Age 4 maths

[Covidworries]

My 4.5 yr old loves numbers. Is due to start school in sept.
Can count past a 100 in 1, 2, 5 and 10s and knows times tables 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 and 10s
Can easily add and subtract in their head 2 didget numbers. Including explaining answer. (17 + 20, 42 + 8, 1+2+3+4, 1+2+3+4+5+6+7+8+9+10-5)
Understands some basic divison divide by 2 and divide by 3 etc.

We dont push it is purely child led and child just comes out with math facts and loves being asked random questions.
Lockdown i think inspired this as saw sone of maths stuff older sibling was doing.

Some family are worried they will be bored in reception class and that school need to be made away. Im very consious that i dont want to look like one of those mums. Elder sibling has a lot of health issues and really struggles in school.

Wow that really does seem advanced for their age… my dd is a bit younger (only juts turned 4) but is starting reception this year and is nowhere near this level…. And I thought she was doing well at maths!! So I suspect your child might be a bit bored at first with more simple maths tasks but I personally would wait for it to present itself. The teacher will notice I’m sure. A massive part of their job in those first weeks is getting to know what level all the children are starting from. Plus it will all be play-based in reception so hopefully it will still engage your little one.

Yes I think your child might be bored in maths.

Mine is the same age, can count to 200, in 1s and 2s and knows his 10 times table and is considered advanced in his class.

I'd maybe give the teacher a heads up they are really into maths

How is your child socially? My DDs were both the same academically, especially in maths. They are both autistic.

My dc was similar but when they started school catching up on all the other skills such as who's friends with who and how to go to the loo all by myself etc slowed
them down a lot. I wouldn't worry. They have lots of other subjects to enjoy anyway.

@OneRingToRuleThemAll

How is your child socially? My DDs were both the same academically, especially in maths. They are both autistic.

I’m a early years teacher, nursery and reception and this would be my first thought too. We get one or two children each cohort who are exceptional with number, it is very unusual for them to be both exceptional at number and solid in social and emotional development. If fact one of the common phrases when raising concerns about children who may be on the spectrum is “they are good with number”. Does he show interest in other children, imaginative role play etc? Is he able to cope with change and tolerate delay? Is he able to follow an activity that is not if his choosing (adult directed within a group). What is his language like? Is he able to use tone, pace and pitch appropriately to add meaning and interest? If there are concerns your child’s teachers will allow your child to follow his interests but focus more strongly on addressing his needs to give him a more balanced profile. If not then they are likely to send him up to yr1 to do maths with them there.

I wouldnt worry about him being bored by maths. It's only about 20 mins of their day and in reception its more about playing to learn anyway. It sounds like he's good at memory though, it might be that he needs to work on concrete representation of numbers.

We wonder about autism. His eldest teenage sibling has just been diagnosed and a primary sibling has been through assessment due to extreme anxiety but was insufficient evidence.
Socially he plays well with other children at nursery, he doesnt like to leave me but os happy once there. Very stubborn at home, likes being at home so doesnt like to leave house in mornings.
Plays very independently. Loves trains and will spend hours making tracks around the home. He likes to organise things into colours and groups. Good at turn taking (but primary sibling is not so has immense patience and understanding).

Im not too concerned as I feel he will be pretty happy playing at reception and doing all the different tasks. He plays with maths stuff at home we have numicon ,multilinks, deines, scalea etc lots of workbooks that he loves to use at the moment (all got to try and help primary sibling who finds maths extrememly difficult and despite private tutor amd lots of time spent is still struggling with work.

You son surely seems to have a love of math! If he hasn’t learned math systematically there are probably gaps that need filling in. He won’t be bored in reception as it’s play based anyway and his teacher should help him work on mastery of concepts he’s familiar with.

My daughter was at a similar level during her last year at preschool. She went to a pretty academic preschool which did extension work with her on topics like:

1. Properties of 3D shapes
2. Two step math problems
3. Word problems
4. Measuring capacity / temp / volume / time
5. Writing various number sentences
6. Understanding addition and subtraction through number bonds to 20 to facilitate solving problems like: 13 + ? = 19

A good reception teacher should ideally be able to plan similar for your son even if he is good with sums.

Also as others have said, concrete representation work helps really embed mathematical concepts he is already familiar with.

I wouldn’t say anything unless there a problem. It really puts teachers backs up. Also, how he performs at home with your support might be different to how he performs at school so don’t expect he’ll demonstrate the exact same ability with them.

If he doesn’t know how to read and write there will be plenty to challenge him.

Also, in school a lot of the Maths work are problems, presented in sentences, and problem solving. It's not just 25+2 or counting up in tens.

So reading/problem solving are essential. It will be a new way for him to learn, it might take a bit of adjustment. DS1 was (and still is) very good in maths, but the ability he could demonstrate at home wasn't really demonstrated at school until he was in year 3 because he has a speech and language disorder. The school (and we) focused more on social skills in the early school years. He is now in y9 in state school and is still excelling in maths and coding/computing, but also has ok social skills and is good in every school subject.

The early school years should focus on skills such as patience, learning to wait for your turn, respecting other children, playing with other kids, listening to others and to the teacher, and other personal skills such as organising your stuff, not loosing thing, being independent in their learning, etc.

This really worries me as my son is about to start nursery, he has just turned 3 so a year younger than yours and able to count past 1000 plus all the additions, subtractions and some times tables. If Your son will be bored a year above it concerns me a lot about mine!!!!

I have a DC who is just about to finish reception and to be honest they have not even tried to challenge him. They have offered him some differentiated work but this is along the lines of if the class are learning to make 6, he will be asked to make 12... This is a child who just suddenly works out the 12 x table as they are out for a walk. Who is happy adding and subtracting 3 digit numbers in his head (He likes being the banker in Monopoly) and picked up a book on division and was able to divide by 6 straight away. (all child led and just random examples from this week!). During home learning we sent in videos of what he was doing to give the teachers an idea of where he was at, but the level they do in class doesn't reflect this.

We have not worried too much as it has been far more valuable for him to build on his (somewhat limited) social skills and build good relationships in the classroom. (We also have some thoughts about ASD - lots of sensory issues and the like) so we are please that he seems to be getting on well in other areas.

I am concerned though about how the school are going to manage as he moves up the school - his older sibling is working above age related in year 2 and he is easily exceeding her.

My DS has an affinity for maths so at Primary school his teachers always set more difficult tasks for him and by the time he was in year 6 they were giving him GCSE maths to get on with so the others could learn what they needed to.

They also got him to help some of the others out which cleverly helped him and them in different ways.
Most Primary Schools have a gifted and talented scheme that's run by a kind teacher just to make sure they are reaching their potential.
DS is now at Secondary School and still finds Maths a doddle as well as the Sciences. His brain is just hard wired that way.

DD isnt bad at maths at all and is still in the top set but nowhere near in his league. She does have to work at it whereas he can just magically understand it and do it all.

DS never got bored in Primary School as there was so much else to keep him interested. He also didn't distract the others as he was given extra work to occupy him which he loved.

I never discussed with anyone that he was in the G&T group but the DC would go home and tell their parents how good he was.
He went to a very decent State School which was very kind and nurturing and all the DC who went there fullfilled their potential.

You're quite likely to be disappointed by school provision.
If so, you can advocate for suitable provision in school and/or make appropriate provision outside school.

1. advocacy:
   Developing math talent is a good starting point for information.
   So also is hoagies

2. outside school provision:
   If the school won't provide work at an appropriate level , then maths-whizz and
   conquermaths both cover the full UK curriculum (to Y8 and A level respectively).

Beast academy is a curriculum designed for mathematically able kids. It is US-based and does not align exactly with UK curriculum, but is generally broader, deeper and more challenging. It's best to cover up to at least year 2 UK curriculum before starting it.

The dragonbox apps are also very good.

The new EYFS curriculum only goes into numbers to 10 and solving mastery problems with this. Your child is going to be way past these so I’d start advocating now for them to be identified as gifted and talented and potentially to join year 1 for maths.

My child has just finished reception and is about this level now & has definitely found the class work too easy. However the school recognised this almost immediately without me saying anything and arranged for her and another child who is a similar level to have a weekly extension session with a TA. It’s not much in the context of a week of everything else being too easy but I really appreciate that they are catering to their needs & in a busy state school it’s probably the best we could hope for. The school also recommended the nrich maths website for home learning. Good luck!

Not sure if OP is still watching this thread, but wondered how your child is getting on at school?

My daughter is in Year 5 at a state school and is 3-4 years ahead in maths and 1-2 years ahead in English. The school aren't great at differentiating her but it's understandable as she's into secondary school material in maths.

We know she works at that level in maths because we've found her a tutor who stretches and challenges her at home. Obviously she finds maths simple at school but she seems to be ok as she still learns in other subjects.

But yes, she was extremely bored in reception, not only because of maths but to have proper conversations with her classmates was non existent! Things got slightly better in year 3/4... but I heard many kids were struggling for different reasons and felt that learning to cope with struggles was part of life

Not sure if this post has made you feel any better (probably not, sorry!) but she's much happier now that her friends have matured and she's doing sports and learning a musical instrument.

@bulbouscat

Hi, sorry only just seen your message. He loves reception class. They picked up on his maths knowledge themselves in first few weeks. He is taught Maths separately to his class and everything else with his class. so all going well so far.

Would love an update on this.

Just started reception and in the same boat with a son who seems to be very gifted at maths (and very likely to be on the spectrum in some way).