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Gifted and talented

Talk to other parents about parenting a gifted child on this forum.

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Original poster

Gifted toddler... But!

51 replies

TabithaTwitchEye · 10/09/2015 20:07

My DD is three at the very end of October. She's "gifted" (in the traditional sense). However, she refuses to potty train. She absolutely, categorically have none of it.

Has anyone experienced this?! We've stopped again because she will just hold it in (I'm talking 8:30 am til 4:30pm - poor girl must be in agony, but she will not wee on the potty or toilet!)

OP posts:

howabout · 11/09/2015 16:40

Loads of parent made potty training youtube videos. Will cheer you up if nothing else and may help.

Iwantakitchen · 11/09/2015 16:57

How is her physical development in general? What age did she sit on her own, crawl, walk? Some children take longer than others to 'feel' the muscles in their bodies. ds was potty trained at 4 and we found out at 5 that he has mild dyspraxia. He also has a speech disorder (verbal dyspraxia) but he is G&T in maths. Said his first word at 3. He was nowhere near as gifted as your daughter, reading at 2 though. Did she learn by herself?

AGirlCalledJohnny · 12/09/2015 04:00

Maybe she's just as "traditional" in the potty training area, and just isn't ready yet? Chill, start again in a few weeks. I'd love to say my kids just ripped off their nappies one day and we were away, but there were many false starts. It's genuinely not a big deal in the grand scheme

catkind · 12/09/2015 13:48

I dunno, could be related - I'm sure half the reason my 3yo is ahead on academics is sheer stubbornness. Wants to get it right and will not stop until she does. Same thing could work against you for PT.

I think the same advice applies as for any child though - offer opportunities, take off the pressure and be patient.

When you say she won't wee on the potty - is that won't, or can't? Being able to deliberately release is a different skill from holding in. First step may be just encouraging her to have a sit on the potty/toilet, so she feels comfortable and relaxed with that, no pressure to perform. Normally the first pees on the potty happen more by accident, then they learn to recognise the feeling and do it on purpose. That bit could be harder because she is so good at holding. You could if you wanted try rewarding for just sitting - whether that's a choc button (I know I know...) or reading a story or watching a bit of youtube or just praise.

One friend did get over that hurdle by feeding them loads of squash and sitting them on the potty in front of a DVD until nature took its course!

But generally when she decides she wants to do it, it all becomes massively easier.

Lonecatwithkitten · 12/09/2015 20:34

My DD was similar for potty training, what worked to tell her nappies no longer fitted her bottom so she had three choices

Potty
Toilet
Wet her knickers.

Being a smart girl she choose a combination of options 1. And 2. You have to 100% committed and the child has to believe you are 100% committed.

Blipbip · 12/09/2015 20:48

There may not be a link between giftedness and late potty training but there is a link with giftedness and asynchronous development.

Are you sure she is ready? Is she reaching all her other age related targets?

DS is gifted but refused to PT train till well over three, he was just not ready.

sanfairyanne · 12/09/2015 21:19

Really? All mine are gifted, potty trained early and also talented at sports. Preen.

AGirlCalledJohnny · 13/09/2015 05:23

That's the G&T trifecta right there san

sanfairyanne · 13/09/2015 08:21

BoffinMum · 13/09/2015 09:47

Well I am gifted by any standards and I distinctly remember not being 100% reliably toilet trained when I was 3.5. There was also one memorable moment at the time I read 'Molloy/Malone Dies/The Unameable' by Beckett and simultaneously wet my pants because I was trying to work out what the hell the story was about and couldn't be bothered to go (I had expected a story about the real Molly Malone from Dublin's Fair City as in the song - OH the disappointment!) I did play lacrosse for the school, however, and I have grade 8 in two instruments. Perhaps that redeems me I only wet myself very occasionally whilst trampolining now, so I have come a long way

Iwantakitchen · 13/09/2015 17:36

I know I am rambling on a bit but there is this 'category' of children (it's a loose definition, relatively new and still to be researched) of childre who are gifted but are late in developing some areas. I started researching this when DS was little and had a speech delay but showed exceptional understanding of shapes, puzzles, space awareness, numbers but no was non verbal. He said his first word at 3 and didn't speak in sentences before 4 and a half. He is now Gt in maths (8 years old). There is a very interesting book called (I don't like the title) The Einstein Syndrome: Bright Children Who Talk Late. And other theories, such as e one in the link below. It makes interesting reading, but I as with any other research I take it with a pinch of salt. In that category, there is also one common trait that many of those children will be late at potty training. This was certainly the case with Ds.

www.potentialplusuk.org/file_upload/factsheets/447P65%20Late%20Speech%20and%20Gifted%20Children.pdf

KaraokeQueenOfTheNorth · 13/09/2015 17:41

She's 2. She is not potty training because she isn't ready. She is too young. I wouldn't even be trying if she is refusing.

I'm not convinced being able to read should mean potty training early!

SofiaAmes · 13/09/2015 17:53

Both my dc's are gifted and there are mechanical things that they never did on time, or still cannot do (ds is 14 and still ties his shoes like a 3 year old). My experience is that gifted kids often don't do developmental things "on schedule"...probably because their brains are wired differently. Having said all of that, your dd isn't so old that it's panic time for not being potty trained. Someone suggested further up that you ask her about it. This may be effective depending on the child....just make sure it's a non-judgmental conversation. My dd was speaking in full sentences at 12 months (didn't stop having wee accidents until 7 or 8) and if asked could have described at 2 or 3 why she didn't want to go to the toilet (accidents mostly happened because she was busy doing something interesting and didn't want to stop). She was quite late in several developmental markers, but now that she's older (12) it's quite clear that the reason was that she won't do something in public until she's completely confident about it. For example, she didn't walk until 19 months, but when she did get up and walk...she never fell, didn't toddle, just walked like a much older child.

gatorgolf · 13/09/2015 21:40

My DS is quite bright and was a late potty trainer. With him I think it's a case of because alot of things come easy to him if there is something that he finds a bit difficult he just won't even try. We'd tried and given up with potty training a few times and he was 3.2 and about to start a nursery that really liked them to be potty trained. He had a thing about Wearing pants so I just put him in shorts no pants for a start. He was really reluctant to even sit on the potty and I got a bit cross with him, I suppose it could have made things better or worse but I made him sit on the potty and he ended up doing a wee on it and it seemed to be a turning point in that he then thought he could do it. That was a Thursday by the Monday he went all day with no accidents and was dry at night very soon after.

SofiaAmes · 14/09/2015 01:57

gator...that's sort of how my dc's childminder potty trained them. She kept them in underwear all day (less clothing to deal with) and put them on the toilet (no reducer or potty) every 20 minutes and eventually one of those times they would pee and get the hang of it. Both of them were daytime potty trained within 3 days (and I didn't have to do anything at all!). Little trick a friend taught me, if your child is potty trained and it's early days still, carry a pull up with you and if you are somewhere where there is no access to a toilet, you can put on the pull up and have them pee into it, so they kind of still keep the rhythm going.

SofiaAmes · 14/09/2015 01:58

Sorry, just realized that wasn't so well explained...I mean don't put on the pullup until they say they need to wee and then take it right off afterwards.

christinarossetti · 14/09/2015 02:44

My DD was like this until she was nearly 3.

One day she said that she wanted to use the potty and did. Carried on from there and rarely had accidents.

It was more to do with her personality ie that she doesn't like making mistakes than anything else.

PatrickPolarBear · 14/09/2015 03:25

Could be if she is very bright, as you say, she is also perfectionist and self-conscious. So for her the nappy is a way of avoiding making a mistake. If she sets herself to high standards, she may just be finding the idea of having an accident scary and will wait until she is confidently in control to start using the toilet. She may be scared of failure if thus far she has been exceptional at everything.

With a child who is bright and self aware the usual tricks like chocolate button rewards or sticker charts aren't going to work. They see through all that. You'll probably just have to wait until she's good and ready.

BertrandRussell · 14/09/2015 06:35

Please don't overthink. Just wait til she's ready. It's not a big deal.

HeteronormativeHaybales · 14/09/2015 06:47

Boffin I love you.

2 (bright and able - 'gifted', meh) boys here who were not out of day nappies until three and a half. Gave them a (gentle!) push in right direction and we were out of them within a few days, very few accidents. I would say she is simply not ready.

(My mother claims I started reading at 20 months. I am your typical Ms Overachiever but I think my boys are happier than I was at their age. Go with your daughter's interests and enjoy her quick mind but don't expect turbo-development in all areas)

Strawberrybubblegum · 14/09/2015 17:03

Your DD clearly has an exceptional mind, so I think you're right to consider that what works for most children might not work for her.

My DD (who is only gifted in the 'every parent thinks their PFB is gifted' way described above) has quite a determined streak, which is probably also common in 'properly' gifted children . I found that the usual advice to put them on the potty periodically absolutely didn't work with my DD. Backing right off and letting her own it herself was the only way to do it. We have terrible problems with food (also a control thing) and when I tried to get her to sit on the potty when she'd said she didn't need to, I could see the same behaviour starting.

Given that it's become an issue, I wonder whether your best option would be to stop for a while and let the pressure go - even though stopping and starting isn't great.

Has your DD read any potty training books? My DD liked the Pirate Pete one, and one day she put on her backpack and declared that we were going to the shop to buy a potty Would that book be too simple for your DD to enjoy, or might she enjoy reading it herself? That might start the 'owning it' process. There's a matching princess polly one, if that's more likely to appeal.

Totally agree with the suggestion to let her decide when to do it. A friend once told me that if you can wait until they're begging you to let them do it, that's about right.

Go on a shopping expedition where she can choose the potty and 'big girl pants'. Then when you get started, just ask her occasionally whether she needs to go, but totally let her decide.

We had no wees on the potty for the first day and a half, but then we got her onto it mid-wee one time (still in pants) and somehow that made it click, and no problems from that point forward. The friend who said to wait until they begged (and did just that) had no accidents at all with her DS.

Iamnotminterested · 06/11/2015 21:17

DD2 was a late walker and talker, wasn't out of nappies until she was 4 and still had a daytime sleep at 4 1/2 but has been selected for the year 7 Challenge Programme at her school.

unlimiteddilutingjuice · 15/11/2015 09:35

Can i just say- I stumbled on this thread by accident and as the mum of a non gifted, unpotty trained 3 yr old, this is the most reassuring thing Ive ever seen on the subject. Thanks guys

motheroreily · 15/11/2015 17:09

My daughter is 3.5 and stopped wearing nappies 3 months ago.

Before then refused to sit on a potty or toilet. She would put her legs straight So if I lifted her up I couldn't put her on the toilet. I tried going cold turkey she just wet herself and wasn't bothered at all. I tried rewards and she wasn't interested. I tried the potty and the toilet. She knew what a toilet was for but she just refused to try. Nothing worked. I rang the health visitor and she said don't worry yet give it another couple of months and try again.

I was convinced she'd never get there. Then one day she went to nursery and took her nappy off. She never wore a nappy since then (even at night she's dry) and she's maybe had 3 accidents in the past 3 months.

I know it's easy to say but don't despair she will get there. I don't think she's gifted (I'm not sure how you tell though!) but she is a perfectionist and stubborn and she just wanted to do it in her own way.

Naty1 · 16/11/2015 11:26

I think potty training problems are personality rather than inteligence.
Dd1 has only been nappy free since 3.4 (though partly im sure as i delayed it during pg with dc2 and first 3m of new baby as bf.)
She responded to the rewards in the end and has had lots of toy turtles etc.
We struggled mainly with poop withholding. So once she was able to poop in potty i just took nappy off and i think weve only had intentional accidents.
She has since been dry almost every night (12hr).
The older and more bright they are im sure they will realise that being potty trained will mean they have to stop what they are doing to go, which they may not want.

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