Who says a child is G&T and when?

[thecaptaincrocfamily]

It seems there are lots that are but when does this recognition happen? Is it dependent on school identifying? Is it from tests? How?

It all depends on your definition of "gifted".

It is not clear whether the OPs question related to "gifted" in the sense in which Betelgeuse takes it - as outstandingly gifted in a way that is going to require special programmes- or as the government definition of G&T, which simply means in the top 10% of that particular school. If it is the second definition, then that will depend very much on the individual school: some schools have a clear programme and a well maintained list, other schools are not very into g&t lists but are very good at differentiating between pupils anyway, or have very good teaching in the top sets, yet other schools do sod all.

But what one could hope for is that a child who us gifted should at least be put on the register and offered some enrichment activities and either be given special homework or that the homework given to the top set should be advanced enough to keep them happy.

It should also be recognised that not all parents who have a gifted child in the first sense find it necessary to have the child diagnosed by an outsider: if they have the necessary background themselves they may feel they know what they need to know and that they know best how to deal with it. And depending on the gift, it may not be possible to cater for it just by extended homework: to seriously cater for a musical gift for instance takes serious money.

I think my parents had good reason to believe I was gifted when it came to speech and languages, but they never felt homework had any particular relevance to that: as academics, they could do far more for me than any school could, so homework was something I got through as quickly as possible so I could then spend time on my own learning.

And for my musically talented brother, they just paid for a maestro. Tbh if you have real musical talent, it is unlikely that any homework you are set is going to make any difference, and to learn from a real master is going to be so prohibitively expensive that no school can be expected to fund that. Dd has a friend who is seriously talented in diving and gymnastics: again, the kind of coaching she needs is going to go far beyond what the school can reasonably provide.

But of course there are many situations where the school can help and should help and a diagnosis may be just the right thing to put pressure on them.

Thank you for your replies, she is ahead of most of her peers in all aspects although she is only in reception, for example spelling out words aloud, drawing complex pictures of scenes (she is 4.8mths). Trampolining at level 6, which requires taking multiple and complexed instructions to do routines and lots of balance. Has been able to add up objects for more than a year, spoke in 18 word sentences by 3yrs. Not exceptionally advanced in one area but ahead all round iyswim.

The teacher does seem to allow her more scope. i.e. the class coloured in humpty dumpty pictures, which she completes neatly in minutes. She then traces it, then draws it free hand in the time others were colouring it in iyswim.

Its just not knowing really because I work full time and don't get much opportunity for discussion with teachers.

So far it sounds quite promising, in that the teacher finds her something to do and allows her more scope.

It is possible that there is not too much advantage in labelling her early, since she seems to be an early developer/good allrounder, rather than say an outstanding talent at something like maths or music. (though you have to outstanding calculating skills, to keep track of 18 word sentences- seriously impressed there ). These are things where her peers may well have caught up within the next year or so.

What I would do is twofold:

a) keep communications open with the teacher and with your dd, just quietly and unobtrusively making sure she is not getting bored

b) make sure there is a wide range of stimulating material at home, not necessarily in the shape of specific "teaching material", but more that you have lots of books/talk to her lots/take her to the library and anything else that may be going on/encourage her to carry on sports (trampolining sounds very good)

LOL the 18 word sentence I remember was when we found her making toast at 6.30am
Me: what are you doing?
dd1: I was making you breakfast in bed but I'm not happy because you have gone and ruined it! at 3.4yo!

Yes I will aleways carry on with trampolining because it sharpens her attention, waiting and turn taking etc.

Thank you for your reply

PS we do lots of activities at home involving things like cutting out animals to create a safari scene, looking the animals up on the internet to see what they eat and habits, what young are called etc and then watching films with them in on wildlife. She now has a venus fly trap that I am not allowed to water with tap water because 'it needs rain water!'

Sounds good, sounds good!

As for the level of linguistic development at age 3, I would say it is quite advanced but not totally unusual: I seem to remember a similar level in my niece and my dd. Dn and dd went on to be bright and clever at school, but not at such a level that they were shortchanged by the state system. Dd gets high marks and is in top set, which is very nice for her, but nothing to worry about iyswim.

am i the only one mildly disturbed by the fact that you can remember an 18 word sentence word for word more than a year after your dc said it???

I don't think it's particularly disturbing to remember something like that. I was interested in language acquisition in children (studied it as part of my degree, but don't work in the field now), so saw my children as a 'case study' in practice. I used to write down examples of things they said from the time they started talking, from first words to the time they were pretty much fluent - I was interested in overgeneralisation of the 'ed' rule for the past tense, for instance,as well as lots of other things. They're 12 and 9 now and they love laughing over what they said at 2.

And that's how I know that DS2 was using sentences as long as 21 words at 2y2m; I've got some examples written down.

I was interested in overgeneralisation of the 'ed' rule for the past tense, for instance,as well as lots of other things.

That is interesting. What is the typical age for kids to stop overusing the ed rule?

I'm not sure about the age, but a typical pattern is followed. Children usually acquire some irregular past participles before they start adding 'ed' to most verbs, apparently learning them as one-off words.

Then they appear to learn the 'ed' rule and start to overgeneralise and 'normalise' the previously correct irregular past participles (eg start off saying 'fell' and later start saying 'falled'). Later still they re-learn the correct irregular form.

LOL singer, I was a childminder when dd1 was 3 so did observations all the time and thought my minded children would have a record of their development and dd wouldn't so I recorded lots of things! Also I have an interest in development on a professional level now.
However, the example I gave was memorable because not many 3 year olds are capable of thinking or making toast neatly on the kitchen side with the intention of bringing breakfast in bed iyswim!

It's lovely when they do things like that, isn't it? I remember babysitting for my niece when she was 3 and she was completely in charge of looking after baby brother, explaining how to make up his bottles, what proportions of formula and water, which bits had to be rinsed in warm water and which bits could go in the dishwasher etc. She was also a dab hand at nappy changing. In short, she was a good deal more clued up than me and I was in my twenties .

My SIL (different family) came into the kitchen on day and found that his son, who was 3 or 4 at the time, had made a cake! He obviously couldn't read a recipe, but had been watching his mum in the past and knew which bits went in and roughly in what proportions, so he got those out of the cupboard and mixed them in. She baked the cake for him and they all had it for tea; they said it was a bit doughy but perfectly edible. Funnily enough, this is a little boy who seemed very delayed in many areas: speech very late and difficult to understand at age 6, potty training late, behaviour very young. But he was spot on with his cake training!

Makes me think I should have made my children work harder.

Cory I love that! Very sweet

I have recently been told by my son's school that he is gifted and they have arranged for him to have additional lessons each week. I don't know whether they tested him.
I have always believed he was gifted, as he had an amazing ability to recall details of specific events long after it happened, and very interested in how everything works. He grasps concepts really quickly, and finishes his homework in minutes. I do worry that he does get bored, as he finishes work in class really quickly and then start talking - and then gets in trouble for this.

My son was classed as gifted and talented after various CDC, Ed Pschy and CAHMS assessments and a trail of demolished classrooms and distressed teachers. Thankfully he has had two very good headteachers who spotted him and managed to nip the worst of the outbursts by listening to him. He is statemented as his combination of abilities and complex SpLDs can be hard for anyone to manage.

He is classed as talented in music but prefers the mathematics behind it and is exceptionally talented in all areas of engineering with what is known as the knack.
He is exceptionally gifted in all sciences and maths and gets hysterical if he does not achieve a* in everything as he tends to be a driven perfectionist. I am concerned that drive could make his life a misery so is his Ed Psych.
I wish he could shave his raw ability down to just bright with potential and something we could all live with. G&T can be a poisoned chalice.

Thanks for that Betelguese.

That lad of mine fits the gifted criteria but I doubt very much any private school would take on the ADHD/ASD that goes with the brains he has. I certainly could not pay for his schooling and I could not fund his own TA - his elder brothers cost over £75K p.a. [Autism, dyspraxia,bi-polar and a complete very bright geek]and arranging funding with a mix of the local authority, NHS and social services was an utter nightmare.

My younger son is formally Stated as having SEN due to behaviour/anxiety/communication needs;complex SpLD's; G&T. I would not like to have paid out what the education authority have for him so far.

The local authority pays for specialist input at the local tech' secondary and it has a very good SENCO and Inclusion Officer. I did look at Maple Hayes and similar specilaized schools that offer education for complex SpLDs but in honesty I doubt anyone could do any more than his current school.
Hopefully that lad of mine will be happier in three years time when he can enter the sixth form and have access to far more interesting subjects linked to local Uni's.

Hi Guys, we would love any opinions on our son as we feel he may be gifted but have no real benchmark to compare against and he is not gifted in one particular area. We are toying with the idea of testing but unsure if the label would be good or bad?

Raffi (now just turned 5) spoke about 300 - 400 words at 1 year old, full sentances in correct tense by two (also spoke 20 or so words of spanish and french). He was able to follow grouped instructions at 1 year old ie go upstairs, clean teeth and bring pj's down. Like i say we struggle to identify anything solid more it is only in questions that we consider it ie:

• since about 2 he has been obsessed with making a medicine to stop people dying. He has also been trying to decide wether he believes there is a god or just a big explosion.

In the last few months questioning is more focussed ie Please can you explain to me how a lampost stays standing up, or i understand how a cd makes music but how does the cd know to get louder when you turn the volume up? Sorry dont want to bore with too many examples but just trying to give a picture.

He asked last night (5 now just and these are his words) - "I know the dinosaurs became extint when the big bang happened but what made it happen?"

He does basic maths but nothing special ie he adds, subtracts smaller numbers (