**TAMOXIFEN** 4th thread

[MaryAnnSingleton]

here we go !

Sorry about your rib MAS -- I hope it will feel better soon. I've never had a broken rib but have heard they're really sore. But well done your DS for his performance.

My DS did a street performance yesterday but at the level of samba! ie not sophisticated! But it was good fun as it was to launch the 'Foodfest' we have in the village at the start of the annual Festival. He really enjoyed doing this - good post GCS therapy.

And speaking of therapy Haggis, I've heard from another friend about reiki working - think I'll have a go! When I went to NOrway it was with 5 friends in a van which we all slept in (3 on a top shelf, 3 below . Was huge fun- we were all about 24. We crossed first to Stavanger to take a Norwegian friend and his wife back to his his home town near there. They'd been in the UK for a few years. Then up to Bergen and on all the way up to the Cape and the Midnight sun at the very top. Totally brilliant. Then we drove back down through Sweden and then to Oslo and then finally back to Stavanger. I didn't know anyone of the the 6 except one, but we all had such fun for 3-4 weeks.

Then 24 years later I took the family - we went to Bergen and a bit North from there, then down to visit the aforementioned Norwegian and his wife (whom I'd never seen in the 24 years) who live in a totally beautiful place above a fjord - they have to take a little boat top visit some of their friends! He's an architect and designed the house on 4 levels with various balconies so that they can catch the sun at any time of day. They had 4 children and our DCs had fun with them. It was lovely.

Hmm, bras. For people with 2 boobs (sorry - I know this is not everyone) , have I mentioned Triumph Supersoft Sensattion bras? I find them comfortable (at least pre effects of rads). YOu can get them on www.needundies.com I had tired several others post op but not liked any of them till I found this.

Have to stop and get early lunch ready for a friend giving me lift to rads today. Salmon and home grown salad leaves and fresh rolls! And home made strawberry and Turkish Delight ice cream! (I love eating as its the only time I don't have that weird taste in my mouth

Have a great holiday CC and a great w/e everyone else if you possibly can. Weather forecast sounds good! We're going to a 21st birthday party. Sorry for rambling.

samba sounds fab SR !
I've always wanted to go to the Arctic -I imagine it'd be so different -the idea of midnight sun fascinates me and how I'd love to see the Northern Lights. Mum has a Norweigian friend who married a Sri Lankan man and had the most beautiful children.
Turkish delight ice cream sounds amazing - did you make it ? I have rose water......

Well done to your DS MAS, if you are anything like me, you will be more nervous than him when he's performing Lovely that it went well.

Sorry to hear the ribs are cracked did the GP give any idea how long they take to heal?

Trip to the Vatican to see your DS's sounds wonderful CC, something very moving about choral music. I have a Thomas Tallis CD which is my emergency music for when I need to feel calm and serene

Got a postcard from DD - she went to an organ recital, and Gregorian chant in Notre Dame and said it was fabulous.

Good that your DS is relaxing after all his hard work SR,the Foodfest sound a fun idea. And TD icecream very nice. I 'harvested' two strawberries from the garden yesterday, the first ones (It wasn't really enough to share so I ate them!)

Haggis - I share your weight frustrations. I haven't managed to shift a single pound of my 'thyroid' weight, and I'm not sure any of my summery clothes are going to fit this year. I too hate clothes shopping, but need something cool to wear. Never mind - we will get there eventually

Echocardiogram seemed to go fine yesterday, - at least they didn't say anything was wrong. For some reason the woman had to push the scanner thing right into my throat, in that dip where your collar bones meet. 'stop me if you choke' she said . No idea what part of my heart she was after there .

Cakes have you tried any of the specialist sites for bras? I obviously have to get the mastectomy ones, but I like them because they have nice wide soft straps, and give more support (you could remove the pocket, or some you can get without pockets. - I like the Anita ones from Nicola Jane site) I have also heard good things about the Triumph bras SR mentions.

I keep fitted (kept fit?) this morning. V.hot in the hall.

Love to all - have a good weekend, and take it easy everyone on treatment.

Also meant to say I find front fastening bras more comfortable.

owww about echocardiogram and neck KK - eee ! maybe she was after your carotid artery ? glad to hear that dd is having a good time !

KK -eek at your echocardiogram! Honestly the things medics shove inside us!

MAS - yes I have an ice cream machine so its nice experimenting with flavours. It was really a strawberry ice cream recipe but I added some chopped up TD as I'd seen a recipe for this in a paper a few weeks ago.

I bought the IC machine about 4 years ago in a heat-wave. It was an extravagence but its very nice when the weather turns hot and I heave it out of the cupboard for a few weeks.

Its in my cupboard of seasonal things - the chestnut roasting pan sits on top of it most of the year!

I think the ICs are simply fruit and cream and sugar with a bit of lemon juice, but I should really experiment a bit more.

SR, amazing trips to Norway. I want to go. And stay with your friend with 4 balconies! And v impressed with your IC and also with seasonal cupboard! Well done to samba son, tell him nothing like a man with rhythm, rare breed!

KK, is 'If Ye Love Me' on your Tallis CD? One of my alltime favourites. Glad the echo went ok. Think they would have been trying to look at your aortic valve in that spot. Glad dd having fun, and glad she went to recital in Notre Dame, that was our last year's choir trip!

MAS, do take the painkillers regularly and keep breathing deep! If cracked it could take weeks and weeks to heal. Sorry to hear. Hope doesn't inhibit your wonderful baking too much.

Hope Smee not too low, but I know you are, because I was there yesterday. I have head up again today though. Hang in there.

Good weekend everyone, hope sun shines wherever you are.

Sorry to hear about your ribs MAS - you must have really given yourself a knock.
Have just come back from a full day thingy (part of my mindfulness course). We had 6 and a half hours of meditation and were not allowed to speak at all - not even at lunch. I think that there is nothing more miserable than eating lunch with a crowd of people and not being able to speak. Getting up to wash my own plate and make myself a cup of tea without asking if anyone else wanted one was odd. The tutor asked what we had learned. I said "I won't be joining a silent order any time soon". Not sure that was the right answer

so haggis isn't going to be a nun !! I must read up more about mindfulness and CBT - I'm not sure how good i'd be at following it -it does sound hard work.
Ribs are hurting more,at least yesterday and I felt sooo tired that i had to lie down twice. Didn't do any drawing as I'd hoped,just the domestic stuff. Was thinking of baking some scones today to get motivated !
Hope everyone is coping with the heat and that the coming week is tolerable for those having treatment. By the way RWU seems to be clearing out her shed -though is frightened of the very big spiders therein (facebook lurking)

Glad you're feeling better CC. Hope Smee will be soon.

I felt great yesterday - so normal it was wonderful. This was the 4th day after taking the chemo tablets so I reckon the rads are having no SEs on me as yet - its just that the CMF chemo makes me grotty for 2.5 weeks. But that I means I might feel; good now for another week or so unless rads SEs kick in. Hooray!

Did loads yesterday - a walk for 50 mins, a quick shopping trip with DS who needed summer clothes, then we went to a 21st birthday party all afternoon which was lovely - family and friends of a friend of our DD (who wasn't there due to being in Hannover of course) - in a lovely big shady garden - lovely company and food.

It was DS's prom last night so off he went looking stunning with two stunning friends. DH and I then put a 3-man tent up for them as the plan was they'd sleep in the garden. Well at about 4am I heard them coming in and heading for the comfortable option of DS's bedroom! They're still there - hope they had a good time.

Today I'm going with 2 friends on a walking tour of open gardens in the village - part of our annual festival. Hoping to get some good ideas - but just feel v . As my brother said recently'To have a wonderful garden you just need patience and to spread loads of money on it'

Then of course I'll watch the match - DD will have fun I think as she lives in a commune of German people!

I hope everyone feeling well enough to enjoy this fantastic weather.

SR -that's brilliant -well done-am so pleased that you're feeling good and doing lots of nice things !
Have you a pic of ds in his prom outfit ? you must have felt so proud

Morning All - so many posts. Way too much to catch up on for fug-brain here, though poor you MAS with your ribs. Hope the pain's easing a bit.

Been more blasted post chemo this time, due to a reaction to a new anti nausea drug - actually made me more nauseous. Big yeay..! Feeling a bit better today though, so I will read and catch up. Lovely weather, so hard to be too glum. Have cancelled work for the day, so my new recliner might actually get some use.

Wishing you all much sun.

Hi all

It's too hot to do anything except enjoy the sun, so let's just do that. Can't even think straight, but that isn't so new

KK - I will try the website for bras: I hate bra shopping of all things shopping related, so hadn't given it much effort, but I shall do so, thanks for the pointers. I can't just keep hanging loose it looks most unappealng.

Sorry to all feeling poorly, whether drug or rib related - take it easy.

RWU v brave with shed - I never go into shed, garage or loft owing to big spiders...

hello everyone - phew what a scorcher!

Sorry to hear you're feeling pretty rough Smee, sounds as if you are really suffering with the nausea, it is a rotten feeling, I hope it eases off soon and you feel a bit better.

SR - sounds a lovely weekend, did DS enjoy his prom? They look so alarmingly grown up when they get all dressed up in their prom clothes. Great that you've felt well enough to enjoy the sunshine.

Hope the ribs are a bit better today MAS, and nice to hear an update from RWU . If you're reading RWU much love, and just to let you know when I cleaned out my shed/garage there was a dead rat in it , it was fine .

Haggis - the meditation day sounds rather full on, I've done a little bit of meditation (at yoga days), but never for that long! and I think I'd go potty(er) if I wasn't allowed to talk to anyone over lunch. However, definitely worth trying all these things, and you can pick and choose a bit if you find something helpful.

CC - My CD doesn't have that one on it, but I will look it up on You Tube and have a listen. It has Spem in alium which I love - and because its long I can really loose myself in it. Would love to hear some performed live. My CD is a sort of 'Tallis' Greatest Hits' so probably not the best one to have, but I loved listening to it when I was having chemo and in need of uplifting.

DD is now in Florence, - slightly held up in France due to rail strikes (surprise). So is off to the Uffizi Gallery I imagine, and the Boboli Gardens, etc. I'm very . But pleased she is having such fun.

I'm summer cleaning at the moment, amazing what a difference to the house it makes when someone moves out. DH and I are undertaking 'operation house liveable-in' and reclaiming a bit of space!

Cakes hope you have some luck with bras. They make me v. uncomfortable in this weather too, and always at the end of the day it feels swollen under my surgery side arm. I hang loose at the weekends given half a chance. I have a good friend who comes round to my house and always says 'oh good you're wearing your boob today, it does look tidier you know!'

love to all, and good vibes to anyone having treatment this week.

MAS - hope the ribs are feeling better.

Smee - sorry you're in chemo zone right now.

Sorry to bring a downer on all things but I was wondering if anyone can help talk me down a bit. I'm now in my first week of non-chemo treatment (but still getting chemo SE's. yukky mouth, nails falling off, funny sensations in hands) and having radiotherapy.

I am feeling terribly low. I can't stop crying, and I am filled with fear. I feel incredibly tense, anxious and sad and I'm not sure how to stop feeling like this.

Today is my wedding anniversary. I feel so miserable about it and poor DH bought me some diamond studs but I can't muster up the strength to make the day special at all. I went round John Lewis trying to find a gift but I couldn't focus and kept bursting into tears. Even choosing a card took me over an hour. I kept thinking about how happy I was this day 7 years ago and wondering if I can ever be happy like that again.

I feel like I've lost so much confidence and belief in myself. I used to put so much into this family but now I'm just taking, taking, taking. I hate the status quo. I feel guilty for bringing this horrible nightmare into our happy little existence.

I feel so miserable about the mood I'm in today; it is not at all like me to be weepy. this is the third day in a row I've been like this and I'm worried that I'm getting depressed.

Everything thinks I should be so happy about finishing chemo, but I'm not.

I've booked a counselling session next week with one of the macmillan counsellors at the clinic and a massage tomorrow and I spoke to two BCNs today who were lovely, but they - no anyone else - cannot give the cast iron reassurances I seek.

I'm so worried about living every day with this fear. I know I have to and will do it, but I don't know how I can do it without cracking up TBH.

So sorry to bring such melancholy into this very upbeat thread, but I didn't know who else to turn to.

Oh Pennies

I think I do know a bit about how you feel, the radio made me want to weep every day too, especially in the early part for some reason. My consultant said that radio really does make you feel pretty blue - he was the only one to mention that to me, not sure if anyone told you.

And it is very hard to get your head around the uncertainty.

All I can say is that, in reality, no-one at all has any certainty, it is just that people who have not had a cancer diagnosis don't really have to address that. We have been made to face that and it is hard to live with, especially at first. I found it easier to deal with when I recognised we all live with uncertainty.

Remember that you took the radical surgery option to give yourself the best possible chance of a cancer-free future. That was really wise, and really strong of you. You have every chance of a good recovery.

All I can say to get you through this period is - be kind to yourself, keep remembering to breathe deeply, and don't expect to feel better for maybe a few weeks. Your body and mind are exhausted, and no wonder. But if you give yourself a chance, you really will start to feel better, honestly.

You say you feel you are just doing all the taking at the moment. Well, don't feel bad about that. If you have been putting loads of work in for seven years, it's your turn. It'll pass and you'll be holidng it all together again.

You're not Superwoman, Pennies - so don't try to be. At least, not quite yet. xx

Oh Pennies, I'm so sorry you are feeling so low. No one can really understand what this is like unless they've been through it. people do tend to think 'you've finished treatment, now move on'. But of course it just doesn't work that way.

I am probably about a year ahead of you, I think you have done the right thing to set up a meeting with Macmillan counsellors. I met with them at this time last year, and found them very helpful - if its any comfort at all, I was crying a lot, and really struggling at this point.

It is a huge knock to your confidence, of course - its an enormous thing you've been through, so don't be frustrated and put pressure on yourself to think you should feel all great now chemo's finished. I think chemo to some extent stops you thinking too much, because you have to concentrate on just getting through it.

I am trying to think of something useful to say, apart from I've been there too, and still get days when I feel 'what the hell's happened to my life'. The feelings are normal and shared by many, have you tried any helplines? Macmillan, or BCC they are very good I think if you just need to talk.

It will get better, - gradually,- but it will. The fear will go into the background and you will get more control over your thoughts and feelings so they are manageable.

Have you spoken to your GP, - mine put me on ADs - I was very reluctant at first, but I'm on a low dose, and they make things just that bit easier. Not trying to push you that way, but I think its worth talking over as an option.

Please, please do post whenever you need to talk. I tend to write cheery nonsense, but it's one of my coping mechanisms, I really do understand how you feel, and sympathise greatly. I don't think I've helped much, but am sending you loads of hugs. Take it slowly and gently my dear, we are all here to support you xx

It is interesting that you both felt blue at this stage. I think your Dr knows his onions, Cakes. I don't feel so bad that this isn't a unique reaction.

I put last wednesday's weepiness down to it being the first day of rads, but I couldn't explain it over the weekend, except that my fingernails started falling off. I think I will lose 7 of them over the next week or two and that has been a tough surprise when I thought that I should be entering a period of re-growth after chemo, rather than a further physical hit that I can't even hide with fakes or varnish. Annoying how something so seemingly trivial can open the door on such dark thoughts.

dear Pennies - so sorry that you are feeling so low - I think the heat,though the sun is lovely, is quite exhausting - i have felt very tired all weekend and have no post chemo excuse. I think I said earlier that it was post rads when the weepiness/depression hit me - I was quite chipper during,it was the sudden stopping of my routine and being cared for.
I guess it hits people at different times.
I am learning in my CBT that there is no certainty that nothing bad will happen, that you do have to live with an element of uncertainty- more so as Cakes says for those of us with a bc diagnosis. You are doing the right thing contacting the Macmillan counsellor and I can also now recommend antidepressants,despite my initial horror at the thought of them - they certainly smooth the edges off without one feeling out of control/spaced out.
Put your lovely diamond studs in and celebrate having got through so much already...lots of love x

from me too, Pennies. Must be strange appearing to be nearly 'out', yet feeling you're nowhere near normality. Fingernails falling off is yet another yuk to show how much your body has coped with; I'd be in tears too am sure. And as you say it doesn't take much to make us fall. Wish I could think of something useful to say, but from a distance I'd guess allowing yourself to cry and be upset might actually be a sane way through. You've been working so hard to reach this point. A sob with your DH could possibly be a way of moving past it. Virtual hugs from me too x

Nails falling off would do it for me. How horrible. xx

Pennies - hugs from me too. All I can add is that I am aware I am putting my feelings/emotions on hold as I need all my strength to get through the chemo and I suspect I'll hit a brick wall when I finish the chemo in September. Also, three friends of mine who've been through this said the same - they hit a horrible psychological patch after treatment. One needed counselling and medication for a quite a long time and says she was dealing not only with the cancer uncertainties but also the break-up of a marriage so had a lot of 'tsuff' to sort out. Another worked through it but felt very low and weepy towards end of rads and gradually came up again over a period of some weeks. The third did warn me this would happen - she's a very strong person who worked in a big job through her chemo but also hit this emotional low. She got through OK.

So in deed it seems normal to have to deal with this - not that that makes it any easier. I think if you can use whatever resources are offered, you'll come through. Its my impression you've been really strong through this and your mind might need a break after just enduring so much very intensive treatment. perhaps your mind is realising what you've been through and the weeping just has to come out. Although horrid, I have a feeling its probably actually a healthy response to the last few horrible months.

O, I'm saying all this and pretty sure this will hit me in Sepetember to be honest.

My other close friend has been diagnosed with non-Hodgkins Lymphoma. She's on a 'wait and watch' policy - this means no treatment at the moment. This uncertainty has hit her very hard - she's always been a very strong calm person with big responsible job. Now she's become very anxious and she is also seeking help.

Thinking of you.

Pennies, I had to comment, I feel for you. The emotional side is very tough. I have been staying away recently after going through a very dark patch mentally, so I know where you're at.
I just wanted to offer an ear if you need it, you are welcome to cat me, I have a lovely support group for younger women (which from memory you are- forgive me if I am wrong) they often listen to me and my woe-is-me moans!!

Hi ladies! As explained above I'm still not in a good place mentally. I am starting to feel a but better and appreciate life again, but it's taking time so pls forgive my absence!
I have a new friend, I have followed after sr and named my new picc line 'petunia'', finally had the Hickman out!

am sorry about your friend SR - anxiety is such a bugger too and watching and waiting must be so difficult.
Hello RWU and welcome Petunia
Hope you are feeling a little brighter and also Pennies.

Hi Pennies - hope today is a better day, but I'm not surprised if it isn't. It's a long old haul. Take it steady.

Hi RWU and Petunia! Good to hear from you both, though sorry things are still tough. How typical of you to break silence to be helpful. How did the shed clearing go? (Though I blanch at the thought of bug-related details )

As SR's frinds' experience shows - the psychological fall-out is very difficult.

I've been to see a physio today to get some exercise specific to my back problem (see, I told you I'd go eventually!!) - this is now being sorted, but I have to have an MRI "just as a precaution, because of my history". It is very hard to get past it all and think of something else for a bit. Am not complaining, I think I am doing OK, bt you know what I mean.

The heavens have just opened here. I did not realise DH had opened the rooflights in the office. Water everywhere. Sigh.

Hoping for a better day for all those who are under the cosh right now. xx