Has anyone decided not to go for a routine mammogram?

[hattie43]

I'm curious to know . I have mine next week and will attend but last time was a nightmare as I was recalled and health anxiety went through the roof . Luckily no cancer . I was reading that about 30% of women don't attend Apparently mammograms don't pick up everything and aren't foolproof , but surely they are better than nothing .

WiseUpJanetWeiss · Yesterday 18:59
Someone who has never had the procedure shouldn’t be spouting bollocks about it. That’s my motivation, if it’s alright with you?

You stated categorically that mammograms are not painful. This is true for you but is obviously not true for everyone. There are plenty of women on this thread reporting that it was painful for them. The fact that the poster herself has not had a mammogram doesn’t make you right.

The women on this thread who found mammograms painful are not telling you that you are wrong to find them OK, are they? So why are you belittling them with your “it’s not painful”?“

Oh sod off. I’m not belittling women on this thread who found them painful. I’m belittling one poster who has never had one but states they’re painful and invasive.

No idea what your agenda is or why you’re trying to put people off a simple procedure that may well save their lives.

RampantIvy · Yesterday 20:15
I would like to know where these rude healthcare professionals who work at breast screening clinics are.

I have had several mammograms at our local breast screening clinic in Barnsley, and the staff have been nothing but polite and respectful“

Quite. Same experience in three health authorities over the years. My breast surgeon and breast nurse were completely wonderful.

I don’t understand why some people on this thread are encouraging other women (and a few men) to refuse potentially life saving treatment.

"And there is another example of sexism."

I'd suggest describing anyone that disagrees with you as "shrieking"
and "screaming" as utilising sexist language.

I don't enjoy mammograms. They are unpleasant. However my Mum's BC was discovered later than ideal with no external signs (tumour in armpit). So I'm happy to have a better chance of dealing with it earlier.

Hmm … your friend was ‘shamed’ at mammogram because they had a boob job. What does this actually mean. Surely at a mammogram breast implants would be relevant in some way. ( I’m not a mammography so I don’t know but it possibly shows up or is info needed for management or interpretation of the procedure).
Are you sure you are not being excessively over sensitive about what might be normal interaction at this medical appointment?
And you are finding another accusation to throw at the people you do the mammograms. They can’t all be evil people taking every opportunity to insult the patients, that’s nonsense.
And good for you if you have private health care, it can be very useful but you might find it’s not much help if you ever do need cancer treatment

Also, is there any evidence of over treatment from the screening tests for the bowel etc and cervix which you say you attend?

I can think of plenty. Easy enough to ask for another one. I've had quite a few mammograms and never encountered any rude staff, quite the contrary. I've not found it particularly painful and the discomfort is very brief. Routine mammograms - yes please. Several close relatives died of breast cancer.

So it's okay for people to say I've heard a moamogram Hurst so I won't have one but not so say that must mean as labour is much more painful how come that hasn't put you off What are you on ....and no if your a bloke who can have your boobs squashed and give birth your welcome otherwise I'd say having your nuts kicked is 1000 times more painful than a mammogram...feel better about the sexism now???

My friend had treatment privately the same time as me saw surgeon one week earlier than me started chemo same week as me in same hospital but in a private room so more comfort but she said it's so lonely ....oh and they gave her tea and biscuits in China I got my tea in paper cup no biscuits.....her wig was nice though.

That's good to hear.

My comments about private healthcare for cancer (not specifically breast) come from medics I am afraid, all of whom now have private healthcare in particular to cover cancer, and who know the rationing/unavailability of the most up to date treatments for some cancers, along with waiting lists. Not particularly relevant to this thread but if you are worried enough about cancer to get a mammogram I would personally consider looking more into the state of NHS treatment for cancer once diagnosed. You may find it worthwhile to invest in private healthcare depending on your budget.

She was really upset about it and described it as being shamed, what more can I say on that? That's her experience of it.
Another friend was left in tears about how she was treated.

Perhaps we have a local issue, I don't know, some of you seem to have a great time of it, but that's not what I hear from my friends so it's a wide swerve from me. If it was a more useful screen it might be worth the rudeness but I don't evaluate it to be so, so why would I put myself through it.

Someone else asked about cervical and colon screening. If I'd known more about cervical smears/overtreatment when I was younger I might not have bothered. Moot now we know about hpv and can test for that. But I do sometimes think about some friends who were probably overtreated in their 20s and feel sorry for them. Luckily things have moved on a lot since then. Hopefully it will be more or less eradicated in the future with hpv vaccines.

Statistically, you're probably more likely to reduce your chances of dying from breast cancer by maintaining a healthy bodyweight, exercising regularly and minimising your alcohol intake than you are by attending screening every 5 years over age 50.
Are all the staunch advocates of screening also doing those things?

There was a really good book published a few years ago by Dr Phil Hammond which acts as a patient's guide to navigating and understanding the NHS:
Staying Alive: How to Get the Best From the NHS
www.amazon.co.uk/Staying-Alive-How-Get-Best-ebook/dp/B00HVBJZS4

The section on screening is available to read in the free download section and he explains very clearly the risk/ reward dilemma.

Basically healthcare often boils down to political and commercial factors. Breast screening evangelism has become so entrenched in the UK it's difficult to challenge. All sorts of organisations have a vested interest in funnelling women through the screening pipeline:

• GPs, who get paid per patient referred
• Consultants, who get paid to treat
• Charities, who employ thousands of employees and volunteers to keep promoting the message 'breast screening saves lives' (it may not...)
• private healthcare companies who benefit from health anxiety and fast tracking worried patients for (perhaps unnecessary?) treatment

And the NHS is still fundamentally a patriarchal organisation. If, for every 1 woman who receives treatment which might be useful, 3 others get invasive, anxiety-giving, life-changing unnecessary treatment, then so what? Women's concerns are dismissed. It's only now women are stepping forward to explain the impact of possible overdiagnosis and treatment:

www.theguardian.com/society/2022/jun/09/overdiagnosis-some-breast-cancer-treatments-may-have-been-unnecessary-study-suggests

Every woman needs to make her own decision, based on thorough research and evaluation of her own risk profile and shouldn't feel bullied into having screening if they are unsure.

In my experience, and that of DD (who works in a pharmacy, although she is never rude back herself) people who often find that healthcare professionals are rude to them are because they tend to be rude and confrontational towards the HCPs. I am always polite and respectful towards anyone I come into contact with, and find that people respond in the same way.

Good to hear you are polite and respectful. Me too.

There is a huge body of evidence showing that women are poorly treated in the NHS in general, concerns dismissed, pain minimised, diagnoses missed. Same for people from an ethnic minority background.

Do you think that is because women and non white people of both sexes are ruder to the staff than white men?

Even if so, is it still acceptable?

It's very hard psychologically to say no to treatment when offered.

Once you've been told you have cancer your peace of mind is destroyed forever. This is one of the reasons I am in two minds about screening and why I've turned it down in the past.

Do you think that is because women and non white people of both sexes are ruder to the staff than white men?

People of all colours, ages and sexes/genders can be as rude or polite. DD gets a lot of abuse from patients Of all types unfortunately.

The people I personally know who don't get treated well tend to be white females who have a tendancy for passive aggressiveness and confrontation. There is no need for that IMO.

Yes, that would be the unconscious or indeed conscious bias of staff, resulting in worse treatment of certain sections of the population depending on their sex and/or colour.

There are, again, huge numbers of studies that show that the same behaviour and phrases used by different people (eg men vs women, different ethnic background) is interpreted differently depending on those very characteristics. When it leads to worse health outcomes, or for example the avoidance of accessing healthcare altogether, that is a great cause for concern.

Obviously not for you though. Kind of the point, as you are probably in fact typical of many NHS workers, hence the inequalities of healthcare.

So sorry to hear of your losses. Hope all goes well this afternoon.

@Alphabet1spaghetti2 Breast screening doesn't involve your gp if you are over 50 and in the UK. No need to chase an appointment. It is offered.

And yes, if you die of breast cancer, then you'll be dead, but you will know because you'll have had to endure the 18 months beforehand. And so will your family!

I’m not chasing or involving my gp
for an appointment and I don’t have family.

This thread has shown just how far womens rights to choose for themselves has NOT progressed. Instead of men telling women what they can and cannot do with their bodies, now it’s women telling women what they can or cannot do.
Very very sad state of affairs. I have never heard men doing the same to other men regarding bowel screening or any other health issue. Quite the opposite, they appear to listen and understand that not all men want them same things.
My risk of breast cancer is low, screenings are being shown by scientific studies, which yes, take decades to undertake because of the nature of the program, to cause more harm than good at this point in history. I would not undertake any treatment even if I was told I had cancer - any cancer or even any disease. Funnily enough I know myself better than anyone else!! So I know that it would be a total waste of scarce nhs resources for me to engage in the current screening program. Im old - presumably you lot are a lot younger and have a very different view point on what life you have left to live. Which is fair enough.
This thread is about if you don’t attend- not a thread trying to convince people to attend. Maybe start a thread that is headed why you should attend?

Tbh I think it's always involved women policing other women's bodies. That's why patriarchy works so well.

I would not undertake any treatment even if I was told I had cancer - any cancer or even any disease.

Why not? Not even painkillers?

I’m terrible at even taking painkillers luckily I have an extremely high pain threshold. I also react very badly to prescribed painkillers and historically to medications I have taken in the past.
But my main reason is that I just don’t have the capacity / ability to take medication as directed. Yes I follow it for a day, maybe two, then that’s it it’s out of my head and forgotten about, I may remember to take it later, most likely days later when I come across it cleaning, but that’s unlikely. I just don’t have the gene/capacity for addictive/ repetitive habits to stick. I’ve never ever finished a short course of antibiotics because the habit of taking them just doesn’t stick. Even putting them by the kettle to take everyday wouldn’t work for me as I don’t follow the same habits everytime I wake up - I may have a morning drink but then I might not. I would
never make a good drug addict. I’m the same with food - will eat the same thing for a day/week, then get distracted and forget that original meal and eat something else repetitively until another distraction comes up. I may eat something for a day or week straight then not eat it again for a year.
As I said - a waste of resources when someone else can make much better use of them. We are not all made to function the same!

Definitely would not miss it but as a nurse I've seen too many young women die from a breast primary.

@Alphabet1spaghetti2 but what if you had to?
Like I've been having to take medication and injections for years otherwise I would have died in my 20s. If you were say 38 would just not take the medication and die then?

If you forget to finish antibiotics then I wouldn't take them in the future at all as it leads to resistance

I guess I struggle to understand because if I didn't take my medication I would be very unwell or dead and well, I have to