Calling anyone with an alcohol dependant DP/DH please!

[littlemisspiggy]

Has anyone got or had any experience of living with an alcohol dependant person and has your relationship survived? I need advice on how to handle it. I know I could suggest AA or such like but at this stage I think that would cause rows. I suppose I need some sort of action plan/strategy IYSWIM.

The person needs to be ready to stop adn definitely needs to be ready for AA.There is little you can do My dp is a recovering alcoholic(14yrs+ now)and went to AA but it was all his own doing and tbh I didn't get too involved in his recovery as he just wanted to change his life so much I suppose I didn't have to.You could tell him that when he is ready to do something about it you will be there but if he is making your life difficult and you are still there he won't have much incentive.You also have to realise he may never stop or seek help and do you want to live with that.

He knows he drinks too much but I don't think he really believes he is an alcoholic. He once went to the GP (4 yrs ago) who thought he was more of a binge drinker than an alcoholic. He almost went to an open AA (or similar) meeting but asked me if I would go to. At the time we were barely speaking and I had just left him. I didn't go and now he seems to think that because I didn't go then I'm not interested. The thing is I can't even mention drink before he gets all defensive. How did you cope before your DP really did something about it?

LMP sympathies, very hard to coerce someone into seeking treatment, it has to be something they want to do as well.
How much out of interest does your dh drink? How often?
I often wonder about my dp but then think I'm being silly.

Hi LMP. What a difficult thing to have to live with. I don't have any direct experience but I work in an addiction in patient unit. You might find Al-anon helpful.

Hi LMP, I am a recovering alcoholic, and my late husband was too. Unfortunately when you put two people with the same problem into the equation it excaserbates it.

For you, I would definitely recommend going to Al-Anon, it's a wonderful fellowship and will provide you with support from people in your own situation and ways to deal with it.

Your DP can only change when he's ready, but you can help yourself by seeking support. I really empathise with your situation, I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy.

Let me know if I can help further.

kx

Thanks all for your sympathies.
Piffle, I always knew he drank way too much but ing the last 10 days I have been writing it down. In the last week of November he drank 107 units (wine, beer, cider & ready mixed cans of G&T). He drinks pretty much every day so I would say that was a typical amount.
Kokeshi, thank you. I see what you mean about me going to Al anon. I would have to find somewhere that had meetings so that I could go in my lunch hour. Doing that would also be an admission to myself that there really is an issue and there's no going back. A bit scary really.

Yes, I agree it's scary. But, once you get over that hurdle you will be amazed at how much you identify with those in the meetings. I can guarantee you will get something from them.

It sounds to me that you're ready to take that leap, and by doing so you'll be finding ways to help yourself - and your DP.

There is a link on the drop down menu on the al-anon site that you can search for meetings in your areas. Otherwise you can phone the helpline, it's completely confidential.

Please feel free to email me if you want to know anything else, otherwise keep posting!

k0keshi at hotmail dot com (zero between the two ks)

LMP my xp was an alcoholic and no, our relationship didn't survive.

But that's not to say yours won't. It really does depend what you and he want from your relationship and life and whether you're both prepared to work to get it. Al Anon is definitely the best thing you can do for yourself, as others have said, he has to do AA (or whatever suits him) for himself.

is your dp suffering with depression as well, does he give you hell when he's had a drink? my dp had a huge drink problem a couple of years ago, he wasn't at the stage where he would get up and start drinking, he would go to work everyday and then start drinking from about 5pm, he was very agressive and very insecure i was having afairs with the milkman the postman and even the bin men.

i realised there was something deeper than just needing a drink, to him having a drink made him feel better but the truth is it made the whole situation worse, he got to the stage where he had suicidal thoughts and that was the point where i took over the situation, i managed to convince him that he needed to go to the doctors, but i knew he would go in and play down the whole situation so i made an appointment and then i phoned and spoke to the gp and explained the whole situation and my concerns that he was on a slipperly slope down, i also explained that he had lost his dad a year previous in a terrible accident, this is what i felt was the whole route of his problem. so as the partner i really feel for you it is not a nice situation to be in and i guess you really dreading on egg shells at the moment.

i think you need to work out weither there is a deeper situation as in is he depressed has something triggered it or is it just he is alcahol depentent if he's depressed then get him to the doctors but don't rely on him going in alone and explaining all, cause he won't men aren't very good at admitting a problem. if it is just purely alcahol based then aa would be the best port of call, it sounds like he knows he has a problem which is a huge 1st step, i would personally put all my feelings a side and if you really think that the pair of you can come out the other side then i would suggest that you have a real heart to heart, say you don't want to argue ,that you want to help, and if he doesn't get help then you will not be able to put up with him for much longer, make him realise how he is making you feel and what he is doing to his liver etc and then say if he is prepared to get help then you will go to aa with him.

we have now come out the other side, luckily the doctor put dp on anti depressive tablets and they worked and the drinking excesivly stopped, he still has a drink with his friends at the weekend but doesn't get him self into a state anymore. my best advise is you need to talk to him and make him listen, the only reason he will get shitty with you is because he knows what you are saying is right and he won't want to hear it, so keep on talking don't give up on him he really will need your help and it is a long road but so worth it when you get your old man back. good luck (sorry it was so long)

Thanks for taking the time to post perfumelady. You are right depression definitely plays a part. Although he can be quite arrogant and 'Alpha male' he has an issue with self-worth and the fact that academically he did not achieve what was expected of him. He has not had a remunerative job for over 10 years although now that sort of suits us because he can do childcare. He is not stupid in fact he is very intelligent so I think it makes it worse.
He often tells me that I need to accept 50% of the responsibility for him drinking but I think that's too much. It kind of lets him off the hook.
I'm not sure I'm ready for the 'heart to heart' yet because I know it will get nasty. Maybe after Christmas.
I'm going to look at the AA website.

I am reasonably sure that my DP has a booze problem, but as it doesn't affect his job, temper, ability to do things, it doesn't really affect our relationship. I worry deeply about his health, but at the moment he has the same excuses if i bring it up "I drink less than you think i do" (He doesn't) "I don't drink as much as i used to" (true, but still too much, EVERY day). It doesn't help either that when a nurse asked him how much he drank as part of a routine unrelated thingy, she said that at least he drank loads every day, rather than big binges on the weekend! That's one of his excuses too now!

I think it's difficult because depression and alcoholism are kinda like the chicken and egg thing.

We alcoholics will grasp on to anything but the admittance of our addiction: oh, I drink because I'm depressed, I drink because I lost my job, I drink because I had an unhappy childhood. No, you drink because you are an alcoholic. Traumatic life events may tragger the cycle, but once you're in the throes of it, the cause gets lost under the years of alcohol abuse.

Once we admit we are alcoholic, and seek help for that, then we can go back with a clear head and deal with the past stuff. But we will always be alcoholic. Blaming people, places and things is a classic sign of an addiction.

Some people find that they're not alcoholic. But, it's worth a shot anyway. Alcoholisom can only get worse, never better. For many, the choices are insanity or death. I know because I have seen it too many times.

Sorry you are not even 10% responsible for his drinking. He is 100% responsible for his own behaviour, as you are for yours. You may make him angry, sad, depressed, happy, whatever, but he is responsible for how he deals with that. You are only responsible for what you do, not what he does.

One of the major reasons I split from my xh, was because I realised that somehow over the years, I had begun to feel and take responsibility not just for my behaviour, but for his. And no-one can be responsible for another adult's behaviour, we just don't have enough power over each other for that. (And if we're normal, neither would we want to have.)

Right I have found a AA which meets every Monday lunchtime not too far from where I work. I guess you just turn up. I'm on for it.
Detentiongrrrl, that sounds familiar as well.
The thing is he drinks so much that it takes a lot for him to actually be drunk. Last night he had 8 cans of strong (8.6%)lager. To anyone else he would have appeared sober but it's starting to affect him in the bedroom dept.

It's the Al-Anon meetings you're looking at right? It's confusing, but AA is for alcoholics, Al-Anon for friends, family etc of alcoholics.

If you're feeling nervous, you can call the helpline and ask if someone could meet you there. Each group has members that are responsible for running it and they are always delighted to have newcomers. If they know in advance you'll be there, they'll make you feel at ease.

I agree totally with ChristmasCaroligula. You are in no way responsible for his drinking. We try to apportion blame to justify our behaviour. We are blind to what everyone else can see so clearly. I know how hard it is, but you are doing the right thing by helping yourself first.

His drinking is nothing to do with you.I agree Al Anon could help It didn't for me as I just didn't want to go there and tbh once dp got a handle on the situation I didn't need to.I have always kept my life and friends etc the same and even my dp didn't want that to change A lot of his AA friends surrounded themselves with others in recovery and imo didn't have what I would call a balanced life.We still have parties and all the same friends but my dp is quite far down the recovery road.I found some of the AA stuff a bit cult-ish and it wasn't really me but I realised it helped dp in teh beginning as he recognised himself in many of the people there and that confirmed that he is an alcoholic.His life has opened up in amazing ways since he stopped.He is the happiest most fun person you could meet and is still the life and soul of the party.It is not all doom but does take time.Before my dp stopped drinking I found him annoying but we didn't live together so I didn't mind and I was out partying too.Once I got pregnant dp had been in recovery for a year and he then drank again convinced a stable home life and relationship would mean he could be moderate.So wrong within weeks he was back to square one and I asked him to leave when I was 5 months.After a month he went back to AA and we have never looked back.Is it having a negative affect on his life in any ways.It is obviously affecting you to have made you post xxx

I think it's horses for courses NH. It's great that your DP can still enjoy parties, I hate being with drunk people. Granted, I'm not that long in recovery and I really had to lose everything before I could see what drink was doing.

Many people in AA have no choice but to leave their old lives behind, which often includes firnds and partners. FWIW, I know people within AA who seem to have transferred their addictions to drink to all things AA. Which is not healthy either. I really depends on the individual.

2 years ago I went to AA every day, now I don't. I have friends who are in AA and friends who drink. I think what AA has done for me is given me the tools necessary to live my life in sobriety, instead of hiding away within AA or indeed in the bottle.

I haven't been in the past couple of months because I've just lost my hearing. It's been quite traumatic and I could be doing with the support, but hey ho, we'll get there.

Littlemisspiggy- i'm also the only one who can tell when DP is steaming, he has a very high booze threshold. I am even more worried because he's putting weight on, and his mother had bowel cancer, plus he's still smoking (less, but still smoking) He's putting himself in an early grave, and i don't know what it'll take to show him how much me and DS want him to be around and healthy. Hope it goes ok for you

my ex partnet is an alcoholic - he drank when we were together, but not to the stage where he needed alcohol to function.

I do sympathise with you littlemisspiggy, but your DH has to want to change. you wanting him to change isn't enough. I frequently do the straight talking tough-love thing with my ex because his alcoholism is such a drain on his parents, his current partner and our children (oh, and me!) but he always wants someone to wave a magic wand, wants rehab, can't do it by himself etc. it's still excuse after excuse and at the moment my sympathy is exhausted and I have come to teh conclusion that if he loves his addiction more than he loves his children, then fair enough.

you can't be in the situation where you tip-toe around the situation. I've tried the supportive silence and I've tried the tough love and the telling it like it is, is what I need. his needs ( alcohol) come second to the needs of our children to have a reliable sober father that doesn't smell of meths and piss.

that said - you need support - which is why al-anon is a good idea. they can help you decide what route you will take. from my experience telling him in no uncertain terms that he stops drinking or xy&z will happen - and then sticking to it, is the route forwards.

you do have my sympathies though. it's hard even when you don't live with them (then you can't keep an eye on them!)

quick word, don't bother hiding their alcohol stash. they find more, it's pointless and makes them more deceitful in their attitude to drink.

let us know how you get on.

My dp didn't need drink to function It was more that he couldn't have alcohol in moderation ever and also the effect of drink on his life.He can honestly say that anything bad that happened to him there was alcohol involved somewhere.AA was brilliant for my dp kokeshi its just al anon was not for me and I did want a life with dp but not one lived within the confines of AA He didn't want that either and many of his old aa friends still go evry day and are addicted to that now!The main thing dp has had to do is to find other ways to deal with emotions and situations which he would previously used as reasons to drink.We talked a lot in the beginning and many of the 12 steps are very similar to my philosophies on life anyway so we had that in common.

Yes sorry I do mean Al-anon. Kokeshi, you sound like you've come a long way. At what point did you realise you were dependant and what triggered you to get help?
Noddyholder, DH is the same. He can't just have 1 or 2 drinks he always drinks everything we have. Even when he says things like 'we'll save this nice bottle of wine for xmas' I know there isn't a chance in hell of that bottle making it beyond the next day.It does affect his life even though he would probably deny that. eg he says he doesn't drink and drive so he's responsible.But what happens is that he will plan his driving so that its over and done with early and he can drink.
Persephone, i agree it's pointless trying to physically curb the drinking myself. Sometimes if I went to the shop and he'd asked for eight beers or a couple of bottles of wine I used to 'conveniently' forget but it just made him touchy and he'd go out and get it himself. Or I would buy just one bottle where he would get a wine box.
I used to think maybe if I gave up drinking (I drink 1-2 units a day)it would be an incentive but I don't believe that anymore.

BTW Mumsnet is really great. I wish I had known about this site years ago as it might have given me the strength to do something about all this much earlier.
Detentiongrrl, DH has also put on weight. He is not obese but I think it's enough for it to have an effect on his health.
I must be fair, he can be a really nice caring person as well, it's just that I don't really like him much sometimes and it makes me question whether I really love him. But I do care about him.

LMP, I'm I've got to run but I think my case is one of the more extreme. A lot of people I know in AA didn't get this far into the 'gutter' if you like. But there are many more with worse stories than me, so it's a huge cross-section of experiences.

The inability to have one drink is in fact one key thing that separates an alcoholic from a 'normal' drinker. The have a theory it's down to some abnormal physiological response to drink. Once one is taken, the compulsion is set up and the drinker is off.

The first thing I remember being told is: "if you don't lift the first drink, you can't get drunk". It's the first one that does the damage. After that, the alcoholic no longer has control.

Another AA saying: "one's too many, 100 is not enough".

It helped me understand it better.

I'll check in later kx