The Back Pain Emporium, Internet Shopping, Drugs and Dealing with Doctors. Thread 6.

[MatildaTheRedNosedReinCat]

For anyone experiencing back pain it can be a very scary time. What is wrong? Who can help? How long will this last? We,on this thread are here to support you;offer empathy and help to navigate the almost impossible task of getting a diagnosis and the right treatment.We are not doctors but people who have trodden this path slowly and painfully. We also chat a LOT and welcome all newcomers. It is strictly non competetive regarding pain and no niggle is too minor.

Those who have long term back problems know that the best way to help manage back pain is to internet shop for shoes, bags, and back support devices. Those who are new to back pain, these are important lessons to learn. And here within this thread is where you will learn those lessons.

You will also find other helpful advice on pain management, different treatment options from hydrotherapy and physio to surgery, experiences of others navigating the big and scary medical world, both private and NHS (and abroad from the UK) too, as well as issues around work, being a parent while managing pain and disability, and the impact on the relationships around us. Not to mention the pain of dealing with claiming disablity benefits .

Between us all, we have a huge wealth of knowledge and experience, and more than the practical advice, the jargon and information, we know what back pain is like, how much is affects everything around us, and sometimes, all we need is to have people listen who Get It.

We talk painkillers regularly,sometimes drink wine , have hot water bottles and wheat bags galore, and hold hands a lot. It's potentially all very Unmumsnetty as we do actually show some lovin' from time to time, although we Never Ever call each other hun.

If you have advice, need advice, need a hand to hold, want to do some shopping, then come in. We are friendly. We talk a lot. Come in, have a brew and say hello

This is our 6th thread, here is the 5th, which has links too the others:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/general_health/a2203923-Back-Pain-and-Internet-Shopping-Thread-Number-5

hello! just popping in, missed you lot, lost the thread and just didnt get round to finding it! going to catch up with you all now.

I am doing ok, doing too much, have had some car issues, probably doing too much, but trying really, really hard to keep slow difficult had some increased pain in last few days at night in particular, through my butt, deep bone type pain. I guess it's healing pain as the bone was cut at two levels. Anyway it's kept me awake and fidgeting, which in turn has made me tired. So, last night I put a pillow under both legs as I lay on my side (most comfy as I'm a side sleeper) and then another big one between my knees, took a pillow away from my head to make my body completely straight and it eased. I think I have twisted a little as I have slept, and it's irritated (as I am meant to avoid twisting completely at the moment and the top leg keeps ending up over the other leg onto the bed) It was a pain to move from position to position, as I do turn a lot in the night (habit from trying to find least painful position I think), but it was definitely less painful. So broken sleep but with less pain. I hurt a little this morning though, including in my bloody neck!

I am mobile, walking ok, slow but am speeding up. Walking very short distances without my crutch, but take it for longer journeys just as a guide to stop me tripping over anything/help on uneven surfaces.

mama I wanted to respond to your post. Sorry you are still in pain. Yes you can have a discectomy at more than one level/disc. I think what is more important for the neurosurgeon to consider is whether s/he needs to one or two sides, as a little bit of bone needs to be removed (lamina) to get to the area where the disc is. Sometimes, if a large amount of bone taken each side can cause some instability at that level. Generally though, removing a small amount of bone is not problem.

I have just had a one sided (right), but multi level laminectomy, just over 2 weeks ago. It was L5/S1 and L4/L5 levels. It is similar to a discectomy, except in my case more bone was removed, with some ligament and a tiny bit of disc (I think) but largely it was bone and ligament removed at both levels, so in terms of recovery I can say a little about that.

I was unfortunate to have a spinal leak post surgery, but that's not common. Even with it, my recovery as been reasonably steady as it forced me to stay in bed . I was in hospital for 3 days. With a discectomy at one level, you will be in normally for one night, but if needed at several levels, maybe more than that, but not usually more than 3 days.

Recovery is, well it's individual, but reported at 5-8 weeks or so. But, in terms of knowing if it's a success, longer than that. I can't pick up more than 5lb for 6 weeks, can't twist, need to try to avoid bending, sitting for long periods etc, for 6 weeks. Driving is around 3-4 weeks, can be earlier for some, or later, but that's about normal. I am planning on returning to return to drive by end of next week/week after, but I am not rushing. The first 6 weeks are recovery, so little exercise, no physio etc.

You'll need complete help for two weeks, (first week, literally help walking to the loo, getting on it etc) and then depending on recovery, lots of help for another 3-4 weeks, with cooking, cleaning, getting dressed, moving around, with you being able to increase your activity slowly and regaining independence.

This is my second surgery. My first was not unsuccessful, it just didn't do enough and my symptoms returned/became worse/spread upwards. I had a micro-discectomy last time, which is easier to recover from I think, as long as no complications. This time it was an open discectomy due to needing it at two levels. My scar the first time was 1.5" max, small, neat, hardly visible. Now, it's around 6" due to the two levels needing to be accessed.

Surgery can be the best option. BUT. Look at ALL the alternatives first, and try EVERYTHING you can to get better without it, if that's possible. Sometimes, if the surgery is offered immediately, as with freedom, and you have little children it can be the most effective solution, as surgery that is done quickly has the best chance of complete recovery. Surgery is painful, disruptive, and there are of course risks involved, so look at this as a last resort. I have had physio, injection, hydrotherapy, pain clinic, before getting to a point where nothing was working and I simply could not go on.

For me, so far, so good, huge leg pain improvements. Immense reduction in pain. But its not been plain sailing, and it's early days.

IL's stabbing each other - no wonder you have been busy pink

As you have discovered Pavlov the pillow thing at night does help but yes its a bugger every time you need to turn - persevere - you are doing great! You can continue to improve over 3 years (yes I said 3 years though some say 4) so every little thing you do now does help for the future.

I am in a good place now and feeling ecstatic about not having to go back to that place grrrrr. Dropping the sertraline down to 50 to see if the hip pain improves. Have had lots of upper back/neck pain lately but it might be old age/arthritis so not much I can do about it. The hot wheaty pillow thing is nice but not sure its actually helping other than heating me up.

Waves to everyone else!

I need help

I'm sorry I've not read anything I just need some help
I've run out of tramadol?! What the fuck do I do? I've been too busy to get any more and didn't realise I was so low and now I don't have enough. So I'm sat here in tears as there is no out of hours dr just 111. Help what can I do?!

tickle is your chemist friendly? Mine is and will give me drugs she knows I get on prescription if I have messed up and run out (she's done it twice over the years and the prescription follows a few days later). Its worth a shot!

Oh thank you ally that wouldn't have occurred to me! I think they will remember be I am there all the blinking time!
Thank you
ps do they charge for this??

Actually is it worth calling them first?

Apparently we have a walk in centre at local hospital so I shall go there :) thank you

Sorry tickle I went out after posting - my chemist doesn't charge but we have free prescriptions here anyway (and yes phoning first to make sure they have some is good idea) - glad you got sorted

Thanks ally
having a horrible day. Dd15 is suffering with mental health problems and just threw a bowl across the room because I told her not to call her brother stupid.
Ds11 has been bloody ridiculous all day and telling his younger brother what to do and then saying he is being bullied.
Ds6 has been pretty bloody good all day. I'm afraid I'm blaming ds11 for all of this as he has caused alot of the arguments today.
So now two of them are upstairs crying, I'm worried dd will self harm again and I'm crying over a broken Denby bowl.
To top it all off my bloody mother is coming over and she is the most self obsessed person ever (even worse than I have been on this thread )
Add that to my pain and I'm fucking miserable today

tickle what a shit day for you it's enough without the pain isn't it, hope your DD is ok, and you. Did you get your tramadol? In future, if the walk-in centre was not an option, I would have no problems calling 111, as all they do is put you through to local OOH doctor anyway, who can fax it to your nearest pharmacy.

Had a lovely, lovely walk today, with DH, the children, and some good friends. Took the children's scooters, friend's boy took his and his new fancy skateboard, went to a big park with a bit of slope for them to go fast down, so they whizzed around while I pootled along at a steady slow speed, got a coffee from the 'pitch n putt' hut and now home with head belt on. Probably a little too far, but, definitely worth it for some fabulous air in my lungs, and great company.

One of my friends who visited is a nurse, she took a look at my healing incision, and is very pleased with how it looks, said it is healing beautifully, so lumpy bits, which can sometimes happen, smooth, clean, straight, thin, no redness at all, and she said I can now start to use bio-oil/other similar on it. So, very pleased with that!

Sorry you are having such a shit day tickle

Glad to hear you are doing so well Pavlov - my scar is barely visible now though looked like butchery for a while lol

ally how long ago did you have your surgery? what levels did you have it at? DH calls my scar 'frankenstein's scar' at the moment because of the stitch scars! It's really quite long though, I was surprised at how long it is. How is your tongue? Good to hear you have your tastebuds working again. Are the working properly, fully? or are there some missing tastes?

mag meant to reply to your post earlier about where I live - Freedom fields hospital is now a piles of houses! There are some pillars at the end of a couple of roads named after some of the wards! On the last part of it, they have just built an aldi/lidl (always get them wrong way around). I love Freedom Fields park, visit there and have a cup of floor-sweepings coffee in a real home type cup, for £1, while the children run and play in the sandpit etc. And they have a yearly mini festival with local musicians, which we go to most years (i live relatively close by to it, not walkable, well, not in my current state, but have done in the past). As a student, I lived almost directly opposite it.

Thank you lovely people. DH has got home and we've now had an argument. I'm going to lead myself to the wine I'm afraid. And To think I thought I could be a social worker! HA!

I wondered if that hospital had gone Pavlov. MIL was in a lovely new high rise hospital on the outskirts. Glad to hear you are getting about more now and your scar is healing well-but not rushing about too much I hope. Tickle hope you got your meds - and the wine has helped. I'm on the wine too with far less cause.
Ally I always assumed you must live near your namesake. You sound happy to have left work.

Tickle, I used to work with very, very difficult teenagers from mainly hugely deprived backgrounds. I was very popular and successful at this. In a parallel universe I was at home caring for and steering through school and uni my own two sons. I can assure you they were absolutely different scenarios.

I hope you have got your meds and in future have a stash for emergencies. My cleaner once threw out a whole carrier bag full of my meds (wonders if this counts as a MC and therefore ridiculous problem). It seemed quite serious at the time.

Wishing you a peaceful households and that your dd in particular is ok. 15 can be a horrid age. Are you getting help? I mean her, of course.xx

Thank you yes she is now being referred to CAMHS after self harming badly this week which freaked me out to say the least. Every time she's upstairs I think she's going to do it
I'm ok, got my tramadol and house seems calm now thank god!

Hi all
Pavlov thank you so much for your very helpful post it's very much appreciated. I'm glad you feel you are improving and that the surgery has been helpful.
I have a MRI this week and a consultant appointment Wednesday so I need to see what they say I guess.
I've had several ops mostly to put my hips back together again, and obviously emergency surgery with both my sons. I'm very reluctant to let them cut me again if I'm honest but I know I may not have much of a choice. The pain and lack of function right now is pretty debilitating, though it has been worse. I could almost cope with that but if my nerve function is also being further compromised then I'm pretty sure they will push hard for surgery. I need to avoid more damage if possible I'm only 33 and my youngest only 1.
Luckily I have a very helpful family so would have plenty of help and driving isn't a issue due to my paralysis I'm not medically cleared to drive.
I just find it so frustrating, I just don't have time for this, there's so much to do, so much I want to do. Plus my eldest 2 17 and 7 are very scared of me having any form of medical anything, I nearly died having my ds2 and they struggle with the uncertainty of my appointments. I want to tell them something definate, if that makes sense? Can you tell patience is not my strongest suit
Apologies for waffling, it helps me make sense of things to write them down.
And sorry for not name checking everyone, I have totally lost track of who's who but I hope everyone is doing ok.

mag not sure that high rise is really described as lovely these days! but, I had my babies there, so nice memories and they were great on the maternity wards, very lovely staff there, both times. and for some reason the cafe staff always seem to think i work there and offer me discounts so i like it there! had my first surgery there, ward experience not so great but was on different ward due to neuro being full. was on floor 11 so got a view at least!

V sore now. in bed with heat pad and pillows wedging me in one flat side position. difficult to type though as only using one hand! and i've got a bloody numb big toe!

i am, so lots of people keep saying, and i have noticed a bit myself, very drained in colour. i also noticed tonight dark sunken eyes, in corners specifically and there is literally no colour in me. is that normal post surgery, or should i take some iron supplements? i started taking some before surgery but stopped when in and forgot to start again. could it be anaemia? or just being cut open?

Pavlov I'm no expert but I've always been given and advised to take iron post surgery so I don't think it could hurt and may help.
I hope you can get comfy.

Pavlov - my surgery was 7 years ago L4 or 5 I think. My scar was red and ropey for ages but just a white line now (although I can't see it lol). Tongue is fine for eating but bit numb lump round worst bit which may or may not be permanent. Annoying but at least I am still here . Now I think about it my lower back was numb for weeks after surgery too (and my left leg still is in parts). Hey ho!

I take iron (included in multi vit and min tabs) on and off a lot as I seem to be better with it than without .. can't do any harm can it? I was certainly exhausted for months after back surgery and for weeks after tongue ones.

Pav, I'm wondering if you've simply got a case of January Face having been cooped up for so long? I can look like death if I'm in too much. Try a daily walk out and some good iron rich food. I'd be careful about further constipating supplements if you don't really need them. Having said that, Spatone is an excellent iron product and doesn't constipated at all.

Feeling flat and can't be bothered. And DH is going skiing this week which theoretically means some lovely peace and quiet yet for slightly irritating reasons I now have house guests for the entire time. And quite likely the kitchen fitters coming to ( please god) finish the fitting on the same day as the guests arrive. I was hoping for a few days without thinking about food or indeed much and now am looking at meal plans and escaping from guests without being even ruder than usual. Grrr.

Mama, you must be very worried. Are the nerve problems all in your legs? I, too had/ have dodgy hips, from birth. Lax joints can lead to all kinds of rubbish happening up the line. 33 is so young, though. Do you qualify for a Motorbility car? If so they will adapt the vehicle for you. It's made me cross that I keep finding out things I am entitled to yet nobody told me. Latest two are a Taxicard and Freedom Pass. Both amazing to have. If one knew.

January face! - I'm guessing the Scottish ones are for Burns day not for me but I do like them

matilda I think I probably do have a 'january face' I am quite pale naturally, but right now it's like I am ghost! I did some research googling and it does appear that post surgery anaemia is relatively common, especially if the surgery is orthopaedic as more blood is often lost through that kind of surgery. I am thinking mine might be classed as orthopaedic due to the bone being removed, but don't know. Anyway, if it is due to surgery, it's usual to rectify itself within 4-6 weeks. I might take some spatone, as that's soft on my digestive system, and easily absorbed. And yes to lots of fresh air! I am enjoying coffee by the sea. And finding there are not enough places to go and sit by the sea for coffee is making us think about whether we can set up a little cafe by the sea, then I can sit drinking coffee by the sea recovering forever

Sore today, i know why my back is hurting near the wound now, my nurse friend kindly explained how a wound drain is put in and that the muscle there is now recovering too all from it's own individual trauma.

about you not having a week on your own. what rotten timing. Are they close to you, enough that you can get space, and help, and emotional support or are they people they will expect you to step up for them as entitled guests as 'it's only back pain' ? Hope the former.