Talk to me about gallstones

[ilkleymoorbartat]

I've actually posted about them before. But I'm going round in circles with the drs.

After going to gps with discomfort under right ribcage , that comes and goes (months in between where it's fine) and discomfort ranges from mildly niggly to really uncomfortable but not exactly agonising. Other symptoms were discomfort in the right shoulder, loud gurgling stomach, very occasional pale yellow poop (tmi sorry). I had a raft of blood tests x2, FIT test, all totally fine.

Diagnosed via ultrasound with a small gallbladder polyp. Referred to gastro surgeon who said he didn't think my symptoms were from the polyp / stone (said most of the time people diagnosed with polyps they're actually stones). Told me to go away and eat loads of high fat foods for a week and see what the result was. The result wasn't anything dramatic, so when I went back he suggested I don't have a problem with my gallbladder (at least not one that warrants an operation). And that if the symptoms were due to the gallstones I'd be screaming in agony, and that it's worse than childbirth.

He said you couldn't have a niggly gallbladder. that would be like being a little bit pregnant.

So now I'm back to square one, and the gp need to refer me to another speciality to find out what the symptoms are from.

My question is, does what the surgeon said ring true in your experience? Obviously he's an expert, but I just wanted to see.

I had many years of feeling like I had a "niggly gall bladder" before it progressed to full blown agony. I also knew I had gall stones as id had a us scan which confirmed. It runs in my family and has been like that for all of us. The feelings / pain you describe is very similar to what I used to feel.

My experience of gallstones was severe agony.

I don't think one stone or a polyp would cause major problems, as the pain is caused by a gallstone being passed out of the bile duct, it then eases off once its passed. Although I suppose its possible to have one episode from one stone but as its then passed there's no need for any further treatment.

When I had my gallbladder out, there was 200+ gallstones in there, at which point the surgeon stopped counting 😂and by that stage I was having an episode about every 3 weeks.

Thanks for replying @Cakeandslippers That's interesting, and reassuring in a way that you can have a nigglling gallbladder. Obviously it could be something else entirely, but it definitely feels like so many of the symptoms gallbladder sounding.

The only other thing I've noticed (and this is more an instinct than anything scientific), but I feel like I'm amongst the random pattern of discomfort, it always starts to get worse near my period. Again, this could just be because of the pms on top of those symptoms.

That correlates with what the surgeon said @Spidey66

Unless it's gallbladder sludge?

Would that show on the ultrasound?

I'm not sure tbh.

I had stones and when I had 'attacks' they lasted for hours at a time, and I'd roll around in agony. Yes worse than childbirth (for me).

But some people probably have less severe than I did! But if they don't want to remove it on the NHS, your only option really is to go for tests privately and get it done privately.

The NHS wait list when I was put on it (early this year) was over a year. I went private and got it done within a month. (I know not everyone can go private or course).

Sorry if this isn't the answer you want! I really hope you don't get the 'attacks' that are common; they are not nice. My doctor dismissed me several times, until I went to a&e.

There is a Facebook group called 'gallbladder and gallstone support group' which may be worth a look - lots of people that have had issues with their gallbladder are on it, and some may be able to provide some advice for you. Good luck.

I never had any episodes of screaming agony, more the sort of thing you describe, including the pale poo after an attach (accompanied by bright orange wee!). Stones were clear in my GB on ultrasound though.

I have private health insurance. Showed the surgeon my diary of symptoms, he said "classic", scheduled me for surgery straight away. Bish bash bosh, easy recovery, all perfect now, never looked back.

I had 12 in there, each about the size of a pea. I still have them.

Really helpful @eatsleeprepeat123 I'll take a look

That's not exactly true. My stones were far too big to have passed out of the bile duct. What they were doing was moving around and now and again temporarily blocking my bile duct. Over time my gallbladder walls had thickened and it was pretty much useless.

I have sludge and it showed on the ultrasound.
There are so many symptoms with gallbladder disease- one of which is stones.
I've learned more from the FB group mentioned above than anywhere.

My experience was severe pain, worse than childbirth and vomiting bile. I had an acute infection caused by my gall bladder being packed full of tiny stones.
I was admitted for a week for IV antibiotics and then had my gall bladder removed about 6 months later.
The only things I could eat without symptoms was plain food; pasta, rice, chicken, white fish. If I ate anything with a higher fat content it triggered an attack.

I work in radiology/ultrasound. Your symptoms do sound like it's your gallbladder/the stones in your gb. You absolutely can have a niggly gallbladder as well, the stones may only become a problem if there is loads of them rattling about, lots of sludge or if one gets stuck in a bile duct. Unfortunately if you're not in agony they won't do anything about it. They should remove it when/if it becomes agony for you but there is a long waiting list and it's not usually done in a rush. Honestly gallstones can be so severe that people are writhing in agony, unable to eat etc, unable to move, unable to breathe with the pain and they still aren't always done as an emergency. Plus people can live with gallstones for years and years and never even know about them so it's not a routine thing to remove the gallbladder if it's not causing any serious issues. If it's not affecting you very badly for a prolonged period of time, I wouldn't push for surgery. Once you have no gallbladder you can have issues with eating various things, mostly fatty/high fibre/dairy foods, and there is a constant drip of bile into your digestive system. Increased indigestion, digestive & bowel issues, increased stomach pain, vomiting etc.
It sounds like your doctor wants to manage your symptoms conservatively to begin with. You should have surveillance scans every 6-12 months to check the polyp.

My experience was definitely no absolute agony! I ended up in hospital for IV antibiotics when 'trapped wind' turned out to be cholecystitis. It was very uncomfortable but not agony, though the pain never let up whatever position I was in. The nurses did comment I was remarkably uncomplaining and quiet as I should have been in agony (I wasn't!). I had no attacks before or after this. I had it removed about three months later, ended up being open surgery because it was severely infected and there was one 5cm stone!!!! So, whilst agonising pain might be the norm, everyone is different.

Thanks @Vecnussy that's really helpful. I definitely won't rush into surgery if I don't immediately need it, and I suspect that was the surgeons point. Unless he had absolute proof it's the gallbladder then he's not going to start chopping me up. Which is fair enough.

Currently in the midst of a gallbladder attack. Been in pain for hours and it just won't subside.
I have 1 gallstone diagnosed by CT scan and have had about 20 attacks since May.

Really sorry to hear that @PeaceLily2000 Hope it eases up soon!

Your gastro specialist is a muppet! It's absolutely possible to have a niggly gallstone and only have relatively mild symptoms. I should know because I have one too and your symptoms are pretty much the same as mine. Basically the stone is interfering with the gall bladder drainage, but not blocking it 100% of the time or causing severe inflammation and/or infection. Kind of like a marble in a really old-fashioned lemonade bottle. So you get periods of symptoms and periods of no symptoms depending on what it's up to.

My gastro specialist (private) actually diagnosed me from my symptoms because I thought it was my hernia playing up - he was dead chuffed when the ultrasound came back positive. He recommended a "watch and see" course, saying loads of people have gallstones and never realise as they only ever get mild IBS-type symptoms. Said to go right back if I ever get symptoms of cholecystitis and he'd whip it out. Touch wood, I've been ok so far.

Oh, and it can be made worse by hormone levels (there's a warning for extra-monitoring when you're on HRT) so it makes sense if the symptoms are linked to your cycle.

😂 well that's one way of putting it @funnelfanjo

Really Intersting to see that other people do have milder symptoms, and what you say about the marble makes sense.
Thanks so much for taking the time to reply!

I have similar symptoms, upper right sided pain (not severe), and same gut symptoms, plus linked to my cycle as well, but I've had 2 ultrasounds and nothing abnormal detected both times. GP shrugs and says possibly IBS, but I'm a bit doubtful.

Same here. I had many many gallstone attacks that would last for hours where id just be laying on the floor in agony until they finally prescribed me tramadol but that took time to work so was still having these attacked every couple of weeks. I was then booked to have it taken out but ended up taking three years because of pregnancy and then covid. No issues since removal

Sounds like what I have! Had an abdomen ultrasound a few months ago and nothing seen, repeat one in a
couple of weeks. I know I have a slightly fatty liver so am putting it down to that. Reeeeeally don’t want gallstones! Interestingly I had zero pain at all when I went back on sertraline (I take it 2 weeks out of 4 and only started back a couple of months ago. - I’m in my 2 weeks off now and all my pain as returned, not just abdo but other aches and pains. Weird!)

@Vecnussy you said "Once you have no gallbladder you can have issues with eating various things, mostly fatty/high fibre/dairy foods, and there is a constant drip of bile into your digestive system. Increased indigestion, digestive & bowel issues, increased stomach pain, vomiting etc."

Just for balance I have absolutely none of these after-effects, two years down the line from removal. I eat whatever I fancy and feel absolutely fine.

Good for you. Plenty of patients report these side effects, including my own family members who have had gallbladder removal. You can also see, because you directly quoted me, I wrote you CAN and MAY several times. Not that it's a definite.