don't moan to me your baby has a misshaped head, as YOU lay him back into his carseat for THE DAY

[anonanonanon]

sorry in advance for going anon -
but i feel like SCREAMING this at my 'friend' with DC2. Both of her children where born with beautifully shaped heads can i add. Her DC1 developed a very flat head (was in carseat all the time) and even back then (is now 4yo) he has a flat head, but fortunately his thick curlyish hair hides it a bit. But now, her 3 month old DC2, has the most unsightly head you can ever imagine. Its not just FLAT, its now becoming Inverted at the back, coning at the top, and I believe its starting to affect his face. With BOTH children i have said countless times the pressure of him sitting in his car seat (or that far too upright bloody mechanical swing) is whats mis-shaping his HEAD (not to mention added pressure on his spine and breathing when he was a newborn).
HEAD AND BRICK WALL, its infuriating and I could get almost tearful over this. I have even mentioned about helmets to help them correct his head. Was there for 8 hours on sat, and he was only taken out of his mechanical swing to feed Gosh the harsh reality of this is terrible now i have just read it back All i get is, isnt it funny how some kids have funny heads coz your DC doesnt.
Thats because my lo was only in a car seat TO TRAVEL, in a proper pram LAYING FLAT when we were out, and on the floor being able to wriggle freely when at home.
argh. sorry for that rant

I know how you feel pinkchampagne. My DS (5) also has an unusual (flat) head and I feel quite sick reading this (knew I shouldn't have opened it) thinking that people look at him and think it's my fault and I neglected him in some way. FWIW, I carried him everywhere for 4 months but did lay him down on his back to sleep at night. It appears that part of his head may have fused in utero so any repositioning was in vain. We have now been referred to a specialist to discuss the possibility of an operation to correct it. You can imagine how that makes me feel

My dd has a very flat head, and indeed I have had someone commiserate with me about her 'deformity'. Ds also has a flat head. And so does dh. Go figure.

People make a lot of assumptions.

But yes, eight hours in a swing is too long.

I did recline DS's seat right back, when he was tiny, so he wasn't in an upright position - but he did spend too much time in that seat.
I remember my HV coming round the day I actually admitted how bad I was feeling, and DS was sleeping in his chair. He woke & cried, so I picked him up, and she made a comment that it was the first time she had seen me cuddle him.
Obviously I did cuddle him when she wasn't around, but she had obviously noticed how much time he spent in his baby chair.
She didn't get on at me about it in any way, but got me started on ADs that day.

He doesn't have a flat head, but it is an odd shape & I can't help but wonder if this is the cause of it.

Agree with anonanon. The flat head is only positional and I can speak from experience as I had a maternity nurse (a qualified nurse no less) who (ate for England then) walked for hours with DS on his back. As he was a placid baby he didn't move and his head went from a beautiful shape to alien shape in 6wks. The peadiatrician at 3mths said it would sort itself out, by 7mths we were still worried as I noticed alot of boys with very flat heads at age 3 and 4 so realised that it didn't sort itself out. Tracked down a German Dr called Dr Chris Blecher who at 9mths fitted the helmet which he wore until 15mths. Thank god we found somebody who knew what he was talking about.For those who are interested my postings can be searched and go into full detail. Some MN'ers have done this and have CAT'ed me for advice which I am very happy to give.
It is positional only and it is important to lie new born babies on alternate sides so that the head remains even. Of course they can be put on their backs but for a limited time only. And the car seat should be used for a max of 2hrs drive and not attached to a pushchair and wheeled around for hours on end. The damn thing should carry a warning on it.

I don't want to put words into the OP's mouth but I don't think she meant to suggest that children with naturally flat-shaped heads were as a result of being left in car seats etc.

The problem is that it's bad for the spine to be sleep and travel for long periods in car seats because the baby is never fully reclined.

I forgot to add that I am preg with twins and I shall be keeping a written note of their lying down time because I know how important it is. I shall be buying those things that are placed waist height and secured so that the baby can't roll onto its back. We went through hell and many sleepless nights when we realised what we had allowed to happen and seeing our DS in his helmet. SHeer hell. Wouldn't wish it on anyone.

An interesting thread. Our experiences with ds echo funnypeculiar's - ds was born with torticollis resulting in him looking in one direction more of the time and leading to plagiocephaly on one side. I'm embarrassed to say that dh and I didn't even notice ds looking more to the left - at nappy changes we thought he liked looking that way because it was out of the window

He spent night times in a flat cot, daytime sleeps in his flat carry cot and trips out in his flat Silver Cross pram. We had to use positional therapy etc to try to correct this and his head is still a little flat on that side (he's nearly 18m).

PC - don't beat yourself up (been there, done that . You were having a rough time, and lots of people leave babies in seats for long periods (as OP points out!!) without your excuses. And as Pruni says - this is not new - when we were stressing about dd, my granny rang to tell me it was all HER fault as it must be genetic- the back of her head is totally flat. I'd never even noticed.

Peanutbutter - we didn't notice either - just though dd happened to really like looking at the radiator ... but then again we raised the issue with various health professionals, and neither did 2 h/vs, our GP, and a Cranial Oesteopath. It only got picked up on when we booked a private paed consult and I stamped my feet a lot

I will apologise to anyone whom i caused offence to by 'not intetionally' implying all flat heads are caused by car seats. However i do not take back anything regards how it infuriates my that my friend is not/has not listened to me. In real life i could not have been anymore of a friend. I had her DC1 for 2 wks after she gave birth, I have both her children one morning a week when MY DD is at nursery, just to give her a break, I have even suggested that my mum could get her a helmet through where she works (sorry not mentioning any more on that one!) if a child is left crammed in one position ALL DAY LONG sorry, but even if they are on their back, in a car seat blah blah, whatever! then they will probably suffer from a flatter head than babes who are moved around. As it happens my DD would not sleep on her back, so it was probably nothing to do with the pram etc that i bought for her, maybe DD herself with her hatred from lying on her back stopped her from getting a flat head. Eitherway, chicpea has a very firm understanding of the problems laying in one positions brings. I hope at least some can learn from this. The whole shape of car seats are JUST WRONG for newborns.

Well thanks for that anon...

As the mother of a 5 year old who has plagiocephaly (that's the correct terminology for a flat head) I feel quite sick about the damage I've done to my son (non-sarcasm). How do you know so much about 'helmets'? I only know about them because of my son's head shape.

My Dad has a totally flat back of head, as do 2 of my older brothers, myself and now DS. We all in my opinion but obviously not your have beautifully shaped heads and the only one of us you can ever tell has a flat head is one of my brothers who has his hair particually short at the back.

Have you ever thought that maybe your countless naggings about the shaoe of her childrens heads could be just a little bit upsetting for your friend.

Yes I agree that sitting up right for a baby for that long is very wrong but sit down and talk to her seriously about it without mentioning her child's head shape and if she still chooses not to listen then don't mention it again and if it annoys you that much then I would start looking for a different friend.

I think there's an increase of children who have plagiocephaly because they don't spend much time on their tummies, or at least, not like they used to. Of course there are some that will have plagiocephaly regardless of this (hereditary? not sure) but I do think some cases are not helped by lying down all the time, whether it be in a carseat, swing, bouncy chair, playmat, etc etc

and I do think the op is on a bit of a rant.....calm down and be kind to your friend

You could have a gentle chat with your friend and point her to something like this ?

Not getting any of this, babies should not be left in car seats too long because of the way it cramps up their spine, intestines and lungs.

Flat heads are something that happens because babies are put to sleep on their backs to avoid SIDS. It is a purely cosmetic thing. There are no other symptoms than a flat head, which looks a bit odd. But how bad is that in the scheme of things. I know no one with a thing about their flat head.

Message withdrawn

Puppydogstails, carseats are HARD (a lot harder thana mattress)so babies left to lie in them for a long time can get flat heads, as well as the other problems. In addition, they cannot roll over, so cannot alleviate the pressure themselves, as an older baby could in a cot.

my dd had flat head infact one side of her head is still flat and will more than likely stay like that (even tho doctors reassured me it would correct itself) she was not put in a car seat for hours on end, it is more likely caused by the way the child is sleeping in their cot i think

Where I live in Africa I've yet to see a child or an adult with a flat head, they all have the most gorgeous round heads. Babies here spend most of their time in a sling on their mother's back and consequently also develop very strong neck muscles. Though I do wonder how they learn to speak when they can only see their mother's spine!

I agree with the op. The only odd shaped head of babies in my NCT group was the one whose mother spent every day pounding the high street with baby in car seat travel system thing for hours on end. I def think they shouldn't be in these things unless they are in the car

Pruni try looking at www.plagio.co.uk there are many photos of babies with flat heads or visit the cranial tech website for before and after treatment shots.

sorry can't do links i'm afraid

Puppydogstail: research into the affects of plagiocephaly is unfortunatley very sparse but I know many mothers of children with unresolved severe plagio that would strongly disgree that it is purely cosmetic.

In severe case it can affect the ears, face, eyes and jaw all of which are pushed out of alignment.