Spincter injury, fistula - support eachother?

[Cyee]

Hi everyone,

Wonderful weather we're having

I am propped up in bed post-hospital and I was wondering if anyone out there knows of, or would enjoy/benefit from, a thread or support site for people who have experienced the above (sphincter damage, fistula etc.) as a result of childbirth.

In my own experience, this whole area is a bit taboo. In fact the consultants reckon there are many women who have some symptoms related to the above, who never seek treatment. The thought of women embarrassed to discuss these matters is awful, yet that seems to be the case.

So - this (while souped up on painkillers) is a call to arms:

• Is there a site out there for women like us?
• If not, would you like there to be?
• Would a thread on MN especially for this, be useful?
• Would it be useful to share experiences with consultants/physios/hospitals/procedures?

If these matters resonate with you or anyone you know, it would be great if you could point them in this direction. I'm going to post in the 'health' and 'childbirth' sections too.

I know too well the taboo around this. I posted on MN when I got my diagnosis and used a different name...

Hope to hear from some people soon.

Cyee
(successfully repaired as of last Wednesday (fingers/legs crossed))

Happy New Year everybody!

Swings, I totally agree with 4jen that it will be much easier to have C-section rather than go through all this again. My consultant told me I would have to have a C-section if I have any more children. But now me and husband have decided not to have any more babies after what I am going through, sad isn't it.

Jacksmama, I hope that everything goes well in the OP for you on Feb. I have the faecal incontinence as well, fotunately it's first thing every morning, I hope it all clears up after my Op. not sure when to have it though because I just had a big argument with my consultant, I know it's silly thing to do before I have Op, but she is a terrible bully, after what I have gone through from my labour, this is the last thing I need. I feel that I have been let down by the NHS at two hospitals now.

Ok, to get the moan over with first: Oh god, an anal ultrasound? What freakin' next in this ludicrous farce that DS's birth and my down-below health turned into???
[tearing hair emoticon]

Moan over.

As you were.

If it continues after the OP, I'll suggest that. I hope not, but I don't see the OP affecting my sphincter though, since "all" it is is cutting out the nasty horrible scar and polyp that has formed in the scar from the piss-poor stitching job that was done after I tore (thanks to having salad tongs shoved up my bits rather than the C-section that no less than three consultants said afterwards which should have been done!!
[tearing hair out emoticon, take two]

Thanks for the suggestion 4jen, and thank you for the good wishes Fluffy. I will probably be back on here beginning of Feb whining for someone to hold my hand before the OP because I'm a bit nervous. About OPs in general, being in hospital (fearing a post-trauma relapse), being away from DS...

[feeling silly now as there are so many worse things emoticon]

Jacksmama- I had an anal scan after my third degree tear. It certainly wasn't the most pleasant experience but it was OK. Unfortunately, I was to scared to go back and get the results, wimping out at the last minute. So I have no idea how much sphincter damage I've got, although I'm sure it's plenty. Good luck with your op in Feb, hope it goes OK. Not surprised you are worried, I would be too, but fingers crossed it works. I've heard from lots of other mumsnetters that these ops can be extremely successful and can make sex pain free again!

Hello to everyone else on this thread, am a frequent lurker. I hope this year brings an improvement to everyones health.

That would be fabulous - looking forward to sex again? I (and DH) would be over the moon!

Jacks mama, the ultrasound really isn't as bad as it sounds. When I went for mine, I found that the nurses had put a picture of Where's Wally on the wall so I had something else to concentrate on!!

Hi all - hope you'r all having a great holiday season. Jacksmama, don't worry about the ultrasound - yours may not be exactly the same, but when I had mine, they used a probe about the diameter of an index finger (with a condom on - cue much hilarity - and tons of lube) and I lay on my side with my back to the doctor. It doesn't hurt, it just feels a bit wierd. It is really helpful diagnostically as it allows the docs to see exactly where and what the damage is. The resulting images are completely incomprehensible to the non-medic - I might as well have been looking at a picture of the Crab Nebula!
Fluffy, I'm so sorry to hear that you are dealing with an unhelpful consultant - it really is the last thing you need. Is there any chance of you being transferred to a different consultant at the same hospital, or going to a different hospital? I don't know where you are but the team who looked after me are superb.
and best wishes for a continent 2009 to us all.

Jacksmama, Th ultrasound isn't that bad at all. It does look like they are coming at you with a light sabre!, but they do only use the end of it. Deep breaths arrrgh!.

Poor fluffy cat, I don't know if you have the same consultant as me but mine was quite blunt in the way she spoke, which could be intimidating, however after the trauma of the birth I was quite blunt myself and we got on fine. I have to say that she did a fantastic job and was very helpful with letters for occupation health at my job. As others have said if your not happy with her, ask for someone else, just be aware that maybe charm is lacking but surgical skills may make up for it. I thought I would never have more children after such an awful experience but nearly 3 years on from DD's birth, I have decided I will. Let us know how you get on. X

I'm so sorry to hear about all your trials and tribulations, and operations and the rest.

Yes, I've had those tests. The ultrasound was fine, thankfully, and the physiology test showed a bit of sensation loss but nothing too major.

Truth is, in my case, I already had a bit of a problem following a neurological illness when I was a child. So bladder and bowel problems have cranked up a couple of notches but they were already there - which, for some ridiculous reason, I was a bit embarrassed to mention before.

So, I'm not sure whether the c-section is so important in my case, as I expect my symptoms are exacerbated by being an extended bf-er, but I will discuss it very extensively if and when the time comes.

Good luck to all of you. It certainly helps a lot to know there are a few of us about!

I'm so sorry to hear about all your trials and tribulations, and operations and the rest.

Yes, I've had those tests. The ultrasound was fine, thankfully, and the physiology test showed a bit of sensation loss but nothing too major.

Truth is, in my case, I already had a bit of a problem following a neurological illness when I was a child. So bladder and bowel problems have cranked up a couple of notches but they were already there - which, for some ridiculous reason, I was a bit embarrassed to mention before.

So, I'm not sure whether the c-section is so important in my case, as I expect my symptoms are exacerbated by being an extended bf-er, but I will discuss it very extensively if and when the time comes.

Good luck to all of you. It certainly helps a lot to know there are a few of us about!

oops

Swings, I'm curious how your symptoms are exacerbated by extended breast feeding - Jackbaby is nearly 11 months old and I plan to breastfeed as long as he wants to (well... if he's speaking in complete sentences and unbuttoning my shirt I might re-evaluated, but otherwise, on we go ). So just wondering if that will impact me?

Wowee - you've all been chatty!

Hi everyone and happy new year to you all. Welcome to all newcomers. I hope you stay around.

I think all the questions asked have been well answered, but for what it's worth:
Jacksmama: I would definitely consider getting the anal tests done before your op - because if they do identify something that needs fixing it might be better to get it all done at once? The ops themselves are straight forward, but the recovery can be painful, so wouldn't want you to have to go through that twice if it could be avoided. My experience with the exam is the same as above. Definitely not the nicest thing I've had done but absolutely no worse than a smear test. When I walked into the room I saw the lightsabre thingy and nearly turned on my heel to leave! The actual probe was a lot smaller and while I didn't enjoy someone meddling with my bum it wasn't remotely painful and once I was there it didn't take long either. The tests are really useful as BlueStocking said. They test the health of your nerves (ie when do you start feeling the sensation to 'go'), also the strength of the muscles and they can also see the smallest of holes if appropriate. These days they can do all sorts of sphincter reconstructions. When I was in hosp I met a woman who was having the anal equivalent of an electric garage door installed!! She literally had an implant that allowed her to trigger a poo at will. Your situation doesn't sound remotely that extreme but I am only too aware of the restriction that uncontrollable bowels/sphincters put on your life so if there's something that can be done I'm sure you'd want it to be done.

The other point was on the pelvic floor exercises. As this muscle is like a hammock, it's the same muscle that tightens around vagina, perineum and sphincter. So it's absolutely vital to do them properly, ideally under the initial supervision of a physio. The leaflets you get from the midwives are fine, but for those of us with problems it's better to work with experts because the quality of your efforts is vital to seeing results. For example you could clench til your heart's content, feel that the muscle has been well-exercised, but actually you've just knackered it rather than given it a good work out. I hope you do get good people. I benefited hugely by having a good physio. It's not clear from your posts (Jacksmama) if your physio was aware that you were also having sphincter issues. If they weren't I'd defintely recommend a return visit, if for no other reason than them confirming there's nothing more they can do.

Swingsand.. so sorry to hear about your car experience. It's awful I know. In terms of your lady parts (!!!) it may take a while for your bits to clean out, but I'd not recommend douching or anything like that before speaking to a doc or nurse. I know it's embarrassing but maybe you could consider ringing your doc for a quick conversation over the phone? I did this before actually going to my GP because I was so mortified and I found it easier to blurt the words out to a phone rather than a person. If they feel an infection is a possibility I'm sure they'll give you some antibiotics or recommend a douche or whatever. Try not to worry, as someone said, if you are pregnant nothing can get into your womb anyway. Vaginas are pretty resilient old things!

On the matter of whether to have a c section definitely go for a combo of medical advice and what feels right for you. I know c sections happen both for mechanical reasons (ie with me they'd be worried about my repair op being reversed) or for trauma reasons (eg my DH's cousin just had a planned c section as she was phobic about birth after a horrific first experience). If it is an emotional/psychological block then maybe counselling could help? Definitely be as brutally honest with your medical people as possible. My personal tendancy is to be all big and brave which usually ends up with me doing something I don't want to/am not ready to do. So don't be like me!!

I am sure I have missed out loads of things, but mainly wanted to post to say hello, welcome and I am so sorry you're having to post here in the first place. Please do stay around and ask as many questions as you need to. And most of all I hope you get the best of care. If you are not, speak up! You don't want to avoid treatment or have little confidence in your medical people. If they're not hitting the spot, tell someone. This is not just important for you, but important feedback for the medics themselves.

Take care everyone...

Bump! Hi everyone
DMCT - how are you? Haven't heard from you in a while. Have you moved already?

Hello all. Happy New Year. Just like to say I haven't got much to say about this atm but need to call my specialist nurse for ideas about timing for my repair soon.

I know you all have your problems for different reasons but this just being here does make me feel less freakish. Thank you!

Hi Jacksmama - don't know the technical details but I've been told by a Women's Health Physio and others that bfing continues the pg hormones that relax muscles (in prep for childbirth) so all your muscles are slacker when bfing and therefore they'll be some improvement in bladder for e.g. when bfing stops.
gotta go bed just wanted to answer that! night.

Thank you Cyee and Swings!! I'll be seeing my lovely GP soon and will ask to be referred for the alien anal probe ultrasound lightsabre thingie...
(a little bit of South Park humour for any of you who know the show...). BTW, my DH was looking over my shoulder when I read the post on the anal ultrasound and was incensed at the light sabre reference, LOLOLOLOLOL!! He is insane about a huge Star Wars fan and said that there is no way a light sabre would ever be put to such an iniquitous purpose... PMSL!!!

Hi everyone, Thanks 4Jen for the advice I think we are talking about the same consultant. Her manor was really cold but it was her attitude and lack of response which caused the argument she is such a Bully. I have received no letter no call since the consultation back in October,getting her PA to reply about an Operation date is impossible which has lead to the argument, she now refuses to operate on me and has said it will be very difficult getting anyone else at St. Marks to operate on me. My DH has put in a complaint saying she is far too big for her 6" White Stilettos. I am going to another Consultant surgeon @ a different hospital who is not vicious nor malicious for the operation. Its hard enough to cope with accepting this type of unnecessary damage without power mad surgeons threatening all sorts.
Hope all is going well for you Thingone and everyone else

I don't think there is any evidence at all for the fact that breastfeeding maintains the production of relaxin. It has bee said to me by several physios but I'm pretty certain it's one of those things people say but isn't actually fact. Needless to say I cannot remember any details to answer this more accurately now!

My physio said that, too, though - she told me that I'd not know for sure the extent of the damage until 6 months after I stop breast-feeding... which may be another couple of years. I am going to go ahead with the repair regardless because I'm sick of being in pain every time we have sex and I do not want this to go on until whenever Jackbaby weans himself.

Hola everyone!
Just to chip in on the relaxin conversation. My understanding is that bf-ing does cause physiological changes but that they are mainly hormonal, primarily affecting lubrication. My gyn said that bf-ing 'bits' are just like an old lady's!!! So that defo explains why sex can be more uncomfortable.. not that I was up for any such shennanigans before my op took place due to the nature of my problem

Hello Cyee,

Yes have moved and the pc has been in storage from early Dec, at my Mums, no broadband in the area just dial up - pain in the a**e, but such is Ireland.

Hubby doing a bit of re-training in NI, and in about 6 weeks we'll move up.

Had loadsa consultations since, sphincter intact, may have collagen injections in next year if symptons dont improve, other bits antomacally perfect - however examinations and therefore any thought of sex make me freeze, the gynae consulant gave me soem thing to use - try to use, but no good, not exactly a private place living back at home. Also the lil man is not happy with the move - think he preferred England!!! Eye teeth, and tonsillitos this week, plus people he doesnt know, a house he doesnt know, and no daddy. Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! Mental

Anyway didnt get the chance to read up on what has been going on with you, will try and get on again soon, if the lil man decides he might sleep...

Hope you , and everyone else on here have a good Xmas, and Happy new year..xx

Sorry about the spellings..

have no reason to post here but have stayed up to read this thread as i am so moved by your stories.
I hope 2009 is a better year for all of you and that some of your problems will be resolved.
once again thank you for sharing your stories

Awwwww! You're so sweet! Thank you!

Thanks for your lovely post Megantyler! Thanks for looking in on us

Hey DMCT! Glad the move is in full swing but sorry of course to hear about the catalogue of baby stuff. He has great timing!! Keep looking in on us when you can. It's rough dealing with dial-up when you're used to broadband isn't it!

I know I shouldn't laugh but the thought of collagen injections in your ar*e... can you get them to do some face work while they're there? Not that I'm saying you need any of course

Take care all - hope things are going ok.

Oh random question - have any of you ladies conceived since having sphincter type injury/repair? Do you know if there are any possible issues? Think that time of ttc-ing is drawing near.... yikes.

Bye and have a good evening