Shyte teeth - the sequel

[shyteteeth]

I know this won't interest most of you - but for anyone who is interested in what happened during my 'second opinion' appointment.

The ridges/cracks have been caused by a bite problem - massive amounts of tooth grinding at night.

He also said I have gum problems which the NHS dentist should have picked up on and treated - they've done nothing about it the whole time I've been seeing them.

Now I'm looking at correcting the bite problem, having my 2 top front teeth sorted out and the gum problem repaired.

Does anyone now how much it will cost (roughly) to get caps/crowns on two teeth when you go private??

The potential bill for this (including the bite correction and gum treatment) is going to be ENORMOUS

Bloody hell. I go every 3-6 months and NHS dentist has basically watched my mouth fall apart - despite me asking what I could do about the front tooth problem!! I also specifically told them that gum problems ran in my family.

I 100% support the NHS (had hospital appointments a few months back and they were fantastic) - but this is ridiculous.

As a dentist I am very interssted in this.
Can you post a link to a previous thread?
Thanks

It sounds like it will be expensive.

I am wondering whether two veneers will be enough. I have had cosmetic work done, and they pretty much had to do 6 teeth in the front to get a good match.

I've no idea what a gum repair entails. Is it a transplant, or some way of regenerating gum tissue? Are you already doing daily Corsodyl rinses?

I would suggest that you take a long term view - eg 3 years, and work with your dentist to achieve what you want in that time. The actual treatment for straightforward veneers isn't too bad - just a few impressions before final fitting.

If you get veneers, it is a big problem that you are grinding. When I had my veneers, the dentist made me a splint (it looked a bit like an athletic guard, but much harder), to wear to protect the expensive work. I admit to not really wearing it (except when I am grinding), and my new dentist said that I needed one. He quoted me £600 for what is essential a mouthguard (he fitted DS for rugby and only charged £60). Fortunately, the one that came with the veneers still fitted, so I started using that.

Anyway, don't underestimate the value of having a nice smile. Although it can be very expensive, it is worth every penny. Work with your dentist to ensure that he knows what your goals are, and then you can map out a route to get there.

Thanks ScienceTeacher - I miss my smile so will pay as much as I can afford to get it back!

Hi Jasper - fraid I don't know how to post links ... but I can give you a brief description of what happened...

I've had terrible ridges on the biting edge of my two top teeth for a few years now. It recently got much worse (over the last 6 months or so) and a crack appeared on the front side. The biting edge seemed to be 'wearing away' and is extremely discoloured.

I go regularly to my NHS dentist and was always amazed they never mentinoed what a state they were in. I am very ashamed of them myself so only plucked up the courage to ask her on my last visit. She said (I'm paraphrasing but this is the gist): 'This is quite a common problem, and there's not much you can do about it...'

On the strength of that wonderful advice, I posted here and booked in with a private practice for a second opinion.

They do a massive report on my teeth which I have to go back to go through next week (it won't make pleasant reading).

What he did say today though was there was significant gum damage (which should have been treated) and that I had a major bite/grinding problem.

When I said I went regularly to NHS dentist and even mentioned my family's gum problems, he said it was tantamount to neglect.

Am in shock that I was told nothing much could be done. I could have dealt with this earlier if given the proper advice/guidance from my regular dentist - and probably saved a huge amount of money.

Jasper - is treating gum problems part and parcel of the regular service that an NHS dental practice should provide?

Like I said though, the hospital peeps that treated me at my NHS hospital appointments were really brilliant - I definitely have no gripe with the NHS as a whole.

Am feeling very sorry for myself tonight!

Sorry Scienceteacher - missed the bit about corsydol - I've been using another brand - is this one specifically for gum problems?

Should the dentist have recommended this to me?

Yes you will need a mouth splint if you grind your teeth. I had veneers and managed to grind them off

Hi Saffy - what's a mouth splint? It sounds painful

I think gum problems are not covered on the NHS (that's what my dentist had just told me anyway) but they can referr you to a (private) periodontist.

A mouth splint is just a mouth guard Made out of plastic and made to measure. Mine normally cost £35.00

Phew - thanks Saffy!!

Bramshott, is that really true about gums and the NHS? Surely they should tell you that you need treatment though?

I would have thought gums were part and parcel of dental treatment - NHS or private.

It looks like I'm going down the private route now anyway - (I want teeth when I'm 40 !)

i just had two old crowns replaced privately - drilled off old crowns that gums had receded around, cleaned up gold posts, made fab new crowns that fit right up into gum line and look like the teeth on either side. Also had small filling on another front tooth replaced. South East England, £1,000 all in.

also quoted for a new crown on old root-canal back tooth, another £500

Solved my gum problems with a Philips Sonicair (or something like that) toothbrush, electric, is FANTASTIC can highly recommend.

Scienceteacher - have just re-read your post again...I think I missed a whole chunk of your post - sorry! Now see you had a splint as well (and you explained what it was and I missed that ). The dentist I went to today is quite a promoter of the fact a guard (so I guess splint) doesn't fix the problem. His practice promotes 'bite correction' - what on earth does this involve do you think?

I'm imagining jaws being smashed with a mallet and reset in the right place (...did I say I was a bit all over the place this evening?!).

I hate hate hate being at the dentist and the thought of spending what feels like the rest of my forseeable there having horrible things done to gums and bites is just making for a really bad evening!

Missingtheaction - really? I always thought the electric toothbrush thing was more hype than anything?
Would you recommend it for receding gums then?

Thanks for putting some sort of cost on the crowns - gives me some idea of what I'm should be expecting - can faint in horror now rather than at the follow-up appointment next week...

Sorry guys - I'm just so scared - having had so much bad news all in the same appointment!

Does anyone know what 'gum treatment' actually involves. I don't think they're totally horrendous, but he said the pockets around the teeth are deeper than they should be.

For any people with no interest in my teeth - sorry

treating gum problems is absolutely part and parcel of what an NHS dentist does.

Can I just make it clear there is no such thing as "an NHS dentist" or 'a private dentist". We all have the same qualifications.

A dentist who works for the NHS is obliged to work under certain government regulated constraints( the government sets all fees for example) but also benefits from government funding to do so.(for example grants for rent and rates on property )

Someone who chooses to work outwith the NHS is free of those constraints (ie can charge what they like) but won't get certain grants. AND IS NOT SUBJECT TO THE SAME LEVEL OF SCRUTINY !

It is an absolute myth that private always means better. The worst dentistry I have ever seen was carried out privately, and at great cost to the patient.

The crowns I provide ( on the NHS at a cost of about 100 pounds per crown) are better than most I have ever seen . I also work in dental hospitals and see a huge range of dental work.

On the whole I would say that dental tratment provided in the Uk is of a high standard .
I see poor dentistry only rarely - poorly looked after mouths and bad oral hygiene all the time but that is a f different thing!

I would wait till you read the report from dentist number two before drawing any conclusions.
It may well be the case dentist number one was negligent regards your gums. It may be that dentist number 2 is somewhat over eager. or dantist number 2 may be the biggest gums hot shot in the country.

What ever the truth it has nothing to do with the NHS/private thing.
I hope this is of some helf and I await the next installment with interest.

PS Veneers not suitable restorations if the problem is grinding.

sory about typos - too tired to preview, typing faster than I should as you have touched a subject close to my heart.

Hi Jasper,
I hoped to make it clear I didn't want this to be an NHS / private issue - perhaps I wasn't...
I wholeheartedly support and benefit from the service the NHS provides. I do understand the nuances between NHS dentist / dentist working for the NHS too. My last dentist in London was fantastic and did both NHS and private work.

My issue is with the dentist full stop. She could be NHS / private / from Mars - I still feel she totally failed me.

Should she not have given me treatment for my gum problems? Even I can see my gums are receding terribly on my top teeth. I told her this worried me and explained my Mum had very bad gum problems.

Should she not have treated the crack on the front face of my top tooth - or at least brought the subject up?? You can't miss it (or the ridges on the biting surface).

Please don't think I'm having a go at the NHS as a whole, I think I did try and make that clear.

I am having a go at my dentist who works for the NHS though.

I'd be interested to hear what you think.
I'll certainly post again once I've gone back to get the report.

Shyte-Teeth-Enders - Shyte-Teeth Street - Shyte-teeth Farm could become quite a popular spot for people with an interest in dental matters

Hi again Jasper,

Just wanted to say something else that I forgot to say. I would have gone for an second opinion on the NHS but absolutely no one is taking on new NHS patients in my area. The dental health foundation reassured me that it would be okay to seek a second opinion from a private dentist (I was worried I may not be able to go back to my NHS place after seeking help privately). I do actually want to continue to get treatment on the NHS (and can't afford not to really!)

I know my using the terms 'NHS dentist' 'Private dentist' probably riles you but it's just the simplest way I can explain the situation

hi Shyteteth, I do apologise for using your thread as my own personal public forum in the NHS /Private debate I was kind of overstating the case in case a casual reader of the thread came to the conclusion NHS = crap, need to pay privately for decent treatment.

You should see how this rages on dental forums!

In answer to your question, should any gum problems have been treated? YES YES YES! Even by a dentist from Mars!

I will be interested to see what dentist number 2 has to say about the extent of the problem.

Re crack on front face of tooth. How bad is it? Do your friends point it out or say you have something stuck to your tooth? Vertical hairline fractures in the enamel , only seen at close range are common and not nec. anything to worry about . Hard to commment without seeing it.

Ridges on biting surface? I woud not nec bring this up with a patient unless they did so first. You would be amazed at what some people tolerate in their teeth. I have said to ppeople with a black front tooth( I really do mean BLACK) "have you ever considered having anything done about that?" and thay say no they are not at all bothered ( or even "what do you mean, dark front tooth?")
Now I always ask a general question along the lines of "are you generally happy with the appearance of your teeth ?"

Don't worry Jasper - I didn't take it badly -just wanted to be sure you knew I wasn't having a go at the NHS!

In respose to you 'is it black' question - yes!! The ridges on the biting surface (not the front of the tooth) are black. They scream at me every time I see them. Friends and family have now noticed and I'm extremely self-conscious.

They don't hurt at all though

I will definitely post again after the report. Where are you btw - can I come and see you?

the teeth with black biting surfaces - top or bottom teeth?

I am in Scotland!

also do you mind telling me how old you are?

It's like the enamel's worn off and the innards have been really badly stained (almost black). But it looks like a dark sandwich within the enamel that's still hanging in there. It's the two top front teeth.

God sorry, it really is horrid!! I honestly brush religiously, use mouthwash, floss and it's never been more than 6 months between appointments so feel very unlucky. (Actually there was a 12 month gap one time...).

You're in Scotland - I'm in Bournemouth - I guess that won't work then

Thanks for the advice though. I'll definately post again once I've gone through the report and located some cardboard boxes to live in while I get the treatment!

I'm 35...

rus thread for Jasper

That should say previous!

And tbh I would hold off using Corsodyl until told, it can badly stain teeth if used over a long period of time & considering what you have said, staining is already an issue.

thanks sandcastles you techy genius and dispenser of good dental advice

shyteteeth will post tomorrow

off to cough myself to sleep