Oxbridge question (sorry sorry sorry)

[yeOldeTrout]

DD is a high achieving all rounder.
She has many ideas what to study at Uni, but main thing is... she doesn't have a deep passion (& probably never will) for what to study. Nevertheless, she will excel at whatever she puts her mind to and finally settles on.

So, even if she gets wild A*s in everything, I think there would be no point in applying to Oxbridge, because they care about "passion" for the subject... is that right? She won't be able to sincerely say in an interview "I am deeply truly madly passionate about X"

The school have already put an Oxbridge flea in her ear, but I think it's rather misplaced. There are better Uni destinations for high achievers like her (I think?).

TIA.

I don't let the children use the word passion except when describing sex actually. I dislike its use in relation to anything else.

Passion is a cliché best avoided, even for the person who genuinely is passionate about their subject. Find more meaningful ways of demonstrating your enthusiasm. 'passionate' is lazy.

The front page of the Oxford website undergrad admissions says (in big)
Oxford University is world-famous for academic excellence. We pick the best and brightest students purely on their academic merit and passion for their chosen course

Academics don't write such websites.... the words above sound typical of marketing teams.

Disquisitiones, late to this, but do you think recruitment practices, particuarly in the finance, but even the public, sector are impacting on second and third year focus. At least with maths based degrees. Strong performance during holiday internships appears to have overtaken the milk round as the primary method of recruitment. This means that sometimes from the first term, and certainly from the fourth students, are devoting time and energy to what can be lengthy multi-stage applications for summer holiday internships. Then you have to pull out all the stops during the internship to impress. Some, one of DS' friends went to Goldman, expect internees to demonstrate an extraordinary level of commitment. To the extent that you would probably need a holiday to recover.

First year exam results might then be a turning point. Are they good enough to warrent continuing to pay full attention to the degree, and the hope that they qualify you for a good postgraduate course, or are you better off spending more time engaging with future employers.

I think you live in quite a different world to me, needmoresleep, as I simply don't see students spending vast amounts of time and energy on internship applications, to the extent that it affects their studies. (Many do internships but internships are not their main focus during term time.)

Perhaps LSE students do this, but mine really don't. Many students genuinely enjoy the subject and aren't particularly interested in the treadmill to get a "top" job. Lots of my students don't even start to apply until after graduating but typically they are still strong candidates for the kind of "top" jobs you mean, even without vast internship experience. And many of my students are happy in non-City jobs that you might not perhaps call the "top" ones but which are intellectually fulfilling.

I suspect LSE is at the extreme end of any scale. A lots of students are very career orientated right from the start. A short at an international finance career seems to be what draws many to study in London. The careers office apparently limit new entrants to three careers appointments in their first term, though our guide proudly told us he had managed five.

DS, however, does have a deep interest in his subject and is not keen on joining the treadmill. Though unlike Cambridge there is limited scope to switch degree course at the end of your first year, LSE economics allows you to pick from quite a wide range of courses. There are in effect seperate banking and accountancy tracks where you pick relevent courses, whilst the "harder" maths courses help open doors for post-grad. DS luckily has been able to choose the latter. Internship applications seem to be quite lengthy (application forms, telephone interviews, apptitude tests, formal interviews), but perhaps this is for the more generalist positions, rather than those seeking maths/research skills. Lack of dedication to the process means he did not get anything last year and may not this.

I don't think it is necessarily a bad thing. Secondary education is quite a treadmill, and tertiary involves a lot more hard work than it did in my day. Taking time out has benefits.

Accountancy is LSE's largest degree and from 2016 they will be offering a dedicated finance degree. Perhaps this will mean the economics department see more students with a passion for the subject. Or perhaps you need to interview to sift out those who can, or want to, explore the subject in more depth.