how an interview goes. If you have had a good discussion it could just as easily be from a tutor who's already decided they want you who wants to explore your thoughts, or from a tutor who has written you off but decided to at least create a positive experience. Being pressed hard might be an indication that you are borderline or that they are impressed want to find you just how really smart you are.

So roguedad why would they waste someone's time andmoney dragging themhundreds of miles to an interview if they have written them off.it is unacceptable!

You're being a bit over the top with this dolly. They might very well 'write someone off' soon after the start of the interview but all those they 'write off' don't get invited in the first place. Just because your DC had an interview he didn't find challenging doesn't mean he won't get an offer either - I don't really understand what your beef is.

If you look at the stats (certainly for medicine) it appears that if you have 95% UMS you have a high chance for being made an offer (from Cambridge) whereas if you have less than 90%, the chances are extremely low however they still interview 80% of their candidates.

I think it does work out very expensive particularly if overnight stays are necessary.

I think dolly's complaints are a bit ironic really: the vast majority of applicants for maths at Cambridge are invited for interview, precisely so that they have the opportunity to demonstrate their potential. Everybody who is interviewed has a realistic chance of an offer, based on their UCAS application. Even if they don't get an offer, it is not a waste of time as the whole interview experience is very useful in itself for a prospective maths undergraduate.

One could set filters more harshly and invite less applicants to interview, but most filters would discriminate against students from lower achieving schools or from backgrounds with no tradition of university study. For example, pushing up the cutoff for AS UMS tends to favour students from selective schools.

Interviewers need to be aware of this and they need to give every candidate the opportunity to show off what they can do rather than sticking with easy questions.

Why on earth would you think interviewers are not aware of this? Aren't you assuming something about their own backgrounds in thinking that they aren't aware of the costs of travelling?

The only reason an interviewer sticks with (relatively) easy questions is if a student cannot get very far with any of them. What on earth would be the point of asking harder and harder questions, tearing the applicant to pieces, making them feel more and more stressed? Isn't it far less cruel to stick with a pleasant discussion rather than pushing the candidate until they collapse?

maybe the Camb interviews are more to see how they would fare in tutorials, as they know the hard questions will be faced in STEP anyway?

The (decision making parts of) Cambridge maths interviews are basically STEP questions but it is considered hard to distinguish definitively between candidates based on short interviews/short tests before interview, hence the over-offering based on STEP grades. This is anticipated to change with the removal of AS: definitive offers are likely to be made based on longer pretests akin to Oxford's MAT. Imo the selection of maths students by both Oxford and Cambridge inevitably has a certain amount of error: the top candidates are obvious but for many others you are looking at very small differences and trying to correct for differing backgrounds.

This is anticipated to change with the removal of AS: definitive offers are likely to be made based on longer pretests akin to Oxford's MAT.

That's very interesting ... Maths and FM teaching for the new A levels doesn't start until September 2017, when my ds goes into 6th form. He's likely to do a maths/ComSci type degree, and I'm already put off by STEP! So will be pleased if this changes

On the other hand students from disadvantaged schools actually tend to do worse at pretests such as MAT than STEP. (The main reason is that the latter takes place at the end of year 13, whereas MAT has to take place in the first term of year 13, so selective schools which have taught further into the A2 curriculum are at an advantage. STEP tests higher level material and thus it is easier to ask deeper questions which can't be prepared for by rote. Moreover there is a lot of online preparation available for STEP, plus subsidised free/residential courses.) From the diversity perspective, pretests are considered by many to be likely to make things worse, not better.

dolly - a long time ago Oxbridge maths ran the old entrance exams where papers were sent to schools and kids took the test there. So schools with a history of Oxbridge entry built up a handy database of question types and improved their coaching ability. In order to make things fairer this was changed - everybody who applied to Oxford for example was brought to Oxford, sat a test and received an interview a day or two after. This had the consequence that there were a bunch of kids who did badly on the test, and then without any mitigating circumstances would stand little chance of an offer. They would still receive interviews nevertheless and it would be a ghastly tutor who would not at least make the experience a positive one, and some minds would change. Things were changed again and fewer kids were invited up having taken a pre-selection test earlier. It will probably change many times esp with A level structure changing at well. At no time were people dragged to an interview who stood no chance.

dolly's premise is false. The message on this thread seems to be that if an interviewee finds the going was tough, don't worry about it, because the tutors are quick to spot those who aren't up to it and don't get heavy with them because, as disquisitiones says, that would be both pointless and mean. dolly has re-interpreted that as some idea which was never mooted about the college having him 'written him off' before he even started to speak, which is ridiculous.

Of course the very obvious other alternative to dolly's DC being left feeling unchallenged is that dolly's DC is an absolute genius. Which may well be true. Some of these kids will be after all. I guess if you're a truly exceptional mathematician perhaps nothing feels tough?

Anyhow, not long for any of these DC to go!

Well said, Molio
In fact there is no point in second guessing all this.
I have a very good friend who is a Fellow at one of the colleges and has been interviewing for years. I have every confidence in his integrity and ability to spot potential for the very hard work that will be required for the following three or four years.
My own DS is applying for a different college and course, but it does give me confidence that he is likely to have been interviewed by similarly serious people and that if he gets a place he will do well, and that if he doesn't it will have been decided on a rational basis, that there are better candidates, and that he will thrive elsewhere...

Have just realised that it will likely be a letter with the oxford decision either way, and I am likely to be at home alone with it if it arrives 7th which is the day the DC go back to school Hoping will arrive on 6th so DS will be around to open it immediately...

I was in that position last year Mrs U - home alone. When it arrived I put in gingerly on the side like an unexploded bomb and gainfully employed myself by pacing round the house until he had a chance to phone from school. Oh, and I might have held it up to the light a couple of times.

Thx Hocus!!! One of the many marvellous things about MN is how people come along to reassure they have been there and done that and survived Of course in that situation, would have to look at the postmark (first college, second college?) and not go on TSR to second-guess size and thin or thickness of letter and txt DS to let him know letter has arrived

Oh I did text him to say it had arrived !

DD2 has suggested she takes the day off school on the 12th when she's expecting an email from her chosen college so that she doesn't start crying (she'll cry either way round) at school. Apparently all she'd be doing is "pointless revision" for mocks so really, she'd be better off staying at home. She says .

DS just told me he is expecting to hear 'mid January' - so he seems to be managing our expectations - I did not comment
So will play the game, and make plans for 7th, so am not home alone with any putative letters

Good luck to those waiting to hear. We were in the same position last year.

Dolly - dd felt her interviews at Cambridge went well - one very well and one quite well. I thought on that basis she wouldn't get an offer as they obviously hadn't made it difficult enough for her. She did get an offer and she is definitely not a genius . I hasten to add it was not for maths.

Good luck folks! Today is the day for some of us. DD informs me that last year a lot of people got their e-mail from their Oxford college the day BEFORE the 7th January.
After she told me late yesterday evening I could not get off to sleep.
Don't think I am cut out for the Groves of Academia.