Oxford/Cambridge and the RG Universities that give out A* offers

[busymummy3]

High achieving DD - all A at GCSE (12 ) predicted grades at A level A A A did not want to try for Oxbridge and similarly after 3 visits to Durham (Summer School, Open Day and Offer ) does not really like the academic slightly public school type atmosphere there. She has 5 offers ,all from RG Universites : AAA, AAA, AAB, AAB( from Unis who offer range AAA-AAB) and AAB.She wants to go to the RG university with an AAA offer loved the course , loved the Open Day and Offer Day loved the city felt comfortable from first walking in on the Open Day and felt it even more when went for Offer Day.
We just sometimes feel that there is an expectation that with the grades that she and others have already and predicted grades, they should only consider Oxbridge or Durham , Bristol , Exeter et al which offer A A A in her subject (History).
Does it make sense to have Firm as AAA and insurance as A*AA when really she preferred one of the AAB unis to Durham , again for the same reasons she prefers the AAA uni.
What would she be potentially missing out on?
Is it so wrong not to consider them or is this just a Mumsnet thing?

The only reason FM is not compulsory for Maths degrees is that some schools don't offer it, and universities cannot penalise such students, particularly as they are more likely to be from disadvantaged backgrounds.

Good job your on the ball littleham can advise better for your dc you've done your homework better than the school. FM would strengthen dc application probably be at a disadvantage if not take it. Silly school.

My DD is going to do a maths degree with no FM (not at a MN 'top' uni) . She didn't realise she liked maths as much as she does before choosing her A'levels so didn't choose FM.

The only reason FM is not compulsory for Maths degrees is that some schools don't offer it, and universities cannot penalise such students, particularly as they are more likely to be from disadvantaged backgrounds.

A small number of schools and sixth form colleges indeed don't offer FM.

However, many courses do nonetheless insist on FM: UCL is another example

www.ucl.ac.uk/maths/prospective-students/undergraduates

Bath don't insist on FM:

www.bath.ac.uk/study/ug/prospectus/subject/mathematical-sciences/entry-requirements/

but the offer is higher without FM (AAA plus STEP instead of A*AA) and physics/computer science is required. They explain why FM is strongly desirable.

If your school does offer FM and you didn't take it, you won't get into such a course without FM. The number of students accepted without FM (because their schools don't offer it) is very, very small.

Note that Cambridge maths does not officially insist on A level physics, although some colleges do, but in practice you won't get in without physics either, since a good fraction of the maths tripos is mathematical physics. The same is probably true of Oxford although I know less about their admissions.

Rats. They do offer Further Maths but it clashes with another of her favourite subjects. Sixth form have said not to worry as she can do still do 'ordinary' Maths and this other subject, leaving all her options open (she is not sure whether to take Maths in the future or the other subject).

From what you have said it would be a real downer for a lot of universities and a door might be forever locked.

Littleham

Whilst FM is great, if your DD wants to keep her options open she will still have plenty of universities who will consider her for a maths degree without FM. Has she looked at the Scottish Ancients? Most of these offer accelerated entry into 2nd year for students with top grades in Maths and FM, so without FM she would not be unduly disadvantaged for 1st year entry (assuming top grades in her chosen subjects). Also, as well as G100 (standard maths BSc) she could consider G102 (Maths within Arts Faculty resulting in an MA), which might be appealing if she has a broader range of A level subjects. It would be a shame to miss out on one of her favourite subjects at Alevel if she is still undecided about degrees.

Thanks. I'll have a look at that suggestion. There seem to be some joint honours in the two subjects that don't require FM.

If you want to study maths why would you not choose to take as much maths as possible whether you need it or not?

Unfortunately she loves some subjects equally and it is not yet clear where she will end up. Maybe I should start a new thread and see if you can help out with ideas? She is a conundrum.

I think the Telegraph's article is quite misleading. Imperial are viewed positively for increasing their percentage of state school applicants from 62.2 to 62.7 where as Queens Belfast are criticised for dropping to 97.5%

It's not "unfortunate" to love more than 1 subject :-)

Start that new thread Littleham, it sounds interesting.

OK. It will probably make us easy to identify, but I think she needs some sound advice before she finalises her choices.

I think you can reach a point when you have to jump one way or the other though. When I was 16 I loved science and English lit. I knew that for many science careers especially the one I ended up in I had to drop the English and jump for sciences/ maths. Doing a bit of both would have closed more doors than it opened.

True to an extent, but HE in the UK isn't the only option. You can be a generalist for longer in many other systems. Personally I could have happily studied nothing but maths from about 12, but I'm not convinced early specialisation is a universal good. Great for some, but surely it's OK for 15/16yr olds to still want to keep their options open?

I agree that Oxbridge / Durham / Bristol aren't everything (Exeter not really in that league, tbh) but I would be wary of letting your daughter drop too far below her 'level' in her choice of university. I was bright enough for a top RG university, but had to go to a 'lesser' institution because of getting pregnant personal circumstances. I found that I didn't have much in common with my course mates - sorry to sound like an intellectual snob, but I was quite a bit brighter than them and found them shallow. I only really made friends with mature students - people who, like me, were sort of stuck with their local university even though they could have done well at a higher ranked institution.

Peer group is hugely important Drama, it isn't a snob thing at all, it's about being comfortable and being able to make friends.

She should choose the uni / course she thinks she will enjoy most. Eldest DC was not at all interested in Oxford, Cambridge or most RG unis. Just finishing a great course at a non RG uni that offered AAA (exceeded the offer) and has had a brilliant time.

Of course she should notquiteruralbliss. People who don't fancy Oxbridge or Durham or Bristol don't need their parents to be defensive on an internet forum about why they haven't applied or got in - that appears to be the 'Mumsnet thing' more than anything else. These places aren't everyone's cup of tea and that's fine. But all these posts seem to be prefaced with how many A*s the DC has. I'd have thought the more important thing was that the DC appears to have developed independence of mind.

OP I've stupidly only just clocked that your DD intends to read History. I expect she's done her firming and insuring by now and it didn't sound like she had any intention of insuring with Durham but if she is still making her mind up do be aware that the History department at Durham doesn't consider insurees who've missed their grades. So it would be a huge waste of a choice.

What makes you think she is going to miss her grades ? Have you not "clocked " her predicted grades ?

busymummy3 an insurance choice, by very clear definition, is for those who miss their grades for their firm choice. Your response is quite rude.

At your prompt busymummy3 I've now looked back at your OP and have "clocked" that your DD's predicted grades are 2 A and an A. Slightly surprised that she's not predicted at least 3 A after 12 A (my 12 A DS was predicted 5 A, as was the other student in his year who achieved 12 A ) (and both already had an A2 A under their belt), but so be it. Obviously, she should easily achieve her AAA offer for her preferred choice. But your post on the face of it seems to be genuinely enquiring as to whether she should be insuring with Durham (at AAA), on grounds of perceived prestige, on the only explicable basis of something going unexpectedly wrong and her failing to achieve AAA. In which case my warning would be relevant: the Durham History department does not consider those who insure with them who have missed their grades; it would be a wasted choice.

What is it with these s?! That should read: as was the other student in his year who achieved 12 A (and both already had an A2 A* under their belt)

Molio maybe I phrased it wrong but it irritates me that there is an assumption that DCs who can get get A*s are somehow 'wasted' at non RG unis.

And yes,as the DC is the person who is going to have to spend 3 years at a university (and borrow a scary amount of money to do so), they absolutely need to choose the course and university that THEY are happy with (which may not be the one that their parents would have chosen).

Jeez! The pair of them has 12 GCSE A stars and each already had an A Level A star and both were predicted five more A Level A stars. This bold this is heavy going.... Anyhow, basically, 12 A stars at GCSE should herald straight A stars at A2. Exhausting.