Gallbladder problems - Please help MNers!

[shinybootsofleather]

I recently went to the doctors after what appeared to be a gallbladder attack. I had pain under my ribcage on the right hand side, pain in the right shoulder blade and pain when I inhaled. He decided to refer me for an ultrasound to check for gallstones. I have to wait for this until the end of July.I remember having similar symptoms about 2 years ago that were put down to stress by my GP. I had an emergency CS nine-months ago and have been feeling really crappy since then. For the last couple of months I have been feeling really nauseous and have had four nasty bouts of severe diarrhoea (sorry if TMI). On one of these bouts, I weighed myself the next day to discover that I had lost 4lbs overnight . Unfortunately this weight came back on when I recovered.
I am obese. 5ft 2in and 15 stone. I suffered with PND after DS's birth and ate like an idiot and was immobile for a while due to healing issues with the CS scar, but have lost 2 stone recently with a combination of Slimming World, walking, the gym and the 30 Day Shred. The only advice the doctor gave me was to avoid fatty foods. I have been doing this for some time. The only thing I can link this to was a 4-day beach holiday we went on 2 months ago where it was well nigh impossible to get hold of anything apart from chips, and the weekend prior to the attack when we had friends over. Had chips on Friday and roast dinner on Sunday of which I only had a small portion. Has anyone else experienced this type of thing? I have been eating little more than fruit, veg, wholegrains and some lean lamb and chicken for the last few days yet I am still experiencing pain, albeit not as severe as my first attack 5 days ago. I was diagnosed with IBS before pregnancy and suffered with this a great deal and I am wondering if it could be related. Feeling a bit miserable and sorry for myself at the moment. I can't really exercise at present as my stomach still feels very tender after the attack and even walking to town is completely knackering. This is not normal for me. Although I'm a fat bird I am quite fit(!) Any advice from any MNers who have had similar problems?

Also would add that I drank quite a lot the weekend that we had the friends over, and that I had a temperature the evening and following day after the gallbladder attack.

Over the past 3 years I've had what initially was thought to be gall bladder problems (several episodes of the pain under ribs etc like you describe).

I was sent for 2 ultrasounds (each one was after the episodes though) and they couldn't find any evidence of problems with the gall bladder itself or damage caused by stones.

Also I don't generally fit the 'classic' gallbladder patient criteria as I'm vegi, have a relatively balanced diet and am a size 12 so not really overweight.

I was referred to a gastroenterologist who said that it was most likely a form of IBS where the gut goes into a spasm causing the pain. (I don't get the diarrhoea type problems associated with IBS)

Strangely enough at least 2 of the attacks I've had have been immediately after returning from holiday.

oops pressed post too soon.

I meant to say that I'd be inclined to think about the IBS side of things.

Maybe keep a food diary to look for triggers?

Thanks norbert. I do eat meat, but small amounts. I generally prefer veggie food, and I always have eaten well but in large portion sizes whilst overweight . I am at my wit's end with this. If it is IBS it will be a bit of a problem for me. I tried many remedies such as Colpermin and Mebeverine before getting pregnant seemed to stop the symptoms in their tracks. Prior to this, I was being checked at the hospital as I had been having what I thought were constant stomach bugs as well as bouts of stomach pain for two years. Was checked for Crohns and coeliac disease with negative results. Ended up having a colonoscopy, and was due to have a tube put down my throat before I got pregnant as I couldn't control the symptoms. I had so much time off work with it, I was in danger of being fired. Are you still suffering with the pain and have you found anything helps you?

I know bread can set it off for me, but it varies on a day to day basis from previous diaries. Stress may possibly affect it. It was at its worst whilst completing my MA dissertation and working full-time. I feel that the GPs are all too willing to put everything down to stress however. I have had episodes whilst in a positive frame of mind and feeling relaxed as well. I think I will start another food diary though as I am sure the GP will ask me to if the ultrasound does not show gallstones. I also have a blood test tomorrow where I assume that they will test liver function.

Sounds like this has been dragging on for you for ages Boots.

I tend to get a bout about every 5-6 months.

I'll have a day or 2 of the severe pain followed by a few days of the tenderness like you described.

The GP prescribed Buscopan, an anti-spasmodic for IBS, but I haven't had chance to try it out yet. Up until now I've just tried normal painkillers and a hot water bottle which is very soothing

I've never been able to pin down a cause.

Don't rule out gallbladder problems but at the same time don't bank on it being that. In a way I was disappointed that it wasn't diagnosed for me as if it had have been they could have treated it IYSWIM. Instead I'm left not quite knowing what it is and if/when it will happen again.

I am not sure whether I can answer your questions but quite happy to share my experiences with gallbladder problems.

I can only describe the pain of a gallbladder attack as worse than labour - absolute agony. In my case it was like contractions but under my ribcage on the right as in the pain would build up, peak and then go again over and over again (does that make sense). They also always happened within about 6-8 hours of eating a big meal so it was fairly immediate but I am not sure if that is typical.

My scan showed I had lots of very small gallstones rather than 1 or 2 big ones. I had my gallbladder removed 7 months ago and have had absolutely no problems whatsoever since

Just to put it into context, the attacks started 2 months after DS2 was born and I was at least 3 stone overweight at the time.

Interestingly enough, I have also suffered with IBS for as long as I can remember - but it completely vanished when I got pg with DS1 and has never come back 4 years on

Not sure if this is going to be any help??

Sorry - meant to add that the attacks tended to last about 2 hours then the pain would suddenly vanish with no after-effects (presumably that was when the stone had passed through)

IBS was dragging on for a while prior to pregnancy but this is the probably the second time that I have had gallbladder attack symptoms (if that's what it is). Thanks for the hot water bottle tip Norbert. Will give it a try if it re-occurs.
Thanks for the info Ceebee. I wouldn't say the "attack" was worse than labour for me personally but I understand there are varying degrees of pain depending on the severity of an attack. I could not sleep with the pain and paracetamol would not touch it. I went for an emergency appt as I convinced myself it had something to do with my lungs or heart due to the pain I felt when inhaling. In a way I hope it's not IBS as I was hoping that that would disappear after pregnancy. My GP said that sometimes this could happen and I was keeping both fingers and toes crossed! I really don't want another operation so soon after my traumatic CS though.

Shiny the operation is very straightforward - I have had 2 C-sections and it was so much better than those in terms of pain and recovery.

If you do have to have an op, chances are it won't be straight away - mine was 4 months after my scan and was 11 months after my CS with DS2.

shiny - that sounds classic gall stone problem to me. The position of the pain is the dead give away. I can still remember it and I dont think I will ever forget.

Feeling exhausted while walking is another. That happened to me too. Your pancreas is irritated and causes blood sugar to crash as it responds by producing too much insulin.

Putting on weight too as you will over eat when your blood sugar crashes and of course you will not feel like excercise. Had bouts of diarrhoea and weight oscillating by 4lb in a day had that too.

You need to stay completely off all red meat. Lamb is bad as it is fatty. Really light meals such as salad and fish, no spicey food, as little fat as possible and definitely no animal fat, cheese or cream or booze.

My worst attack came after a really nice lasagne and half a bottle of red wine. I swear after 2 days of vomiting and pain I began to stop caring if I lived or died.

Do not believe anyone who says you can live with it. Have your gall bladder taken out ASAP. Do not be fobbed off. Me and my mother (who suffered for years) were both fobbed off with pain killers by our GPs. Eventualy my mother nearly had a situation where he gall bladder ruptured as the gall bladder walls were worn tissue thin by the stones.

That's a reassurance about the op Ceebee. I just still have nightmares about the CS so I am a little wary of ops now.
I can take or leave red meat BeenBeta so will give that a go. Garrggh no booze though! I just hope I don't have too many more attacks before my ultrasound at the end of July. The exhaustion whilst walking is a real problem as I have been exercising and losing weight for months now, and I am actually starting to enjoy the 30 Day Shred and going to the gym. Did you find that it was possible to exercise between attacks? I can't imagine it now as I am feeling so nauseous with a tender stomach.

Does anyone know if eggs can cause problems btw? I have been eating more eggs than usual as they are "free food" on Slimming World. I have also been eating lean cuts of red meat and lean beef mince a bit more than I usually would since starting the diet. Also loads of veg and fruit.

Did anyone have back pain around the kidney area during and after a gallbladder attack also? Sorry for all the questions. I just want to do what I can to get rid of this!

I tried to go to the gym between attacks in the ealry stages. Stopped that when I nearly collapsed and blacked out on a rowing machine after 5 minutes. I used to be a rower so I know what I am doing. I just had no blood sugar left.

In the end I couldnt walk up a hill.

Keep the diet going if you can as that will help you stay off fat and booze and keep you on light meals.

Bugger, I was hoping I could continue with the exercise.

It's saturated fat you need to steer clear of; red meat, all dairy (have skimmed milk), chocolate and coffee (coffee will give you heartburn).
Ask the GP to prescribe you Diclofenac, which will stop the spasms within 5 mins of taking it.

I had the most horrific pain and was alone with my baby whilst dh was on op tour. I still didn't know what it was and one night when the pain was excrutiating, when I called the out of hours gp, she said I had wind and to take paracetamol. I couldn't even walk down to get them and managed to crawl to dd's cot to pick her up to take into my bed, in case I passed out. I fell asleep after hyperventilating (luckily I had a paper bag in my bedside drawer) and was relieved to wake up!
At the scan, they found 15 small gallstones and there would have been a year long wait to have a cholesystectomy but luckily we were moving to germany with the forces and they removed my gall bladder within 2 weeks of my arrival.
Now, without a GB, I can't eat much saturated fat or drink coffee. I try to be careful as my surgeon told me afterwards that gallstones can be made in the bile duct and that really wouldn't be good. That scared me!

lucie - interesting. I get heart burn a fair bit and take Gaviscon every night. The strong coffee I drnk could be the cause.

I didnt know I could still grow a stone in the duct though. Have a diet with very little animal fat, no butter or cream so should be OK. Hopefully.

Taking Gaviscon whilst you have gall stones can actually make them worse irrc. That's what I was taking before I knew it was gallstones. Might be wrong though.

So is the consensus that I should avoid even lean red meat? Anybody know about eggs? I am slightly concerned that I am having problems at 31 years of age as the info I have read on it suggests that women over 40 are more prone to the disease. Weight loss, being overweight, having been pregnant and the contraceptive pill are also thought to make people more prone to suffering with gallstones as well however. I fit all of those criteria.

No eggs - yolk not goo but white okay.

I had them after birth of first child. I am overweight and I was only 25 when I had my gb removed.

Yes - try and avoid all red meat and stick to chicken, turkey, quorn and fish.

My first spasmodic attack was after a steak in a restaurant.

I had severe shoulder pain for 18 mths, various visits to the doctors and I was mis-diagnosed on many occasions. Also felt very tired all the time.

Unfortunately, I ended up very poorly with septaecemia, as my gall bladder had become infected.

I had it removed (I had 143 stones). I have now fully recovered and have never felt better.

Next time you have an attack I would suggest you go to a&e, you will prob get referred quicker.

I feel tired and nauseous all the time. It is much worse in the morning when I feel like death. The pain appears to have gone for now but I have been left with a nasty headache. Will avoid red meat etc today and see how I go. It's started to get me down as I feel sick all the time.

ditto going to A & A - I wish I had done that first time. In fact the GP did say as I left for Germany, that I should have gone to A & E and they would have whipped it out there and then.

Try to avoid it full stop or you will risk another attack and if you're scan isn't for weeks yet, you'll feel terrible. It (pain)really can be easily controlled with careful eating (no sat fats at all) and then, as we sdaid, go to A & E if you have another attack.