Worried about family getting enough calories

[Tatoumorse]

We've been very poor lately, paying back debts, I have researched all of our entitlements where we live (abroad).

I'm constantly cold now it's winter as per last year, and my teenage boy and younger one are always hungry. Today googling other things I think we may be undernourished, never crossed my mind before.
I thought we have a healthy diet, porridge/yoghurt breakfast, boiled egg/peanut butter toast for lunch, with a small cereal bar each, then pasta/rice-based veggie dish or chicken for tea, occasional burgers and occasional cake.
But today I added up the calories and we get approx 500 max per day if I calculated correctly. I'm really worried this is way off what we should be getting and may be a source of several health problems now that I'm joining the dots.
I am not a bad parent but I had a poor upbringing, not to blame that, but I never learnt about nutrition, I was actuallly more worried about overfeeding my kids (unhealthy snacks, etc.) Now I feel awful.

On a VERY limited income, how can I boost our calorie intake in a healthy way quickly? I wonder about protein shakes, or noodle snacks? Any advice please, but not on the debt issue as that is in hand, I had expert advice on it etc. and am just having to do my best and pay back over a 2 year period

Are you sure you're not confusing kcal with kJ?

If you were genuinely eating 500 calories a day, you'd be losing a lot of weight, very quickly.

You would all be severely underweight on 500 calories a day.

Would the local Emmaus have any second-hand cooking appliances?
Would the local Mairie be able to provide any information about local community food initiatives for feeding children, or the would local Parish be able to help? Can you advise the children to eat as big a meal at the school cantine as possible to fill up?

I don't know what kind of area you're in but trying either cash and carry type places or Asian supermarkets mean you can buy huge sacks of rice/maybe pasta, lentils, beans etc which work out a heck of a lot cheaper by weight than smaller supermarket packets. In your place I'd be stuffing those kids with as much daal and rice as they could eat and topping it up with fruit (fresh or frozen, can always stew it up and serve with yoghurt).

The diet you describe is lacking in vitamin C. Vitamin C affects collagen synthesis so I think if your kids have hypermobility then you def need to make sure they are getting enough vitamin C. People like to cook their vegetables because it makes the meals more interesting but raw vegetables will preserve vitamin C better. (Although if you are using frozen veg a lot, then you probably have to cook them or else you might worry about bacterial contamination). Or you could add a little orange juice daily. Peanut butter is full of nutrients, so that's great. Meat has B vitamins, as does milk, but I've found milk very expensive when it comes to teenage boys. They go through it quickly! If you're worried about calories, switch to full fat milk. Pulses (peas and beans) are a complete protein source when combined with a grain (usually wheat or rice) but easy to forget about as many need to be soaked before cooking. I tend to forget I've soaked them and then find them a week later, fermenting in the refrigerator. And then that's a waste of food. I find lentils the easiest to work with as I don't need to soak them in advance.

I don't think she means they have e.g. porridge AND yoghurt for breakfast, I think she means they have one or the other. And for lunch it's toast and egg OR toast and peanut butter.

Just because she formats pasta/rice the same way and you wouldn't have both in the same meal would you.

So I think it could easily be a far too low amount of calories, esp if when the OP says "I was actually more worried about overfeeding my kids (unhealthy snacks, etc.)" that might indicate that she has a poor relationship with food herself and has followed on with her kids. (Not saying she does, but many people do)

Porridge is cheap. So give them more of it in the morning. If you can, make it with full fat milk - same price as other milk but more calories.

Cereal bars are a waste of money. Spend the money on bananas or bags of red lentils which cook really quickly to make a rich dhal or soup - good source of protein and calories.

Add seasonal veg. it may not have masses of calories but it is filling and full of nutrients - cabbage bubble and squeak; roast sweet potatoes etc.

Is there any way you can contact the companies you owe money to and ask for an interest cut or a reprieve of some kind?

Are there debt agencies in France that can help you with approaching the companies?

Hair loss could be down to low b12.
Dont leave that, get a gp appointment and insist your bloods are checked.
They ignored / fobbed me off for years and now I have permanent nerve damage.

In France do they have an equivalent of Freecycle? You should be able to get things like microwave and toaster free of charge from wealthy local people upgrading. You certainly could in any non-rural part of UK.

I didn't know you could do crispy jackets in a slow cooker, genius! My top filling, calorific budget meals would be:

• red lentil daal - the one I do is a slow cooker one but there are thousands of recipes online for all types of cooker.
• Nigella's splitpea soup - admittedly daal-adjacent but still very delicious.
• pearl barley stew made with whatever cheap cuts of meat you can get - so lamb neck, brisket/stewing beef, chicken thighs etc - you really don't need much meat to flavour a stew and pearl barley plus dumplings (s-r flour, olive oil oil and water) is so filling.
• chilli - I like chicken thigh chilli, bulked out with sweet potato and lentils.
• carrot soup - the Pinch of Yum one with coconut milk is great and very easy.
• potato gratin of some kind - there's a great Nigel Slater one with cream and smoked mackerel - you could use tinned fish to keep costs down, and those boxes of UHT creme liquide that the French (and I!) love.

What's your nearest ethnic minority community, OP? If there's a supermarket there you'll likely get better prices on a lot of foods that are staples of that culture.

Also, have I understood wrong or are you saying you moved to France from UK/Ireland because accommodation was cheaper? Do you have a support network there?

I absolutely agree, it does sound like far too little calories (and also variety. I would be worried about them getting enough vitamins, iron, b12 etc).

And even the 1000 - 1400 would still be too low for active (or non-active) teenage boys.

But if OP honestly meant that a regular lunch might be boiled egg (how many?) with a small cereal bar? And if OP truly considered that a healthy (and normal) lunch?
I would find that attitude to food concerning. Which would be a separate issue to consider (apart from the financial issues).

If you are in France go to the doctor and get the DC's BMI checked, if they are underweight the doctor can prescribe them protein drinks which you will get for free.

I think you are getting more than 500 calories but you aren't getting a lot of variety. Not a lot of protein or fruit and veg in there.

I'm so sorry you are going through this stressful time.

Porridge isn’t cheap in France, it’s not a popular breakfast cereal here. The french usually eat just a small breakfast and then a large lunch and dinner.
Veg is very expensive in France.
Cauliflowers, which are mass produced in Brittany are €3 a cabbage is at least €2, potatoes are €2. a kilo atm., even onions are €1.50 a net.

@Tatoumorse do you ever get chance to buy a €1 box of veg in Lidl, there’s often a lot of the same in there but sometimes they’re quite good?

It’s no fun being poor in France without a garden to grow food.

Pasta and rice is cheap so I’d have lots of that with meals. Can add veggies and meat if you can afford it. Buy full fat milk and maybe some cheap cakes etc. Cook with oil too to add calories.

if you’re struggling that much do you have a food bank you can use?

Haven't read thread, @Tatoumorse , but would just advise using animal fats (not seed oils) which (a) provide good source of extra calories (we used to have dripping butties back in the day, yummy salted) and (b) enable absorption of vitamins taken with other foods.

I think your food is fine in general, just need larger portions.

Minestrone soup is my suggestion for lunches. You can look up a basic recipe but it’s a one pot on hob chunky soup that can be any veg, any beans, any pasta, with tomatoey herb flavour. So it’s great to make a healthy filling lunch cheaply as you can swap by what is in season or what you have. Have with bread and butter, and boiled egg on side for extra calories

Try:
Breakfast : porridge as usual, add more oats so larger portions. Serve with spoon peanut butter stirred in and banana chopped ontop

Lunch : Minestrone soup, bread, boiled egg on side.

Dinner : similar to what you currently have. Add extra pasta or rice. Try and add veg.

Snacks: big pot Greek yogurt, children can have with honey/ peanut butter. Bananas. Satsumas in season now. Cream cheese on toast.

Hi. Lots of sensible answers here. And yes your maths off. I haven’t read where you are abroad. I live on thé Côte d’Azur France. Can give you lots of advice. Why are your boys not at school, as surely they get a free school meal there if you are on low income? If you are in France loads of available help, for accommodation, and minimum wage, caf (child help) Lidl very cheap. Very cheap to buy cheapest cuts boeuf bourguignon (Lidl not the best, Auchan carrefour) you can make boulots meals (curry’s, casseroles) buy biggest tins of cheap tomatoes, can mix in your nutritimix, with onion, garlic, spices, teaspoon sugar , to make pasta sauce. Buy in bulk freeze rest. Biggest bags of Emmantel rape. Buy dried chick peas and beans. Soak and cook. Look for last date sales and baskets of unsold food. Cook what you can, or freeze. Wish you look

A lot of people are suggesting filling meals but they are not necessarily calorific for growing children.
The cheapest food in terms of calories per unit cost, in the UK, is biscuits. I imagine it's similar in France and there is absolutely no harm in your DSs having a few biscuits as a snack after school/after dinner.

If you have access to Apple and pear trees and can harvest fruit from that then you can freeze or stew and keep in Kilner jars, my DM did this when we were kids. Same with plums etc.

Where do you shop, OP?

I would have a look at places like Lidl if there is one near you. For dry goods like pasta and rice, decide what you want to buy, e.g. long grain white rice, or penne, and then buy whatever is cheapest per kilo if you possibly can. Most people think this means buying the largest quantity possible but this isn't always the case. I quite often see, for example, two 500g bags costing less than a 1kg bag of the exact same pasta. Always, always check the price per kg.

Fruit and veg wise you need to get used to calculating prices in kg to work out what is cheapest. Have a look at how much it would cost to get frozen fruit and veg compared to fresh. Frozen peas are a good, cost effective way of adding a portion of veg to a meal and the good thing with frozen veg is there is no wastage. Buy the cheapest frozen peas you can find from the cheapest supermarket. They are all the same.

For fresh fruit and veg, go to your local market and have a good look at all the prices. Walk round with a notepad and compare the prices between different vendors and work out who is the cheapest and how their prices compare to supermarkets. Keep a running tally of how much different fruits and vegetables cost, from whom, and when, because the prices will change from week to week, but you will get a sense of what is cheapest according to the season and who is best to buy from. And go to the market close to closing time when they will start flogging things off more cheaply. Figure out who to buy from and then go back to them regularly so you get to know them, they're more likely to do you a good deal if they know you.

That’s got to be a maths error. It doesn’t sound like much good though.

You moved from Ireland to France to be able to buy a flat, but the flat you bought doesn’t have an oven and because you’re now abroad you have less flexibility in repaying your debts in Ireland - is that right? Is it worth reconsidering whether staying in France is actually the best option going forward, if it means you can’t feed your children?