Is breast cancer ever diagnosed by mammogram and ultrasound before biopsy confirmation?

[bsmirched]

This might get a bit long so I'll apologise now!
My sister has something of a history of over exaggerating health issues of her own and her children. Not in any malicious way but more from some sort of psychological need . She's been like this since she was a child. In every other way she's great.
A couple of weeks ago she found a lump in her breast. She has now been for the abovementioned tests and she says they told after them that it was cancer. There were problems during the biopsy which have delayed it so no confirmation from that.
Is this something that could have happened? I am a little sceptical but equally hope she's not in a cry wolf scenario iykwim. I'd really appreciate your thoughts.

I don't think they can be definitive without it.

You can be fairly sure that it's cancer at that point and a HCP may say that's how they feel but they wouldn't give a definitive dx without biopsy results.

Thank you.

If a hcp is fairly sure at this stage, would that suggest it might be quite advanced or just that the look of it is characteristic?

My sister was pretty much told told at the Royal Marsden that her breast lump was cancer at her first appointment but that it couldn't be confirmed until the biopsy came through.

Turned out it was a rare pseudo tumour, not cancer.

I had a very similar experience to your sister, nicole. In fact my lump had to be sent to another hospital for testing as the pseudo tumour was so unusual. My consultant was convinced that it was cancer until that final test was done. Longest 6 weeks of my life!

That sounds so incredibly scary, but thank goodness for such fantastic outcomes!

I was told by my GP when he first saw me he was pretty sure it was cancer, also told by the consultant I saw at the breast clinic that he was sure and the biopsy was virtually a formality. They were both right, I think in my mind I held a tiny smidgeon of hope that they were wrong until the biopsy results came back, but my symptoms were classic BC and the feel of the breast tissue told them that in their experience it was cancer.

Are you alright now kurri?

Yes I am fine thank you Blow - I was DX 7 years ago, had two years of active treatment - chemo, radiotherapy, surgery etc. and am now half way through ten years of anti cancer drug treatment. Feeling good

it sounds very much like your sister suffers from health anxiety. i have had this for most of my life and it is an illness on its own. She should seek some help for this.

that aside, yes they can diagnose cancer from us and mammogram. just as they can rule it out. What they won't be able to do is stage it or find out what type of tumour it is. This of course dictates treatment and prognosis.

your sister will be in a world of fear just now. she will need your support. xx

They wont know how advanced it is until they look at the biopsy but just because they can diagnose doesn't mean its advanced. The outcomes for bc are usually (although not always) good with timely treatment.

Glad to hear that, kurri .
In relation to what LEM has written, I was told that more money goes into breast cancer care than most other types of cancer. I don't know if that's actually true but the success of the treatments and the speed they are given does seem to reinforce that.

I believe that mammograms are graded M1-M5.

M1 is clear, M5 is cancer. The others might be. So eg my mum had an M5 one side, a big cancerous tumour, biopsy not needed to "confirm the cancer" but needed for other things, further info on tumour and possible treatments. She also had an M3 the other side which the mammogram said was "probably benign". In fact, info from the biopsy of that went on to prove that it was actually cancer.

So, if your sister's mamogram was graded M5, then it's cancer even without the biopsy results.

That's how I understand it anyway, but only as a layperson helping my mum.

Yes, I went to hospital and had mammogram, ultrasound and then lots of serious faces from the docs. They did 5 punch biopsies. I went along by myself thinking there would be no diagnosis that day but they told me straight away they were sure it was cancer and that the biopsies would just tell them what sort. I fell apart completely in the hospital car park and couldn't drive home. I wish I'd taken someone with me. 10 months later I've had chemo, double mastectomy for cancer on both sides and radiotherapy. It all felt a bit overwhelming at the time but it meant I was able to start treatment quickly. Hope your sister is coping ok with her diagnosis.

Thank you all so much for sharing your personal experiences and such positive outcomes. LEM I don't think it's health anxiety as such. I hate to say lie which is why I said exaggerate in my OP. Munchausens has been a term suggested by others but it's not that she lies to HCPS to get unnecessary treatment but that she then lies to us about how serious something is.
HOWEVER, on this occasion she was with her partner so I think we have had a fairly accurate account of what happened. I suppose I'm so used to being able to roll my eyes and dismiss the latest illness or situation that I'm almost in denial that this time it's real. Thanks again everyone.