Pertussis (Whooping Cough) Vaccine while pregnant, yes or no?

[M0MY32]

Hi everyone,
I'm just over 28 weeks pregnant and my midwife has asked whether I have been vaccinated for Pertussis yet. I told her I had not as I had read about the Aluminium toxicity in the vaccine and decided against having it. She is being fairly pushy about it and now I don't know what to do. Help please!

All the leaflets I had I intially said 28 weeks but the 28 was crossed out and they’d written 20 so I’m guessing it was a recent change (this was mid 2016). I think it’s to allow immunity to develop if you have a premature birth but that’s just a guess.

Definitely speak to your midwife and doctor if you’re unsure. I’m so glad that at least I knew I’d gotten it when it all happened. The things I saw in that HDU will never leave me, my little one was relatively unscathed compared to some of the others. I slept in a recliner by his bed for 11 nights while he had constant coughing fits that never ended, and he screamed non stop because he was so hungry and I couldn’t do anything for him. Worst few weeks of my life.

I chose to have but I cannot understand why it is such a poor vaccine. I had it in 2012 for DD1 and was then told I needed it again for DD2 in 2014.

Why is the immunity conferred SO low? I know it is different to the WC vaccine I had as a baby in the 1970s. Why does it not give immunity for even 5 years?

I’m a scientist and while I used to be a cancer/developmental geneticist I’ve since done quite a bit of safety and surveillance work.

the amount of aluminium in the adjuvant is tiny. The amount of aluminium from vaccines is minor compared to all other environmental sources. It is, quite honestly, Ok.

When vaccines are released into usage the safety monitoring doesn’t stop. Any and all adverse reactions seen at the same or similar time are collected and analysed (even random stuff like ‘run over and broke leg has crossed my desk!) and if there are any safety concerns they get investigated. And drugs do get pulled sometimes - vioxx for example.

There is a strong online ‘antivaccination’ presence and it isnlinked to a number of quite unsavoury groups. Extreme religious groups often provide funding for example. The man who started the whole thing (Andrew Wakefield) is now banned from practicing because he faked his results to gain personal financial benefit - he had financial interest in single vaccines companies. He also conducted unnecessary, invasive and painful experiments on children (bowel biopsy samples) in order to push his agenda. This is against every ethical research rule there is.

The consequences of whooping cough can be fatal or lead to permanent damage. It’s an absolutely horrid illness and I would encourage all pregnant women to get the jab.
It is of course your decision but as someone who has seen both an awful lot of safety data in her career and also seen first hand the damage WC can do, I’d really encourage you to get the jab.

I know it is different to the WC vaccine I had as a baby in the 1970s. Why does it not give immunity for even 5 years?

The goal is not to immunise you, it’s to stimulate antibody production to pass intot the baby. Rechallenging the system produces higher levels of antibodies - you will still be immune

So, I would've passed on some immunity due my own baby vaccine and DD1 but having it again for DD2 just increases her immune response. 10% higher, 50% higher?

"I chose to have but I cannot understand why it is such a poor vaccine. I had it in 2012 for DD1 and was then told I needed it again for DD2 in 2014.

"Why is the immunity conferred SO low? I know it is different to the WC vaccine I had as a baby in the 1970s. Why does it not give immunity for even 5 years?"

You've musunderstood the reasoning.

Yes, DPT does wear off, after about 20 years or so.

They don't give it during pregnancy so that your are immune, but rather the contrary. So that when your body makes an immune response to the virus in the jab, the antibodies circulate in your blood stream and cross the placenta, thus conferring some immunity to the foaetus. The same would happen if you encountered the wild disease when you were already immune.

The dates recommended to have the jab are those which give the best window for transfer if the antibodies that the jab stimulates in the mother, and have been changed on the basis of ongjng surveillance,

DH caught Whopping cough age 3 whilst playing on the local beach with some children who were on holiday from somewhere up north where there was an outbreak.

He has had issues with his breathing ever since. He also developed asthma which 30 years later still plagues him daily. It's thought the stresses caused to his body by the whopping cough lead to the asthma.

I will be vaccinating in a few weeks when I'm offered it and would after educating myself in the risks of the vaccine recommend anyone else to vaccinate as well.

Please watch this video, OP.

It basically explained how the dose is the poison. So while I understand you're concerned about the aluminium in the WC Vax, the dose is negligible. It will explain in the video a lot better then I ever could but it helped me come to the conclusion to get the flu jab and WC during my pregnancy.

I cannot believe people would risk putting their unborn babies in harms way like this.

I had mine at 16 weeks, everything was fine.

So, I would've passed on some immunity due my own baby vaccine and DD1 but having it again for DD2 just increases her immune response. 10% higher, 50% higher?

You're probably immune to Wc. But you’re not actively producing antibodies because that’d be wasteful (imagine all the things you’re exposed to over your life!) so your body has a very few lurking ‘library’ cells (gross simplification but it’s a decent analogy) with that specific antibody on and if you're then challenged with a vaccination the immune system then produces loads of antibodies .
Then you pass those onto the baby.

If you didn’t have the jab you’d just have that really low ‘base level ticking over level’ and that’s not enough to pass on.

Another video - here is a small child with whooping cough.

Thank you. That does explain why you need a vax each time you're pregnant. Fascinating!

I'm 34 weeks pregnant and have not received any vaccine - not flu, not whooping cough. I'm so undecided when it comes to vaccines because there's fear thrown at you by both sides. I'm honestly terrified to make either decision!

To be honest, another reason why I'm this far into pregnancy without having received the flu or whooping cough vaccine is because I was getting colds pretty much back to back, and it's not recommended you receive vaccines whilst ill (both my MW and GP told me to wait until I was better). Now that I am better, I'm back to being scared and undecided. This topic causes me genuine headache/anxiety. It's not as simple as either side like to make out that it is. It kind of seems that either side are, to a certain extent, biased and uninformed about genuine facts/studies provided by the other side. I probably will vaccinate in the end, but simply out of fear - not because I feel I've done enough research and come to my own, informed conclusion. I don't have enough time or energy to do the research required, I don't feel (currently doing a dissertation, which is due very close to my due date).

I just wish we didn't live in a corrupt world where we have to question our medical industry, concerned about the safety of things that are supposed to offer nothing but protection. I also wish we lived in a world where we weren't all so unhealthy and were better in touch with nature, so that our immune systems could work to their full potential like they should. I wish we weren't corrupted and manipulated into being sick, thinking things that can be harmful are safe/healthy, and relying so heavily on 'medicine' in the first place. It's all one big headache to me.

Thinking that things*

Nature is happy for the virus to reproduce. It does not prioritise humans.

Vaccination has been the biggest public health success in the history of humanity.

@stargirl1701 I understand that. I just wish there was such a thing as a vaccine without all the toxic ingredients, that's all.

yes, in Australia it is free for women in their 3rd trimester (this is the recommended time). It will pass on temporary immunity to your baby.
My youngest got Bronchiallitis at 3 weeks of age, that was terrifying enough let along Whooping Cough which is completely preventable.

Birthofawoman - if it's any reassurance on the research side, it is simply not possible to do this without access to very expensive medical journals. Even then, commercial trials are very restricted in what has been published. This is why as a scientist it's always a bit of a red flag to me when someone says they've 'done their research'... where? It's hard enough even with training and journal access!
However, while the medical establishment doesn't always get it right, NICE and the NHS DO have access to all the latest research, and specialists in these fields, and pragmatically, our stretched public health system has very little interest in paying for mass vaccinations that aren't absolutely necessary, (see for example, the chicken pox vaccine, which is standard in many other countries but not here), or in making us sick at all.

If you do feel the need to read further, I would very strongly recommend the Cochrane Review - these metastudies encompass all the latest research (not just cherry picked studies to favour one side), are rigorous about probing how studies were conducted, and have come out for some vaccines and not in favour of others (the early flu vaccine was one, though this may have changed). www.cochrane.org/cochrane-reviews

It is strongly recommended by the NHS, due to it being safe and effective. Whooping cough in newborns is awful.

Why do people not listen to the advice of the NHS? Step away from google!

I had whooping cough as an adult and consequently did not think twice about having the vaccine when I was pregnant. It was horrific for a long, long time and I was a fit and healthy twenty-something. I can't imagine how awful it would be for a tiny baby.

No I never had it.