at what stage does a 'diet' become an eating disorder?

[belcantavinissima]

are there obvious signs or is it v gradual and you probably wouldnt notice?

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I think it is very gradual
Is this about you, a friend or a child?

Eating Disorder or Diet?

just wondered.

ok the thing is i have started dieting. i have never dieted in my life. never really had to. but over last couple of yrs really put on alot of weight. have been feeling really quite grotesque in my size. this week i started weight watchers and going to the gym.
i am loving the control of the points thing and keeping the points as low as possible. weighing myself constantly. am aware this could be getting me into dangerous territory. part of me hopesx that i can maintain it and 'better' my scores iyswim because i def want to be a certain size and this is the only way of doing it. but part of me is also concerned about getting 'carried away' and it developing into something i dont want to be.

wish i'd name changed now.

it can come on gradual. When I was 19 I went on the Rosemary Connely diet cos all my friends did. I probably wasn't even overweight. Lost a stone in 4 weeks and was so thrilled I didn't stop and started to eat less and less. Each pound gone felt like an acheivement. Before I knew it I was anorexic and 6 stone and very ill. And yes, I knew I was sick and too thin (anorexics aren't stupid) but I couldn't stop.
Took a very long time to recover too. 20 years on I still have issues.

nineunlikelytales, thanks for the link. when i read throught he first page i thought well thats def not me, i dont/wont have a problem then i did the questionaire and it told a differnt story but then most women have issues about how they look and with food generally dont they?

needmorecoffee, thank you for sharing your story with me. how did you 'get better'?

IME As soon as guilt is involved, be careful. I have been anorexic and when I got caught out not eating I became bulimic so people would get off my case.

I have dieted since and always known when I am treading thin ice, with me it's always been the emotions that attach to food, I'd eat something 'bad' and feel really guilty, for hours, so much so I'd either vomit, starve myself or do enough excercise to burn off those calories plus a bit more, also if I ate one say doughnut, I'd think 'I'll be sick in a minute' or do some excercise or w/e and use that as an excuse to eat more, so I'd end up eating 2 doughnuts and 5 slices of toast and a packet of crisps etc.

On a normal day, if I've been dieting I'll look at something I maybe shouldnt have and think either, I can have it, as long as I dont overdo it on other stuff (sensible) or ask myself if I really want it and substitute it (again sensible).

You should be proud of what you're doing, but realise it isnt the be all and end all to be dieting properly. Maybe give yourself a 'minimum' amount of points as well as a maximum number so you know you're eating enough???

i think that as you are doing a nationally recognised 'sensible' diet regime then it would be difficult to get into the vicious cycle that an eating disorder involves. they are also hugely psychological so you would have to have huge self image issues for this to be the only weight loss method that you feel will work. if you treat your weight loss in a sensible and controlled way then you will probably be able to lose weight without risking that you will develop a proper disorder if that makes sense
good luck with your weight loss

xx ei xx

will post tomorrow about how I got better although, like I said, 19 years on I still have issues about food. I think you just hold it at bay to be honest.

I agree, there isn;t any such thing as 'better' after an eating disorder. I am still very much on the edge as it were, always will be, I just learnt to control it.

When I was 16 I started dieting, though I wasn't at all overweight. Within weeks my relationship to food had utterly changed and I suffered from a binge/diet style eating disorder which took over my life for the next 17 years. It turned into an eating disorder so quickly because I had lots of emotional issues needing attention, to do with my weird family. I guess that food/weight became a secret obsession with which I could distract myself from problems which, I suppose, seemed insurmountable.

I'm fine with food now but I wouldn't wish an eating disorder on anyone. Be very very careful. A little extra weight is FAR better than an obsession with food.

i suppose i am starting to panic abit as dh seems to have cottoned on to the fact that i am not eating anywhere near my target points (9 or 10 instead of 24 a day) but am eating healthy stuff that has no points rather than starving myself. i know i am a bit of a control freak and stubborn so the fact that my friend has said i wont be able to keep it up makes me even more determined that i will !

You KNOW you are on dangerous ground. Don't do this.

i think also the point to the weight watchers diet is to help you into a sensible diet rather than a diet diet iyswim. my sister did what you are doing belcant ie. limiting her points, and as soon as she reached her target weigh she started to eat a little more and literally PILED all the weight back on and more. she has got herself into this routine and now finds it really hard to lose weight but gains it very easily. you should try and stick to your recommended point level and you will prob find it easier to stick to as it is not so regimented. and also dieting can be really competetive especially if you are doing it alongside a friend. this can also be a trigger towards some sort of eating disorder. HTH
xx ei xx

Eating too little can have a big effect on your thoughts. Just because you are thinking this way now does not mean you will necessarily develop an eating disorder IMO but you must already have some unhealthy ideas about food and weight and your self worth.

Eat the full points value for a fortnight and see how you feel. If you can't do that, or if you still feel this way after that time, see your GP.

That site is full of information and is the best I have found on the subject. Please look after yourself, for your own sake and that of your family.

Thats how it starts Belcant. Tying to eat 'less' than the recommended. That actually slows down your metabolism and buggers up the diet.

It's very hard to say. I remember vividly being 23 years old and just under 8st, crying on my way to college, having just had a row with my mum who thought I was losing too much weight.
Telling a friend that my mum thought I was anorexic. And that I wasn't, and was very angry about it.
3 months later I was 7 stone and being signed off work, left college...I went down to 6st in the end. It took me four years to get back to a reasonable weight and out of danger.
I knew I was too thin, it freaked me out but I could not put on weight - I had some daft 'beliefs' going on in my mind, which I eventually sorted out by myself - only when it became a life and death situation though.

The first few months though were that rush of 'I can fit into my skinny jeans' and then it just didn't stop. Very addictive. But then the basis has to be there already, Belcant - in my case I think it was almost a way to get back at my mother for her suspicions, her extreme anxiety about me in every way, which put huge pressure on me from an early age.

It wasn't a sudden thing iyswim.

If you don't already have issues you are unlikely to develop them in your thirties.

but i'm not starving myself. i have been eating quite a bit but lots and lots of no point veg and i usually eat more veg than anything else anyway. the thing is before the diet i would have bought sweeties for dd and a pack for me at the same time, i would eat a packet of crisps in the evening eating telly, i would eat cake things i secret in the bathroom or eat whole packets of biscuits in secret. maybe that shows i have had a weird relationship with food for a while just the other way. have never made myself sick though do have some herbal diet pills.

sounds like you have disordered eating.. ifyswim.... eating lots of food in secret is not part of a normal relationship with food ( and i have been there !! ) wanting to eat healthily and lose weight is good, but not making into a personal challenge against yourself, so you are depriving yourself of the right amount of food....

Eating cakes and things in private is not right, I'm sure you know that.

It's like alcoholics hiding vodka bottles, if there is no problem, why hide??

I think you're too close to developing a disorder of some sort, you already have issues with your food, so by all means diet, but make sure you do it properly, one of the best ways I found to avoid negative relationships with 'bad' foods was to eat them, now and then as a treat and force myself not to feel guilty.

If you have been eating only half or less of your points then use up some of your daily allownace for something 'bad' and try to be fine with it.

As long as you know that thereis an issue here and are aware of the fact it needs to be watched you will hopefully be fine, but I'd say (again IME) this is the point where it can turn nasty, avoid it at all costs.

Whilst if you continoue to be this obsessive about the WW plan it could become a problem...I think it is quite normal at first to jump in with both feet and be a bit obsessive at first, iykwim.

I have done WW and did, at one point, try the point system, but realised it wasn't for me...as I didn't like to eat when I knew the point value...if that makes sense...
However, the core plan (or whatever it is currently called) worked well...and encourages a healthy relationship with food and healthy foods...

I understood it, as in OP used to eat in secret? But isn't now?

My best diet was the easiest, it didn't have a name and it's one we all know, it was just plain ole healthy eating and exercise.

A bowl of porridge or toast for breakfast, a normal size lunch, ie a sandwich yoghurt and packet of crisps, and then a good dinner, (just smaller portions than I was used to), I'd snack on fruit and walk everywhere. There was no guilt, no worry and no cravings, as I ate what I want, I lost weight and it stayed off, because I didnt suddenly change my eating habits when I lost the weight, which is what peopel do when they follow a 'diet'.

I think all diets have a possibility of becoming dangerous with all the guidelines and what not to eat etc, changing eating habits is something for a lifetime, not just a diet.

Yes 3andnomore, me too, before the idet, so she was out of control then, and as soon as she started the diet she stopped, probably making her feel in control, which is normally when things spiral totally out of control.
(Lots of controls there sorry!)

Too right VS. Its why I'm doing the SW plan. The basic plan is lots of fruit n veg n wholemeal carbs with less fat. Basic healthy eating.
But I go to the classes just to get weighed and to stick to it. Left to my own devices I have 'just one bite of cake....' and it creeps back on.
But I do stick to the plan and that means having 5-10 'syns' a day and making sure I do and the class leader tells you off if you don't eat enough. It actually slows down weight loss as your body goes into starvation mode.