Food additives

[PamT]

Did anyone see last night's Trevor MacDonald programme about food additives being the cause for allergies and bad behaviour in children?

It was certainly food for thought. They put a whole class of children on an additive free diet for a week and they all calmed down, behaved better and suffered less with asthma, eczema and other allergies. I'd love to know more about it and why we even have to have so many nasties in our food at all.

I wondered if anyone would start a thread on this actually... I did see the programme. I wasn't surprise by it personnally because it's a topic close to my heart.
Nutrition is the basis for good health yet we don't spend much time thinking about it.
My mum (who lives in Paris) told me over the WE that Mc Donald's is now saying in its adverts (in France's major dailies) that children should not be eating in their restaurants more than 1 x every ten days and that they should take a salad (or something like that - she wasn't 100% sure about that part of the advert).

I hope this won't shock anyone : but does anyone serioulsy think that eating every week at Mc Donald is good for their child ?

P.S. Recently spent 3 days with a (very recently ex) Mc Donald's senior manager... some of the things she told us about their US research was "alarming" - for example they know that drinking coke (and alike) creates dehydration... and the US it is tarting to become a major health concern.

Yes Pupuce - I sat ther watching it wondering who would start a mumsnet thread on it! Predictable lot aren't we? It was food for thougth in a very facile way - all very simplistic and no real evidence of anything - no hard facts or figures - just a lot of 8 year olds shouting''oh yes, I feel lots healthier'' Well they would say that for the cameras wouldn't they!!!!!!

That said I agree totally that additives etc are best avoided - the one advantage of having a dd who is dairy allergic is that you HAVE to become a manic label reader - and an awful lot of the filth that kids love is 'out' for her regardless of my feelings on E numbers. Luckily for now she's still too yong to argue/know any different - as far as she's concerned grapes are the nicest 'sweet' on earth!

I read labels on everything and find that once you are use to doing it, it goes very quickly.

PamT didn't see the programme but agree that we shouldn't have so many 'nasties' in our food. I am a manic label reader and don't buy much with additives, enumbers etc. Anyone read Fast Food Nation on this subject? I read an excerpt from it in (I think) The Observer and it was terrifying about flavourings in general and McDonalds in particular. How they won the Mclibel case I'll never know (complicated case, I know though).

As I don't buy much processed food I find I miss out almost all the aisles in the supermarket except fruit/veg, fish, meat and tinned and packet pulses, rice etc. Which means about 4 aisles to go along out of what? 20? I think the supermarkets have a lot to answer for (but that's another rant).

I have always had a thing about additives especially aspartime and saccharine yet lost of mothers I know happily give their children reduced sugar drinks that are packed with them.

My children have always had 'normal' juices containing sugar and do not have tooth decay, nor are they fat. My youngset dd had one minute filling and has since mainly drunk water. The reason she got that was she would fall asleep prior to brushing her teeth and I preferred the peace and quiet

Has anyone read Joanna Blytheman (sp?!) 'The Food Our Children Eat' ( or something like that - I'm too lazy to go upstairs and look!) It's excellent - has some really good ideas ...... but I couldn't help ending up imagining dd finding me crouched in the garden shed eating jelly tots one day in the future, her little face absolutely appalled and saying ''But Mummy you said they were horrid and that they made you ill!''.....
If only I weren't addicted to all the complete cr*p!

Bayleaf, you are in the same position as me, my dd is milk intolerant and it came as a big shock when the dietitian gave me a list of foods that might contain milk. I'm a lazy cook and its all too easy to open the freezer and see what falls out at meal times. I have made a concerted effort to eat better foods recently and have even started a milk free diet myself (only the occasional lapse). I do feel better for it and haven't had to take any anti histamines for over a week now. I just wish food manufacturers would make it easier for us with labelling etc.

I am a label reader and am always surprised that non one else in the supermarket ever seems to be reading labels. Also, what really gets me is all the junk in the "organic" and "health" foods. They say things like "no sugar" but it's full of apple and grape juice which is as good (or bad) as being full of sugar. Or no animal fat, but it's full of hydrogenated vegetable oils which are just as bad in the cholesterol dept. Or all the yogurts that have all sorts of thickening agents (hard to digest). Did you know that so far I have only found one brand of readymade (don't have time to make my own) tomato pasta sauce that doesn't have sugar in it. Bread that seems to have everything but flour and water. Sulphites (which i am terribly allergic to) as a preservative for a million things (including many health foods).
Ok I could go on and on...it is just so depressing trying to buy healthy, tasty, readymade foods. (I am a working mother and don't always have time to cook a full lunch and dinner). I miss my Los Angeles supermarkets...And yes pupuce there are people who have no idea that there is anything nutritionally lacking in a McDonald's meal (for example the mothers of my 3 step children....I have been accused of not feeding them enough sweets and crisps and forcing them to have a salad with every meal).

SofiaAmes - I don't know about LA but I am Canadian and go to the US several times a year and have found it basically impossible to buy decent food (unless I go to very specific alternative shops)... and even then I MUST read the label.

Here, here Mears ! I am appalled at how many people don't realise that artificial sweetners are not good for you and think that they are a better alternative to a little sugar. My dd has very diluted apple juice, one part apple to four parts water. When she is old enough I will buy a coridial that has no additives and has a little sugar but no artificial sweetners.

One thing I've always found about losing weight too is that a healthy, plenty of fruit and veg, chicken and fish, little red meat and not too much carb diet works best. Lots of people I know, my MIL especially who is VERY overweight, eat loads of 'diet'foods that are either very high in sugar but 'low fat' and / or full of additives including artificial sweetners etc. These additives are definitely not good and toxicate the body IMO. Therefore they encourage water retention and therefore hazard weight loss.

No one in my supermarket ever looks at the labels - except picky old me !

Rant over

blimey, I'm astounded on reading another thread: (think it's "fussy eater & won't try new things" )to hear that Heinz have been allowed to label spaghetti hoops and the like as counting towards one of your 5 daily portions of fruit and vegetables! This is outrageous, so I thought I'd mention it here. There's an article about it here We should be complaining don't you think?

SofiaAmes correct me her - but in the US - Ketchup is a vegetable.....

Whhaaat???!!! Has the world gone mad? Are people really that stupid?

I can't believe that ! That is ridiculous. There is far too much fast food around these days and not enough feshly cooked food IMO. I do use some fast food like breaded fish, pasta sauce etc but also make a lot of my own. My dh was raised on a lot of crap and I can't help thinking you are what you eat. His mother has a terrible weight problem and my dh was raised on tv meals. We always sat as a family to eat dinner and in front of the tv was a rare treat. It was also always yummy home cooked food.

There is less time nowadays for everyone and some fast foods are healthy but I can't believe how much rubbish people eat in general.

I am a terrible supermarket trolley snob When looking in other people's baskets I can't believe it and want to take them aside and tell them about all the rubbish they're buying. But that's just me being an incredibly bossy person !

The more I think about it, the more I want to change my eating/cooking habits. Does anyone know of any good sources of information? I've noted down the details of the Joanna Blytheman book but I could do with a list of truely natural additives which should be the ok ones and a list of the suspect ones. Any ideas?

I probably sound a bit thick or at least naive in thinking previously that if foods met health standards they were ok but my opinion is changing rapidly on that issue and I wish the industry would make it easier. If we could have different catagories for additives at least that would be a start and give us the choice (eg. instead of all E numbers we could have different letters to denote natural, manufactured, risky, dangerous etc.)

As for the added sweeteners, they don't taste nice and they are certainly not better for us. (What is the best sugar to use? I know that refined white sugar isn't too good) The Sunny D adverts also annoy me, their concoction of E numbers with a little bit of fruit juice thrown in just shouts out 'nasty' when you see the dayglo colours it comes in. My kids think I'm mean not buying it for them.

PamT I don't think your mean ! I would never buy Sunny Delight, it's absolute rubbish.

In terms of what things are good and what aren't it's difficult to know where to get hold of a list of additives but I think things like maize starch are ok (although don't quote me on it I'm not an authority) but all the e numbers and other things that just sound nasty and convuluted aren't good. Also I know that hydrogenated vegetable oil is supposed to be not too good but am not sure why.

Best thing to do is try and buy fresh produce, fresh pasta sauces etc and buy pure foods that don't contain too many ingredients.

Hope this helps a bit

I think that some organic stuff is good in this sense. A lot of foods now have Free from Preservatives, additives, added salt, sugar etc on the front now so that also helps.

Thanks Tillysmum. I'm not too bad on the cooking from scratch front when I put my mind to it but its the margarines and basic stuff like that where I would like to go a bit more pure. You even get additives in flour these days so there's no hope for a nutritional incompetent like me.

I do have a breadmaker which is useful, specially for making pizza bases and jam (and bread of course!). I suppose I ought to make my own tomato sauce topping as well though.

Go for butter. Not much in that.

Better : olive oil !

On sugar, I have noticed that if you put up to 50% less then what is on a recipe, you usually do not taste the difference ! I am down to 75% less but I did it slowly... we eat very little sugar now - you just need to get your body unhooked !
A sugar-free diet is better - what ever form of sugar. And yes all its replacements are complete crap.

PamT you don't sound thick, not at all.

I think the major food manufacturers and retailers have a lot to answer for in terms of misleading health and nutrition advice. Sunny Delight is absolute junk, continue to RESIST it! As for advertisers targeting kids to work their pester power on parents, don't get me started

I didn't like Susannah Olivers tone much (someone here described her as 'preachy' and I'd agree with that) but her book What Should I feed my baby is quite useful on basic nutrition and additives and their effects.

Tillysmum I can't use butter because dd is milk intolerant. I use Pure (normally soya but I have got sunflower to try this time), the only additives seem to be emulsifiers which I think come from the same origin as the oil, and some vitamins - but there are so many long words!

Pupuce - might try the sugar reduction thing.

Better get dd some lunch now, this message board has got me hooked and I'm spending too much time in front of the pc and not enough on housework (shame on me). DD has been at playgroup this morning and only just returned so I haven't really neglected her all morning.

WWW - agree completely about 'pester power' adverts - do none of these advertisers have kids themselves? Have read Fast Food Nation - excellent book, but doesn't do much for your confidence in government food standards/safety agencies!
The overwhelming majority of the food we eat I cook from scratch - a lot of work (and I couldn't be without my freezers!) but I don't begrudge it at all. There's only one reason why manufacturers put additives of any kind into food - because it's cheap!

I think the ketchup as vegetable thing may be because it is exceptionally high in lycopene, a valuable antioxidant found in much higher concentrations in cooked tomatoes as opposed to raw. Still strikes me as odd.
We will also never have Sunny Delight or those wretched cheese strings in the house - what is wrong with a nice bit of watered-down fruit juice or slice of camembert instead?
Like others here, we aim for a mostly organic diet, try and buy seasonal, local produce otherwise, resist the lure of processed foods and try and sit down to a proper meal as a family once a day. What I do find is that because we both work f/t outside the home and cook in a hurry, we tend to do a lot of quick or one-pot meals such as risotto or pasta with sauce, so our diet is probably too high in carbohydrate.
I'd definitely recommend the Joanna Blythman book.