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Gifted and talented

Talk to other parents about parenting a gifted child on this forum.

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Original poster

Horrible conversation with other parent.(Need help!)

43 replies

user789653241 · 09/09/2015 22:09

Sorry I am so upset!

One of a parent approached me today and started conversation about how school teach maths.
She said that her dd can calculate in her head, so why she needs to learn all those methods to show working out.

I had same problem with my ds since reception, and tried really hard to explain to ds that he needs to do it.

I tried to explain to her that it is required especially on the tests, since they get points for working out. And teachers needs to know they understand the methods properly.(Are these the right reasons?)

She started to become very offensive and loud because I didn't agree that the system is stupid.

I can understand her frustration, but why take it out on me?

I 'm hoping that she would drop the subject, but if she continue, what should I say? Why do children need to show working out and it's not good enough to know the answer?

Please help, I am desperate.(I wish I could ignore her but her dd and my ds are in same class.

OP posts:

TheSecondOfHerName · 10/09/2015 07:12

DS2 is one of those children whose brain arrives at the answer so quickly that he is barely aware of how he got there. We have been encouraging him to record the working, even though he doesn't see the point. He is starting to get better at writing down the middle calculations between question and answer.

He got through to the Junior Olympiad last year, and the questions he struggled the most to answer were the proofs. I managed not to say "Well if you were in the habit of showing your working..."

var123 · 10/09/2015 08:19

Ds2 is also one of the children who works out faster than he can write down. It was an ongoing problem in primary school. He said that if he slowed to put down the workings, he forgot the answer.

In the end, he and I reached a compromise: he could write down the answer, but then he had to go back and write down the workings.

This approach also stopped him trying to prove he could do the work by completing all the worksheets (including the extension stuff) in a fraction of the allotted time. He still would finish early, but not as early, and the teacher could tick her sheet to say that he'd demonstrated 3 times and in 3 ways that he'd mastered x.

He still didn't really get access to a faster work flow until he had a better teacher when he reached year 6, but at least it stopped us all going around and around in circles.

var123 · 10/09/2015 08:25

I understand why the conversation was stressful! The other parent wanted validation for her feelings of irritation and frustration and she thought that if she spoke to the OP, she'd have someone who shared her feelings to vent about the system with.

However, the OP took the opposite side and tried to defend the school's approach whilst simultaneously feeling increasingly unhappy that she was having the conversation at all and that her stance was making the other parent even more upset.

Original poster

user789653241 · 10/09/2015 09:09

Thank you for understanding the situation, Var123.

Fatrascals, it was horrible because she came so close to me and she was almost spitting into my face!
Also it was done in front of other parents.(Although it was corner of playground.)
I just found it difficult to deal with people who slag school off openly in public.

I didn't see her this morning!
If I see her and she mentions it again, I will try PerspicaciaTick's answers.

Thank you everyone!

OP posts:

AGirlCalledJohnny · 12/09/2015 04:21

"I say that maths is like a recipe, you cant skip steps and expect someone else to follow your recipe. Its important that people can explsin the process clearly and that is just as important as the answer."

I can see why you are in the G&T section ohyoubadbadkitten. I've never heard a better description of the why fors! This has been a bone of contention over the last couple of years, and this will definitely appeal to my kid's lofty ambitions to teach his younger sister. It never ends well, but I now have a stock answer. Have all the wine and roses ma chere

mathanxiety · 12/09/2015 04:34

Maths isn't all about getting the answers right. That is arithmetic, which is what the children are doing now. Later, when mathematics kicks in it is the ability to reason, to understand order of operations, to combine many different operations, and to think coherently and at length in abstract terms that will come into play.

Those skills are not always predicted by children's ability to do arithmetic in their heads, incidentally.

But don't engage with her.
Just say 'Interesting. You should take it up with the teacher.'

OhYouBadBadKitten · 12/09/2015 18:00

that's kind AGirl, thank you. :)

AGirlCalledJohnny · 13/09/2015 05:15

You're welcome kitty! I now also owe mathanxiety some chocolates for actually getting 'me' to understand why it's so important. You're both marvelous.

Ah yes, they may get their smarts from DH, but the charm is all me

OhYouBadBadKitten · 13/09/2015 08:35

BoskyCat · 13/09/2015 08:50

This is not about the maths, but all about this women's need to have you kowtowing to her and agreeing with her because she is threatened by your son (via her DD). She is insecure and doesn't like the feeling that anyone could do better then her DD, so she wants to make sure she vicariously controls you. You didn't play along (why should you? - it's childish playground nonsense, plus you were right) and she wasn't expecting that so she got nasty.

I don't think what she had to say actually mattered, it was just anything she could think of that she hoped would have you going "Oh yes you're so right". In her mind, maybe she saw it as trying to make friends with you in a weird way ?? except it wouldn't be true friendship as she can't handle it if you disagree with her.

Therefore you can't win by being right, so just keep her at arm's length and rise above. Brush her off with "sorry we obviously disagree so let's leave it at that".

Original poster

user789653241 · 13/09/2015 10:40

Thank you BoskyCat.
Luckily, I haven't seen her since.
I will try not to have those conversation with her again.

OP posts:

Tyrannosaurus · 13/09/2015 10:49

It sounds like she was just trying to point out her DC is cleverer than the teacher, and expected you to nod and agree. Well done for standing up to her. I have the same problem with DS. He finds maths really easy now, but I worry about how he will cope as things get more complicated. Luckily the school are working hard to get him to slow down and show his working out, so hopefully it won't cause a problem.

mathanxiety · 13/09/2015 21:06

The G&T world can sometimes be a sort of an underground fight club.

Whoopee! Chocolates!!

var123 · 14/09/2015 12:11

I don't think the other mum was trying to start up a competition with the OP. She was just upset about something school-related and wanted support. The OP not only didn't give her sympathy but started arguing from the school's point of view, which made her even more upset.

Her mistake was assuming that the OP would be a kindred spirit when she should have sounded the OP first to find out if she would be the type to share her views and support her. Instead, the other mum just dived in.

I don't think you'll have to avoid her, OP. She'll stay clear of you now.

BoskyCat · 14/09/2015 12:13

But you don't have to share someone's views just because they want you to, when their views are wrong. Showing workings is important.

Original poster

user789653241 · 14/09/2015 12:47

After reading Var's comment, I feel some what bad about how I responded to her now. (If she was unhappy and just needed support.)

I didn't argue with her, I merely disagreed and said why I thought they have to show working out.

After that I just listened to her, trying to find a way to escape from the situation.

If the circumstance was different, we could have had more civilized conversation ? Maybe, or maybe not. I don't know.

This year is first year my ds and her dd is in same class, so I don't really know her well. But even if my personal opinion was similar to hers, I wouldn't express it in front of other parents in school playground.

School playground is a scary place...I hope she stay clear of me.

OP posts:

var123 · 14/09/2015 17:19

Sorry for making you feel bad, Irvine. Why did you think she came over to speak to you? Did you think she came over looking for an argument?

You were there, not me, so you will have a clearer idea of what she was trying to achieve. I was just imagining why I would go over to another parent and say those sort of things.

TBH Most parents I know are a little critical of the school for some reason or another. They don't say things within earshot of their children, but they do criticise privately, adult-to-adult. Maybe its just the school my dc went to that engendered those feelings...!

Original poster

user789653241 · 14/09/2015 17:55

Hi,Var. I don't know why she approached me suddenly, but it was before children came out, so they didn't see anything unpleasant.

Maybe she truly intended to befriend me since dc are in same class, and didn't think the topic was such a big deal.

Unfortunately, showing working out was one of biggest issue with my ds, so I couldn't just agree with her to be friendly.(And her comment was quite aggressive from start, " what's the point of learning this and that", etc.)

Ds's reception teacher was really great and helped us understand the importance of showing working out. Now I read comments from MNetter and I am even more convinced that this is really important skill.

I will try to be amicable with her, but I don't think we can be friends.

Thank you.

OP posts:

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