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Higher education

Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

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Original poster

Admissions Tutors (Oxbridge/RG) - Please be honest...

50 replies

RussellGroup · 28/01/2011 11:26

How do you view applications from children with non-physical disabilities (eg Aspergers, Dyslexia, etc)?

We are concerned about our child at the moment, and think that they have a condition that is traditionally considered a disability but are worried that steps taken towards diagnosis will go on their record, and be viewed negatively by admissions tutors to university.

Do you select purely on academic ability?

OP posts:

BoffinMum · 31/01/2011 17:34

Checkmate, a lot of Cambridge people have links with Boston, actually, and shuttle backwards and forwards.

WRT extra-curricular skills, I'd be a lot happier if the UK hadn't strangled its instrumental music teaching provision in 1997, etc. At the moment you need a fair bit of disposable income to access anything worth doing. For the other it's Guitar Hero (another MIT invention)

Acinonyx · 31/01/2011 17:41

I don't think otherwise academically able students should be penalised because they are not strong in music or sports.

There is a certain type of family that insists their dc do everything to the highest possible standard - no complaining and no dabbling allowed. The Ivy League is welcome to them.

Having extra-curricular interests is fine - but Ivy League colleges expect students to really excel in those other areas. Fine again if that is the student's natural inclination. But that's a lot of pressure on kids being groomed for Harvard.

MotherMountainGoat · 31/01/2011 17:45

My cousin's son was statemented for Asperger's at the age of 6 and had no problems getting a place at a top-five RG uni. He IS studying something very geeky and scientific, though, and so I imagine he's not the only Aspie in his year...

TheCoalitionNeedsYou · 31/01/2011 17:51

BoffinMum/Checkmate - Have you seen this?

Acinonyx · 31/01/2011 17:56

I've read that before - very true: cheap slave labour indeed.

Checkmate · 31/01/2011 18:16

Interesting Coalition.

I agree with it regarding oversupply of PhD's in humanities.

In sciences, I strongly disagree. Although there are not enough Professorships for every PhD or post doc, there are plenty of companies that need their higher-level research skills.. My observation is that the world is becoming increasingly specialised, I couldn't do what I do without a PhD and post doc experience. They were my (poorly paid) training ground.

I also agree with the article about the quality of the learning experience for some PhDs (and the quality of the people they let on them.) Getting PhD's who can think for themselves about quality research, and have the drive and determination to succeed, now that is difficult at the moment for companies in the UK. Here's an example, DH (we work together, I'm on maternity leave at the moment) interviewed a stats PhD from Cambridge yesterday, who couldn't define mean/mode/median! Arrrrrrgh!

And the foreign PhD's don't want to come to the UK right now because of the high tax rates. Nightmare.

Checkmate · 31/01/2011 18:24

Acinonyx
One of my side-lines is interviewing UK applicants for my Alma Mater. I want to reassure you that they are certainly not looking for a spoon-fed young person from a family where its been insisted they do everything to the highest possible standard. We are looking for self-starters, "leaders of the future" (hate that phrase personally) who have taken on something (pretty much anything, though a Varsity sport always gets extra points of course!) and done that one thing to a very high level. So grade 8 at a musical instrument. Or county level at a popular sport. Or national level at a niche sport. As well as top academics and an indication that the drive comes from the child, not their family.

As a comp-educated kid from a council estate, my drive to succeed in a very niche sport is what swung it for me.

BoffinMum · 31/01/2011 18:38

Checkmate. Not only could I define them but I could also use them properly, and I am currently available for hire to the highest bidder with perks including free parking, free coffee and an enlightened attitude towards flexible working when necessary.

schmee · 31/01/2011 18:46

RussellGroup - I can understand that you want to make sure you don't jeopardise your child's university entrance, but I assume this is a fairly minor consideration when deciding whether to go for diagnosis or not.

Acinonyx · 31/01/2011 19:15

I do think that the PhD system in the US provides better training - but it's 2 years longer than here. We'd need to revise our funding and teaching. There is some movement in that direction with the 3 + 1 funding schemes.

Acinonyx · 31/01/2011 19:19

But why should it, Checkmate? Why should success in, say badminton, swing you a place at Harvard to study history?

Bonsoir · 31/01/2011 19:54

Acinonyx - because being a star at anything requires huge commitment, drive and sense of competition, which all contribute hugely to professional success. Sports at a high level teach teamwork and negotiation skills.

TheCoalitionNeedsYou · 31/01/2011 20:08

Checkmate - I think one of the interesting things us how badly students and universities interests are aligned.

BoffinMum · 31/01/2011 21:02

The main requirement for an academic as I see it is being able to sit still for an awfully long time reading things other people get scared of. And occasionally dominating other people.

funnyperson · 31/01/2011 22:39

Academics also need to have the ability to synthesise information and complete and write up their research as well as collaborate in teams if they are scientists.
All that takes character. Plus keeping going when others have lost interest.
I'm a bit worried that there is a trend that anyone really academic is said to have Asperger's syndrome. Its not so. There are some genuinely bright people around who absorb stuff like a sponge and have phenomenal curiosity and are interested in all sorts of things. Some people I know can knock off scientific papers at the drop of a hat and they dont have Asperger's syndrome.
I have a theory that Indian Brahmins have Asperger's and thats why the caste system evolved so they could pursue intellectual activities without having to worry about the material stuff or having to party or trade or fight like the rest of the population. There is a very important essential place in society for the academic in my view.

funnyperson · 31/01/2011 22:51

I like it when really good academics train up their juniors to have that eye for detail and focus and perseverance which leads to excellent science. They pass on that permission to make one aspect of a specialist field one's life work. I don't have that gift as I am too much of a dilletante.

I think the American notion of promoting excellence in a non academic area in candidates is a good one because it encourages students to be more rounded, perhaps helps to equip them for life, not just for academe.

OP I think a diagnosis is a two edged sword. On the one hand it helps both the student and those around to understand and pre empt difficulties, hence avoiding co morbidities such as anxiety or depression. On the other hand labels might come in the way of treating people as the individuals they are.

Sorry for the long post.

Original poster

RussellGroup · 31/01/2011 23:31

Thank you funnyperson- you see another of our dilemmas.

I think this thread has reassured me that they will not suffer in university selection.

OP posts:

Checkmate · 01/02/2011 10:37

Boffinmum -

we can afford to outbid anyone, and not only is there free parking and free coffee, but lunch is included!

If I could persuade them on flexible working then I'd be returning to work myself, sigh.

Checkmate · 01/02/2011 10:42

Russellgroup - I'm not involved with UK applications, but for US ones it wouldn't go against an applicant. For Princeton, you're unlikely to get in without an ASD dignosis

Looking forward to continuing this discussion in some future thread, Bonsoir, Boffin, Acinonyx etc..

BoffinMum · 01/02/2011 11:32

Checkmate
Email me at boffinmum dot hotmail dot co dot uk and tell me what you are in the market for, and I will see if I can offer it.

funnyperson · 01/02/2011 13:13

Checkmate- do you mean a Princeton /Boston/Harvard thread?

Checkmate · 01/02/2011 17:31

Hi Boff, I sent you a private message on mnet, so check your inbox.

funnyperson - didn't really mean anything very specific, just that I suspect this kind of issue will be one that is debated a lot on mnet. if you start a thread with that title, I'll be there!

BoffinMum · 01/02/2011 21:38

Thanks for message, Checkmate. I will have a good think about that, although I am not sure I necessarily have the right background for them right now.

Checkmate · 01/02/2011 22:57

You're welcome. Bear us in mind if you come across anyone.

Mac57 · 02/02/2011 10:15

Need advice re a personal statement for 6th form application. Am stuck in the wilds of south west France and have no one here to ask! Anyone any experience of what a "good one" looks like?

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