Vague concerns about DS age 5

[Blipbip]

DS is 5 and in reception. His teacher considers him to be gifted in reading and writing and probably maths too but they have only just started this in school. Teacher wants to have him assessed for an IEP (is that right, individual education plan?) she originally raised this with us in the winter term but though DH was keen I was less so and I still feel reluctant now.

The reason that I'm not sure if I want him assessed is that I'm worried about what else they may come up with. Since he was tiny his health visitor kept making hints that she thought there was something "unusual" about him. He was referred for speech therapy as he struggles with some sounds and has always been a slow/reluctant communicator and she started to make hints that he wouldn't engage and talk about the picture cards (he only wanted to talk about the numbers and words on the cards not about the pictures), she was muttering about poor eye contact etc when I lost my temper with her and left. The only health care professional who has been completely sensible about him is the only one who is actually qualified to make any judgements - his paediatrician - but she last saw him when he was a year old.

I'm worrying over nothing aren't I? This is just an assessment so that he can reach full potential in learning

You are correct about IEP being an individual education plan and that one of the outcomes hoped for is a plan to help him reach his potential. It would be a start to find out who would assess him, if it is by teachers then naturally they would not be able to diagnose a child. I am not sure as to why you would have concerns, a diagnosis of certain conditions is not easy to come and would need to be done by people suitably qualified/trained/experienced. After an assessment by a suitably qualified person is conducted and if such a conclusion is reached than support to benifit your child should be made accessible.

" The only health care professional who has been completely sensible about him is the only one who is actually qualified to make any judgements - his paediatrician - but she last saw him when he was a year old." This is a concerning statement as certain things cannot be ascertained in a 1 year old. Also, if you are worried about certain conditions, then eg a psychologist may well be suitably qualified and have better experience to reach certain conclusions.

I certainly know lots of children who at 5 loved their numbers. I also know many children to change their interests from the age of 5.

Sorry, typos...... "benefit" and "come by"

The suggestion is that he is assessed by the school SENCO and then referred for further assessment if indicated.
I have encountered too many people now who make subtle and not so subtle hints about him that I am really wairy of another not very professional hint. DS is unusual but appart from that I strongly feel that there is nothing fundamentally wrong with him.
His interests are more obsessions than interests, when he finds a topic interesting he will concentrate on it to the exclusion of everything else, even food and sleep if we let him which we don't.

A SENCO would be very unlikely to be able to diagnose aspergers/autism this would require input from either psychologist or doctor (and then those in the correct area). You can ask that your child not be referred for further assessment (state in writing what you agree to). Please do not worry about this being a stealth diagnosis, parental consent and action would be required for referral (unless if the child was seen at risk), often GP involvement. To get a diagnosis usually requires a lot of action on the part of a concerned parent that feels there is something not quite right..... it can in some cases be a very long drawn out and emotionally painful process where the outcome of a diagnosis is actually welcomed by the parent in the end.

Children can be very interested in certain things at the exclusion of other things. They can grow up very happy.

May I ask why you are concerned about a diagnosis of something like autism? Is it because you fear a mis-diagnosis? I don't think this is very likely as it takes a lot of effort to get any child diagnosed, as yoyo says.

Or, just speaking hypothetically only, if your DS really was autistic, would you still not want the diagnosis and associated support and adjustments?

Being offered an IEP at only 5 is quite unusual, even amongst G&T children. He must be very exceptional (in a good way).

I did say I feel a bit vague about it, ha. Thing is I know that pursuing an autism diagnosis is a long and drawn out process but I feel that a lot of unqualified people around DS keep hinting that this is what is 'wrong' with him. I feel that the problem is that they are faced with a little boy that they can't communicate with and they are blaming him. In reality as far as i know DS only has two traits that can be common in autistic people- he is obsessive and he can be reluctant to communicate - in every other way he is a very happy little boy with a lot of energy.
I don't know if he is exceptional, both my and DH's family has a lot of bright individuals, DS is probably above average by the standard of the family.

He must be exceptional, or the school would not suggest an IEP.

It takes an expert to diagnose autism. I wouldn't wish any such diagnosis on any child (or parent), but if its there, then IMO it is better to know and deal with it.

It must be annoying having people make pop diagnoses and then going onto to hint at it all the time. I can't see how you can make them stop though unless you are either able to tell them that an expert says they are wrong or your DS starts behaving in a more conformist way.

DS1 was diagnosed with a learning disability a couple of years ago - nothing as big as autism but it was enough to rattle him and me. So, i am not saying that its easy, because if there is something "wrong" then its not easy to come to terms with it. However, IME it is better to know and start making adjustments as early as possible, than to wait until things have reached a crisis point (which is what i did). In my case, i did not suspect a SEN, but I knew something wasn't right and I made every excuse under the sun to explain it away, really believing that it would all come good in time.

That is interesting Var. DS1 was diagnosed with dyslexia at the age of 8 but I knew long before then that he had a learning difficulty and fought hard for the school (a different school to DS2's) to recognise it. In DS1's case the diagnosis was important as it led to the extra help he needed.
In DS2's case he obviously does not have dyslexia. I struggle to see how a 'diagnosis' would help him as I don't see that he has a problem. The IEP would be great as he loves learning and he does need some direction, but he is only 5 so I don't see it as an urgent course of action.

Hi, my son's teacher suggested an assessment at roughly the same age. I was concerned as I didn't really understand why he needed one. It took a few straight questions before teacher admitted that she suspected aspergers: he had a full paediatric assessment and then another at a social communication clinic to test for ASD. If school is concerned they'll want a statement as soon as possible in order to qualify for extra funding. I know it is stressful but if there is something you need to know now. Good luck!

blipbip - do you think the teacher is pressing for an assessment because she suspects dyslexia or something on the autistic spectrum?

He's only 5. God, I'd have moved heaven and earth to protect my children when they were that small and vulnerable. I really understand where you are coming from.

You seem to have people hinting at autism to you right, left and centre (or maybe I am reading between the lines wrongly?). Maybe your son is on the spectrum and maybe he's not. A diagnosis won't change the fact of whether he has ASD or not. It would result in support for him though, and a better understanding, and tolerance from others, if his behaviour is unusual. However, if he is autistic/ has aspergers, then would you rather know or not know?

Whether he has ASD or he doesn't, he'll still be exactly the same child you have today.

What does your son's father say about it?

Yes people are hinting asd I think. Maybe I am tolerant to unusual behaviour but I don't think he is too odd, just quite individual. I wish that there was a wider range for normal rather than a need to diagnose abnormal in order to be tolerant or accepting if you see what I mean.
DS is very unconcerned about what others think, DH also doesn't really care its me who is being oversensitive I guess.
He is only 5 and atm I don't think he needs extra support, he is the sort of child who makes teachers look good. Maybe he will need more stimulation in the future and if the structure is in place now we won't have to jump through hoops later.. I'm going round in circles aren't I.

My thoughts, for what its worth are:-

1. The only way to shut people up is to get him assessed.
2. You need to be mentally ready for it before you begin the process as a positive diagnosis will likely hit you harder than your son at first. Obviously, the implications will be much greater for him than you eventually, but at first he won't care as he's so young and its just a word.
3. Maybe your son isn't on the spectrum and you'll have gone through all this for nothing (that would be your best case scenario).
4. I know a family with 2 children. The older one is severely autistic (diagnosed) but the younger one (who is 13) is completely normal, as far as the parents are concerned. The younger one has a very odd manner. He says whatever happens to be floating through his mind, without reference to appropriateness, he really invades their personal space and he doesn't seem to be able to read people's faces when they are getting fed up. Everyone (all the adults) whisper that the younger child is autistic too, and other children avoid him. However, the parents hotly deny there is any problem. The parents genuinely don't see any issue or anything unusual, perhaps because their definition of normal has been coloured by 15 years with their older child. I don't know if the younger boy is autistic or simply copying his brother's behaviour, but I do know that the older boy has allowances made for him whereas the younger one simply annoys people and they respond by avoiding him.

When my DS was 5 school came to me with similar concerns. In reception, they told me that they thought he might be autistic. I totally dismissed this comment and forgot about it. In Yr2 they told me that they thought he might have Asperger's. At this point I started worrying, Googling and worrying more. Some traits fitted but other traits did not fit. He was seen by school EPs on several occassions, one said no, one said maybe. In the end I paid to see a Clinical Psychologist who said definitely no. To begin with I was annoyed at the teachers who had suggested yes but with hindsight, they were only doing their job and trying to help. I remember saying that I didn't want DS on the special needs register but would now fight to have him put on it! The teachers probably lacked training in ASD, G&T and dyslexia - DS turned out to be G&T and dyslexic (twice exceptional). A Google on twice exceptional says that these kids are very misunderstood as the high ability is masked by the disability and vice versa.

I would accept any offer extra support or help that school can give - many are others are having to fight for it. It cannot do any harm and can only help. They may be misguided and wrong in their assumptions but their intentions will be good.

There are kids like mine who are quirky and eccentric and others who have Aspergers which brings with it specific difficulties which are definitely worth knowing about.

Dyslexia and g&t are strong traits on my side of the family but although many of us (itis a very large family) are quirky there is no autism. DS's older brothers, my DSS's, are exceptionally bright and in uni on their way to firsts in science based degrees and also no sign of autism, or dyslexia for that matter.
As I have already said DS has only two asd traits - reluctance to communicate and obsessiveness. He has no problem with eye contact or empathy, he has freinds and manages the complex politics of reception age friendships. His freinds don't seem to have any problem with communication with him.
I get what your saying about that awkward kid that everyone avoids but I don't see it in DS, maybe I am blind.
I think I'll go with the initial assessment and see what they have to say. I have nothing to lose at the moment.

Maybe you need to see the senco and ask If ... what help they are suggesting etc ... we have one child obsessed with trains and will not learn anything if its not train related - teachers can not teach to one child in a class of 30 and she stands out. Label or no label hes yours and u will love hum reguardless. X

It sounds like the teachers are seeing quirkiness and not getting it. They are not going to be experts in autism so it's not their fault. They are just doing their jobs and flagging something up. Have a look at the Misdiagnosis book:

www.amazon.co.uk/Misdiagnosis-Diagnoses-Gifted-Children-Adults/dp/0910707677

It was recommended to me by Potential Plus or NAGC as it was then.

I also think that you can have an above average number of autistic traits without them actually tipping over into a positive diagnosis. I would say that my DS is higher up on the spectrum than your average child BUT he does not have the significant difficulties associated with Aspergers. The book actually suggests that G&T and Aspergers are somehow linked and that the one actually tips over into the other at some point.

Thanks for the book link. DH and I have often discussed the fact that it is a spectrum and so ultimately we are all on it somewhere just that most of us have many more normal traits than autistic traits, some have a more 50/50 split of traits and some are much more autistic.
I will have a look at the book. DS is a very confident, self assured little boy. it will be interesting to see if they have a catagory for his set of traits.

Not to derail but as a spectrum that we are all on, if one end is called "autistic" and the middle part is called "normal", then what's the other end called?

"Super Straight"?

Also, Tony Attwood's book on Aspergers talks about a "grey area" where you have many traits but not enough to get a diagnosis.

I think you will find the Misdiagnosis book very interesting. It has lists of things that G&T share with many different "conditions" and then a following page that gives "contradictions" such as having obsessions BUT being able to switch easily to another topic for example. DS does indeed tick most of the shared traits but also most of the contradictions as well. And, he has learnt to conform a lot more as he has got older - he learnt at secondary school.

Is the other end people so social/empathic that they can not get anything done and eg cry at others' problems more than their own, or worry about what other people think so much that they are pretty useless in the outside world?
In which case both ends have their difficulties.

funnily enough in my head I have always imagined 'spectrum' as a circular thing so as you go away from extreme (autistic/aspergers/dyslexic, whatever) you go towards 'normal' but past that you swing back to the extreme end again. I wonder if there is extreme empathy? maybe that is the end that the more psychic among us belong?!

I was wondering if its maybe psychopath or sociopath?

i.e. one extreme can't read other people and it can cost them dearly in terms of social acceptance whilst the other extreme coldly analyses other people and everything is about optimising their medium & long term outcomes but they are exceptionally good at manipulating other people because their self-control is 100% so they can easily pretend to be lovely, caring etc until you are no use to them any more.

A quick Google found this forum posing the same question:

www.quora.com/Autism-Spectrum/What-is-on-the-other-end-of-the-autism-spectrum-from-autism

Another search said that the spectrum itself goes from mild Aspegers to severe Autism so no space for NT.