Alcoholism, Depression or too much navel gazing??

[CrushedWithEyes]

Probably posting this in the wrong place but can't talk to anyone in RL about this...

Background:
Dad is bi-polar and alcoholic (his mother was also clinically depressed)

During teen years I was treated for depression.

Also during this time I veered towards problem drinking...going to seedy pubs on my own to drink and hide that from parents "met up with friends..." etc....sex with strangers when drunk in pub toilets...raped by so called boyfriend when passed out...secret drinking at home.

At uni drank every night (could always find someone going out so never had o do it alone then

Met my now DH and started to sort my life out...went to doctors and started on ADs...left uni and got away from my previous drinking buddies. DH and I would always drink though, usually bottle of wine a night for me or more...every night.

Fast forward to now and drinking has steadily decreased after having children (can't function too well doing childcare and having hangover!)...am now at the point where I will prob have 3 bottles wine a week(but am craving the weekend to begin and am only drinking this amount because of willpower/ knowledge that have to be responsible the next day , looking after children etc).

So, overall am no longer a heavy drinker.

However, am I an accident waiting to happen? Have I got a problem with alcohol that is currently in remission? Or can you recover and have a normal relationship with alcohol after having a problem?

Or do I need to stop thinking so much and stop the navel gazing?

Suppose I'm hoping for recovering/ recovered alcoholics (MIFLAW etc) to tell me that I'm fine because am starting to come to the conclusion that I shouldn't drink at all

Should have said...thanks if you manage to get to the end! Was a bit of verbal diarrhea, but if I didn't post it all...I wouldn't have posted at all IYSWIM

Well done for cutting back so much - you obviously have a reasonable amount of control over your drinking.

However, I think 3 bottles of wine would still be considered more than is healthy, given that the recommended limit per week for women is 14 units (and no more than 3 per day), and 3 bottles of wine must be at least 21 units. There is therefore the risk that, if something happens to make you depressed again, or just to unsettle your current life, you will gradually start upping your levels of drinking again to a point where it is clearly hazardous for your health and ability to function properly for your family. My opinion is that, if you've had problems with drinking in the past, you are never going to be able to promise yourself that they won't arise again, next time life gets a bit stressful. Not sure whether you want to deal with this issue now, while your life is, presumably, fairly happy and stable, or whether you are happy just to take the risk? Since you are asking, I guess you are wondering whether you ought to be taking the risk - particularly since you do still drink a fair amount. Could you cut back a bit more without finding it hugely difficult?

Why not test it for yourself? Why not stop drinking totally, with no exceptions or "get out of jail" cards" or "ah, but you don't understand"s for, say, three months, and see whether you feel better or worse?

If that idea sounds horrific, ask yourself why? After all, it's not food you're giving up.

If you do do it and then decide to drink again, keep an honest eye on how your drinking afterwards develops.

Do that and, one way or the other, you'll have answered your own question.

Although, TBH, it sounds like, deep down, you already have.

Thanks for the replies. To be honest have never really considered myself to have a problem, was only after reading some past threads on here, that gave me the idea.

Thought about cutting down and what with thread about non-alcoholic drinks, thought I'd have a look at past threads which made me analyse past behaviour from a different perspective.

I can easily explain away (in my own head) what happened in my teens early twenties, but would never speak to those I know because in black and white it looks quite grim

So in essence, am wondering if you can have a problem with drink and not realise but sort it out permenantly. I know I can cut alcohol out v easily after 3 pregnancies

My problem more is moderation, once you have one drink, resolve kind of goes out of the window.

Incidently, have stopped drinking last week, don't miss it, but haven't been tested socially.

So maybe am being a bit of a drama queen and there's nothing wrong?

(don't quite know how anyone is supposed to answer these questions for me. Think I over think sometimes)

Sorry, will stop now...

MIFLAW I know exactly what would happen if I stopped for 3 months.

First glass of cool white wine would be like heaven, and so would the 3 following. Then next day would be craving end of day to relieve the itch that the previous night provided.

So back to previous level of drinking within 3 weeks. I was the same with smoking, will drink to the maximum limit that allows me to perform effectively as a mother (ie never drink in front of them and never be hungover when in sole care of them)

In that case, isn't that your answer?

or, to put it another way, try to define for yourself what "probnlem drinking" means. Not "problem drinkers" or "problem drinks" - ie not, "oh, it's tramps/people who drink scotch in the mornings/people on the dole/drink drivers/it's if you drink strong white cider" - but "problem drinking."

I guess, for most people, it would be "Pringles drinking" - once you pop, you can't stop - maybe coupled with "and it doesn't make you happy" or "and it gets you into situations you don't like" or "you do things that aren't really 'you'". So, define it, then see how you measure up.

Incidentally - and this is in no way a message saying "go to AA", it's just a true story - the "Big Book" of Alcoholics Anonymous tells the story of a man who found that drinking was harming his career. So he stopped. Completely. For 30 years.

He reached retirement, no longer had a compelling reason not to drink, started drinking again and was dead within two years.

How do you rate your abstention for a week, or even for the length of a pregnancy, against that particular benchmark?

Bleugh!

OK, yep it's a problem.

But do I say "Hey ho, no more for me".

Not a drop, no champagne at a wedding, no New Year tipple etc. Quite possibly denying myself something enjoyable just because this month am feeling a little hysterical.

Or do I try and have it at an occasion, on occasion. Does that open the door for me to slip back into drinking everyday? What if it's this (possibly rare) moment that I have the willpower to try and eradicate alcohol from my life?

Obviously easier to get you to give me the answer!

Ahhh!

That's exactly what I'm getting at!

Have I got a problem, therefore I shouldn't drink ever because it's something that will just reappear as soon as the alcohol does?

Or is it that I used to drink too much, was young, made stupid choices and now am just like alot of the population and drink over government guidelines so should cut down?

Sorry to monopolise you, but you have come across as helpful and to the point in other threads - and that's what I need now

"I know exactly what would happen if I stopped for 3 months."

That seems to be present tense with future reference to me.

Nothing about being young and making stupid choices.

Everyone always bangs on about champagne at a wedding, by the way.

I personally say, big fucking deal. I cannot ever remember a wedding where I went and drank just the champagne so clearly it wasn't the be all and end all even then.

The last wedding I went to and drank at, I fell asleep in my meal.

Strong stuff, that champagne ...

Much the same goes for "the Christmas tipple".

Big difference between an alcoholic and heavy drinker though?

Don't see that statement puts me squarely in either camp

ROFL!

Well, what was your definition of "problem drinking"?

Did it involve not being able to stop once you've started?

If it did, and you know for a fact - present tense - that within three weeks you will be in that position, then surely that tells you all you need to know?

I think, if you're honest, you don't like the idea of being an alcoholic and you don't want to give up drinking.

So don't. Have a go at not being an alcoholic, being a heavy drinker, or even a moderate drinker, and control your drinking. I mean, if you're not an alcoholic, then by definition it should be easy, right?

Assuming nothing flukily bad happens to you in the mean time, sooner or later you will work out for yourself what you are, one way or the other, and then you can take appropriate action.

Off home now, probably back on line later if you want to talk more, honestly happy to help if I can.

S

There is a difference that I can't quite articulate between an alcoholic and a heavy drinker and so cannot swear that I am one or the other.

nb Will be biased after seeing my Dad as a child to believe myself to be alcoholic...but (and these are the words I could imagine coming out of any AA meeting from someone in denial) all my friends are heavy (or heavier) drinkers than me and we can't all be alcoholics.

Kay, in all honesty, I couldn't imagine I life where I could never drink alcohol again. the thought fills me with horror.

yet I haven't gone over my weekly limit since I was about 20, and most weeks I barely make 5 units.

I don't think there is anything worrying about enjoying a drink, or looking forward to a drink at the end of a busy day. So long as you are capable of only having one drink, or doing without even though you would have enjoyed it. If you are drinking all your weekly units over the weekend, you have a problem. If you are drinking them evenly through the week, you may be doing yourself long-term harm, but the amount sounds relatively well controlled and much more like slightly heavy drinking than alcoholism. You can still be defined as an alcoholic even if you do find it easy to stop drinking altogether, if once you start drinking again, you are incapable of preventing yourself from binge drinking,though.

Do you really want to be a heavy drinker, though? Just because your friends are probably not all alcoholics, it doesn't mean they won't regret their behaviour when they're older. It's a bit like smoking, using sun beds, or dieting excessively - you don't know the extent of the harm it is or is not causing until it's too late, so is it really so important to you to maintain your current level of drinking, despite the long-term risks? Would you rather assume you'll get away with it, or rather not take the risk? And, of course, today's heavy drinker is not immune from becoming tomorrow's alcoholic.

ps I'm not saying you are a particularly heavy drinker, by the way, I think you just drink more than the recommended amount, so certainly shouldn't consider drinking any more! I should imagine there are a lot of people out there drinking more than you each week. Just so long as you aren't drinking the whole lot in one go!!!!

Crushed

If I'm honest, I've known several heavy drinkers in my time who make your drinking look a bit, well, toy, to be frank - not just your drinking now, but your drinking of noe bottle a night. Indeed, one of them was my long-term girlfriend so I know almost to the glass how much she drank and it was plenty more than that.

However, none of these heavy drinkers - and, for all sorts of reasons, we had many intimate converstaions - ever gave me the impression that "once you have one drink, resolve kind of goes out of the window".

That was much more like me.

None of the following - "going to seedy pubs on my own to drink and hide that from parents "met up with friends..." etc....sex with strangers when drunk in pub toilets...raped by so called boyfriend when passed out...secret drinking at home" - rings any bells re them either. Does with me.

Also, how do I know that these people were heavy drinkers and not alcoholic? Because their lives got more complicated and they moderated the drinking accordingly. I didn't. And, if you are honest, nor have you - if you had moderated your drinking accordingly, you wouldn't have anything to worry about. You have cut down, but clearly not enough to give you peace of mind that you are on top of it.

If this was someone else instead of you, what conclusions would you draw?

CrushedWithEyes you may be shocked to read this... I read an interview with a liver transplant surgeon recently. He said around half his patients considered themselves 'social' drinkers and were only having the equivalent of between half and a bottle of wine per day.

That's still between 35 and 70 units a week! For those who drink about half a bottle of wine a day,often, it is going to be the base amount,not the amount including weekends, dinners,going out etc.

It is harder to define yourself as an alcoholic or not when there is a lot of it in the family. I drink a lot in social situations often, but not amongst close friends. I think it is some sort of social anxiety, and quite possibly a way of alleviating boredom. I find it much easier these days to drink a bit and leave the rest of the bottle for another day (at home).

CrushedWithEyes - As your father was an alcoholic and there does appear to be a genetic component to alcoholism, I would cut back your drinking to what is more or less known to be a safe amount - ie no more than 3 units in one sitting and no more than 14 units in one week. If you can't do that, then why not try giving up altogether? My opinion only, of course, not firm medical advice from an expert who's got full knowledge of your medical history and current health!

Drinking excessively to alleviate social anxiety is not a good idea - lots of alcoholics started out that way. Better to find other ways to deal with social anxiety than getting yourself into a position where you don't particularly notice or care how you are behaving any more.