Scottish Independence: university selection
Polonium · 05/09/2014 10:21
If you don't live in Scotland, are you (or is your child) still including Scottish universities in your UCAS selections?
Needmoresleep · 05/09/2014 14:21
Presumably Scottish Universities become more attractive for English as the Scots will no longer be able to 'discriminate' by charging them higher fees than other EU citizens.
Though in practice what I assume will happen is that Scotland will raise their fees to English levels.
2rebecca · 05/09/2014 15:32
If your child wants to do engineering particularly in the oil sector then I think you'd be a bit daft to ignore scottish universities as the industry links are excellent. I live here and don't see why independence would make Scotland less favourable for undergraduate students.
Polonium · 05/09/2014 16:03
Well there might be quite a bit of anti-English sentiment in the event of a no vote.
And in the event of a yes vote there will be upheaval. And inevitable change. Uncertainly re research funding. Will English students still receive funding to attend? (Because Scotland may no longer be in the EU.) Will there be fewer rest-of-the-UK applicants while they wait to see what happens? And will this mean a loss of reputation? Might international academics leave?
If Scotland is a foreign country, and not in the EU, it may also make it impossible for students to work.
Polonium · 06/09/2014 10:34
There is already a fair bit if anti English sentiment bubbling over in Scotland.
Polonium · 06/09/2014 10:35
2rebecca · 06/09/2014 10:47
It maybe depends on the area you work in. I have an English accent and have lived here for over 20 years and not had any problems.
Polonium · 06/09/2014 10:55
2rebecca - that's good to hear.
AllMimsyWereTheBorogoves · 06/09/2014 11:44
I know the thread is about students from England, Wales and NI going to university in Scotland after independence, but there are some interesting questions about what would happen to Scottish students who wanted to study in the UK.
If Scotland becomes an independent country and isn't in the EU, surely they would be allowed into the European Economic Area or something like that so that their students would be treated as equivalent to the EU for fee purposes? I believe this is what happens with Swiss and Norwegian nationals so they don't get treated as overseas students. It makes an enormous difference to the fees.
Also, would Scottish migrants to the UK be allowed to work or would they be subject to immigration controls? Common sense suggests they would have to be treated as a special case unless there are border guards posted all along the frontier. I don't know whether UK immigration rules before both Ireland and the UK were in the EU made exemptions for Irish nationals, given how easy it is to move been NI and the Republic, but I assume so. It would have to be the same as that, surely?
As for the point about English students not being able to get jobs in Scotland because Scotland isn't in the EU, I don't follow that. Surely the problem is the other way round unless exemptions are made, as I said above? Scotland would make its own immigration rules without reference to anyone else, although given the fluid border with England, I imagine the UK government would apply considerable pressure to make sure there were some controls.
Classicsgirl · 08/09/2014 14:12
Does anyone know if English students would still get student loans if they went to university in an independent Scotland? My DD is thinking of applying to edinburgh this year; we're english and I can (just about) stomach having to pay more than any other EU national, because all the other universities we're thinking of cost the same, but it wouldn't be a possibility if she couldn't get a student loan. Does anyone know what the position is?
MillyMollyMama · 08/09/2014 19:07
Ask Alex Salmond!! It is another great unknown.
antimatter · 08/09/2014 19:58
Wouldn't Yes vote mean it will happen in say 24/36 months not the next day?
AuntieStella · 08/09/2014 20:05
The short answer is that we don't know.
If Scotland joins EU, then British students must be allowed to study there on 'home student' terms (so cannot be charged fees), but just like any other student opting to study overseas the British government will not provide loans. So a very attractive option if you can afford living costs.
If not EU (or during candidacy period) then I suppose Scotland coukd choose to a) continue as now, b) move to EU system early to show congruence or c) set new overseas students fees to apply to all.
Immigration controls would need to be out in place if Scotland joins EU and cannot negotiate an (unprecedented) opt-out to Schengen.
Classicsgirl · 08/09/2014 20:19
It's a bit worrying when she's looking at a five year course (with year abroad) which would take her to 2020....we'll have to think quite hard before applying if there is a yes vote. Maybe then the fog will lift...but maybe not!
AuntieStella · 08/09/2014 20:32
If part way through a course, one precedent is that you continue with the T&Cs you started on, all the way to the end of the course.
Polonium · 09/09/2014 08:34
We will at last have an answer by the time the UCAS forms go off. But in the event of a no vote, I can't actually see thus issue going away.
I'm so sad for Scotland, sad for the rest of the UK feeling jilted, sad for the union.
Polonium · 09/09/2014 08:34
This not thus
b00se777 · 16/09/2014 10:27
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Needmoresleep · 17/09/2014 10:20
Some inevitable bias but an indication that academics are concerned about losing revenues from the fees paid by English students.
My assumption is that Scotland would not be able to offer fee free places to English students as well as EU ones, and the unavailability of student loans would act as a deterrent. I assume instead Scottish Universities would need to expand the number of non-EU international places.
Molio · 17/09/2014 22:19
DS has Edinburgh on his form and is due to submit tomorrow, but we've talked about what seems to be a real possibility of no student loans if the vote is Yes, in which case he'll switch that choice to an English uni.
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