Disgusting head lice again

[Robinw]

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Thanks, Robinw. I spent an hour tonight going through my daughters hair, first with an electric bug buster, and then with a wet comb. Unfortunately I found another adult with the electric one, and about 8 little ones. I found quite a lot of very small black/brown bits with the nit comb. Are these the eggs or have they hatched & I just couldn't see the legs? Given that I shall be wet-combing for the next 2 weeks anyway, does it really matter. Oh, I've also been told that you should change all bedding etc. Is this really necessary, and if so do you just do it for the first night or what (I can't face all that washing if you're supposed to do it every night!). Final question, have you ever had to check your own hair? Hubby is away til Friday & I don't think I can stand the suspense!

By the way, my daughter has apparently told all her friends at school that she has bugs in her hair so they shouldn't rub heads with her! They seem to think its a really cool thing & all asked about it - how attitudes have changed. I'm not sure what will happen tomorrow though, when they have all told their mums. I did speak to her 3 best friends mums, so it won't come as too much of a suprise.

Hi Debsb, I know that "omigod" nit knee jerk reaction! My daughter and son both had the big Ns very noticeably about 5 weeks ago, and we did blitz them with marathion, but they hated the smell and it didn't work anyway (supernit now in existence). SO - we have done the wet combing every night for the first two weeks (we found some eggs that look like creamy full stops) just with the tea tree leave in conditioner spray (it's made by Lanes). Now we have been also using this stuff called Biz Niz by Maristow's from Holland & Barrett; it has lots of essential oils in it and I have been working it into their hair each morning before they go to skool as a preventative. I hate changing their bunk beds so have only done it at the normal intervals. It is really OK, there is no stigma now - I reckon lots of parents don't know the nits are there, or perhaps even ignore them, which is a pain - but really the wet combing is fine, the kids go along with it (they are 2 and 4) and we keep their hair short. It must be a different matter if they have very long, thick or curly hair. Good luck with them.

In case anyone is interested, Maristows have a web site - www.maristows.co.uk and I think you can order their stuff from there. It seems to be working for us.

Kathryn

I think you can do a reasonable self-check by taking a nit comb, leaning over a piece of white paper, combing away, and paying special attention to the hairline around the ears. I do this whenever there are nits at my son's nursery as I always, always start itching like fury as soon as I see the poster. Will invest in some Biz Niz as this sounds more my thing than malathion or permethrim.

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I haven't experienced headlice yet, and would appreciate some advice. My son starts in a nursery class after Easter (he's 3.5), and there is currently an outbreak at his nursery. I was surprised to hear that if nits are found, children are sent home, and may not return until they are fully clear (how long does that take?) Is this standard national policy? It applies at the primary school too, and seems rather draconian to me, and not encouraging people to report nits at all. Any comments?

I always keep his hair pretty short 0.5 - 1", (sorry 1 - 2.5 cms!). Does this mean he is very low risk, or not? Would you recommend this Biz Niz as prevention during an outbreak, even for such short hair, or is it not necessary?

HI KMG

Yes, this nit thing is a worry. My daughter got them within a day of being at "big school". I'm not sure about the requirement to take them out of School; it seems so outdated as so many of the kids will pick them up and surely lots of parents might not know and won't want to inform the schools if these draconian measures are in place. I really think the combing through is such a good idea; we now do it to both our kids each morning, and the Biz Niz smells nice and makes it easy to comb their hair with the fine comb and conditions their hair. I think the official word would have it that nothing can prevent "THEM", but I like to think this nips any outbreaks in the bud by removing any eggs (they look like creamy full stops) and imobilising the nits if there are any there. It is working for us and last week we got another letter from School saying there was an outbreak. The combing through has become part of our routine and the kids happily accept it and it makes us feel more in control. Hope this is helpful.

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To help with the nit porblem I can recomend the following: quassia bark chips available from good health food shops.Soak a spoonfull in a mug of boiling water and when cool use as a rinse after normal shampoo. Use the plastic combs as the teeth are much closer togther than the metal ones. Unfortunately you quite often have to strip the eggs out by hand - a good set of fingernails is essential! Finally mix two drops each of oil of rosemary,eucalyptus,geranium and lavender in half a mug of warm water and then decant this into a spray type bottle (for ease of use) and daily spray onto the head particlarly onto the scalp, behind the ears and nape of neck. It smells lovely and my two daughters have been clear of lice for two years despite numerous outbreaks at school. By the way I always make sure they have their hair tied up for school and don't swap hairbands etc. Every now and then I use the aromatherapy oil solution as a prevetion. I hope this helps.

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For excellent advice and a comb-kit, and silly stickers you might want to try www.nits.net/bugbusting from the Community Hygiene Concern people, a UK charity who are deeply into getting parents mobilised to get rid of lice. I suspect you'll never get everyone to comb/treat all their kids and it's as well to learn the technique, do a regular check on your bunch and have a regime lined up, without spending loads on special shampoos etc.

as a preventative,along with weekly washes in tea tree and lavender shampoo and wet combing with tea tree conditioner I spray my son's hair with Nitty Gritty spray - which smells ok and isn't sticky - available from Pedlars by mail order (£9.99 plus pp £2.00) TEL:01330 850400

Nit novice seeks advice...does anyone out there have experience of checking very small children's hair for lice? Our son is only two and we know they have them at the nursery, so we have been wet-combing with conditioner for the past three days and found what might have been one louse and a couple of eggs, but that's all. He is definitely scratching. I've not had to deal with this one before - what am I looking for? Can you actually see the lice moving in the hair? How do you tell a nit from a piece of dead skin? And any tips on what treatments work for smaller people? The wet-combing is no joke and is transforming our former happy bathtimes into a vale of tears. How often do you have to wet-comb as a preventative?

Welcome to the wonderful world of nits! I'm no expert myself, Marina, but here's what I do, learned through trial and error with my oldest and now applied to my nearly 2-year old.

Wet comb with conditioner once a week as a precaution. Look out for little bits of black grit attached to the hair near the scalp. These are eggs. The nits themselves do crawl around, like tiny beetles.Easier to see on lighter coloured hair.

If an egg or nit is still there after you have wet combed, get each between a finger and thumb nail and move it along the individual hair until it is out.

If you see and remove eggs etc, assume you havn't got them all in one go. Wet comb the next day too. Repeat until you have one nit free day, then you can assume you are free of nits and go back to a once a week routine. (Must say I get a bit lazy at this point and it might end up being once a fortnight).

Also you can try a shampoo. I tried one called 'Full Marks' available behind the counter at chemists. It is suitable for the whole family - we have all used it. I used it on my youngest when he was 14 months old. No problems whatsoever, no tears because the shampoo was too harsh (something I was dreading) and it did kill the live nits. But there were still some nit eggs left, possibly dead, but you can't be sure. You still have to pick these out.

As for the approach you take, difficult. Bug busting is sooo boring, isn't it? After years of pretending to my older son that it was a nice-ish and necessary part of his weekly grooming regime, I came clean and told him I hated the whole thing as much as him, as in 'come on, let's get it over with so we can watch TV'. Shared misery produces a slightly more cooperative attitude. And son takes great delight in being shown the 'evidence' on the comb. I usually over-exaggerate the size and virulence of the little commuinity residing
in his hair, to make him feel the combing is really worthwhile. As in ' you should have seen that one, it was enormous - it must have jumped 6 inches .....'

This approach may not be appropriate for your son right now, but possibly worth bearing in mind for later.

Marina, I would just like to add to what Tigermoth has said in that pregnant women and breast feeding women must be careful with the treatments from the chemist. Some products advise against using them if you are pregnant or breastfeeding.

I never encountered nits until my daughter was 8 and boy did their presence make up for those 8 years of nit free existance! I started off with the view that chemicals weren't going near my daughter and tried everything from olive oil and vinegar to lavander and tea tree to concoctions of chinese herbs...nothing worked!! In despair tried chemicals....nothing worked..... I got sick of people telling me that I obviously wasn't washing out combs, bedding etc... went to the doctors in utter despair... doctor had no solutions beyond the chemists and did mention that I was not alone and she was seeing many, many parents who could not shift them even with the chemical solutions. However,the best advice I got was from a fantastic Australian Chemist who did not flinch at my queries (as so many others had) but stood and calming explained to me in a shop full of customers, gradually edging away from me, that the only was to get rid of nits is to physically remove them with a comb. And sometimes it hurts. Conditioner is good. It takes time and should be followed up two-three days later and then possibly a few days later again. We have finally kept them at bay by doing this on a very regular basis. Sorry there are no easy answers, I certainly don't envy you with a small child, but I am afraid the discomfort is worth it. Good luck.

All you have to do to get rid of lice is wet-comb (with conditioner makes it easier and traps them better too) every two or three days for a couple of weeks. Once you've got all the adults out the first couple of times, the eggs take a while to hatch, but the babies don't breed straight away. So if you keep up the combing for a fortnight, you should catch them all.

With a fine-toothed nit-comb, natch.

There are really no combs that have teeth close enough together to completely remove all eggs. If they were close enough they would not go through the hair.
Vinegar does not kill lice, but a vinegar rinse will melt the glue that attaches the eggs to the hair. Maristows have a new web site www.lemonburst.net. changed form the one listed above.
Wet combing, bug busting, robo combs, organophosphate based treatments. None of these will prevent a brand new infestation 24 hours later from the same source.
Lye clear, full marks, derbac etc all use either organophosphates or permithrins to kill lice.
These are highly toxic chemicals.
Research in the US shows that permithrins are no longer effective due to an immunity developed by the lice due to overuse. (put permithrins in any search engine for research results)
Organophoshates are neuro toxic and work by inhibiting the cholinesterase in the nervous system (of lice and humans)which is essential for fully functioning motor controls.
Hence people suffering OP poisoning suffer ME like symptoms at onset.
The cholinesterase will build up again over time. (this is why they have a safety license.)
IF the level of ops is not constant and there is no other background OP in use. (fly sprays, plant sprays fly kilers, dog or cat flea treatments and collars etc)This research was developed by testing on adults not children.
It is not known what the continual use of OPs on children will do to their growing nervous systems.
As a mum of Jess aged 8 I can honestly say that we have not had lice in the last five years due to using the product listed above; BIZ NIZ

Thanks to everyone who offered advice and words of comfort. I know wet-combing is the approved and ideal way to go but our normally happy little son sobs heart-breakingly while we do it and he is to young to understand properly why we have to.

I found three websites which might be of interest to others in the same predicament:

Nitty Gritty
Turned my order round within 24 hours, helpful reply to my concerns about essential oils and young children
Maristows
Makers of Biz Niz, also helpful and responsive to questions, am off to buy some from Superdrug who stock it
Bug Buster Campaign
Informative site on the wet-combing method, rather a shame they could not resist taking a pop at the natural remedies market, I felt.

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Bloss, brainwave. Of course it doesn't have to be done in the bath! I think he deserves some chocolate for putting up with it. It's bad enough doing your own hair but having someone wet-comb me would make me weep too.

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Bloss, good idea. Just like to add, do you put a towel or two round his shoulders as well? or on the carpert? I find when I wet-comb, all the necessary rinsing of the comb in water, not to mention the conditioner in the hair, results in lots of water splashes - perhaps we're just a messy family!!

Biz Niz (mentioned earlier seems to work well for us.

Holland & Barret do not stock it any more, but lemonburst.net delivered within two days.