Vaccination for healthy 7 years old

[KBold]

Hi everyone, apologies for starting another thread on this. We've been offered the vaccine fir our son as my wife has MS. She has had the vaccine but the view is our son having it will reduce her potential exposure risk further. I was happy with it but after the inevitable internet searches (curse the web sometimes) I'm now concerned. I understand though that soon all children will have it routinely so I'm trying to convince myself it's a good thing he's getting it this year. Anyone here who knows of a good reason for him not to have it? Obviously I want my wife to be protected but I don't want to put our son at any risk. Any opinions would be appreciated.

Regards,.....Keith

Frontdoorstep according to your research, what are the risks of the flu vaccine? (not confrontational, genuinely curious)

frontdorrstep needs to show links to her research so we know if to take them seriously or not.

I have no idea how to provide links so I'm not going to but tbh I just read information and articles that are on line, in newspapers and nothing will persuade me that the flu vaccine is a good idea for the child receiving it.

By my reading of the nhs information this vaccine is to stop children passing flu on to vulnerable elderly people and I have a huge moral objection vaccinating children to achieve this, after all the vaccine is not 100% safe, nothing is, so some children will not have a normal life after receiving this vaccine and they had the vaccine to protect someone else.

In the case of the OP his child was having the vaccine to protect his wife, who had also be vaccinated, what does this say about the vaccines effectiveness. Regardless of what you think about the vaccine this is an area of huge moral issues.

Its easy to provide links there is an explanation just below the message box.
What websites do you use.

Won't have a normal life in what way? Again, genuinely interested to hear what you have read the vaccine can cause so I can do my own research.

MrsGSR clinical evaluation of flu vaccine which you might find interesting

Hi, I am a biomedical immunologist specialising in vaccines. I have never come across a serious reaction linked conclusively to the flu vaccine, but I have come across many complications where someone who is immunocompromised has contracted the flu. Also the nvic website is not a place for balanced and factual information.

Thank you bruffin that does look interesting. I'm very much pro vaccine (sat typing with a sore arm from my whopping cough jab yesterday!) but I'm always interested in new research and quite curious to hear what risks Frontdoorstep has read about.

Remember pandemrix, didn't that come with an increased risk of narcolepsy, now to me, suddenly falling asleep does not sound to me like a normal life, and how big was the risk from swine flu in the first place anyway.

Common sense also tells me that we do not know if there are any longer term effects and what about long term effects from so many vaccines, baring in mind that it has to be given every year.

But if you read what I said, my real objection is in imposing a medical procedure on a child (a medical procedure which I have to consent to) to protect another person, which after all was the whole question of this post.

Midnight Rose, you say you have come come across many instances of complications from flu from someone who is immunocompromised, that's fine but my child isn't immunocompromised, neither was the child revered to originally, the vaccine is given to one person to protect someone else, that is my objection.

I hadn't read much about pandemrix and narcolepsy, but it sounds like out of 6 million who had the vaccine, around 20 people in the UK developed narcolepsy that might not otherwise. Narcolepsy UK suggests that many of them may already have been narcoleptic but not diagnosed.

Whereas apparently around 1000 people died. Even with the link I think if I was at risk, with those statistics, I would still seriously consider the vaccine.

Also MrsGSR there was a rise of narcoplexy in china during the swineflu epidemic, where only 6% of those that had narcoplexy had the vaccine.

oops narcolepsy

Also healthy people can be affected by flu. 2 young people in my area died from swine flu one was a very fit young dancer. It is called a cytokine storm as was why most of the people who died in 1918 were young and fit. There was also an epidemic of a sleeping sickness (encephalitis lethargica) not long after. Oliver Sacks wrote a book called Awakenings about his attempts to cure for some of the victims.

What i meant to say, you dont know how many cases of narcolepsy there would have been if we hadnt vaccinated against H1N1, because looking at china and the 1918 epidemics the vaccine could easily have prevented far more cases than it caused.

But 84,000 reactions out of how many? 85,000 vaccinations? 850,000? 8,500,000? It really affects the numbers.

I've started having flu vaccs since work moved me to a 300 person open plan office. I felt pretty rough for 12 hrs afterwards, but I've had flu once (I think - rang my Mum in tears, and got her to do a 5 hr drive to pick me up. I lived alone and couldn't cope) and wouldn't wish it on anyone.

DS2 was offered the nasal flu vacc this year. He asked for more after the two sprays....... Didn't seem to affect him that night either.

Didn't a recent study show that the majority of people who had died in the 1918 epidemic die from pneumonia? (No antibiotics to treat it back then) Also, most of the young people were just coming back from fighting in the trenches during WWI so not exactly in the best of health.

nextphase, you may have actually had flu before but just not severely. Yes, it can be awful but it isn't always. Lots of people were found to be immune to swine flu without them actually having any of the symptoms.

The deaths were from pneumonia caused by influenza and a disproportionate amount of those who died where young and healthy. As i said two young and fit adults died close to me from swine flu. It strikes so quickly in some that the antibiotics dont have a chance to work. This explains it well

as well as

"1918-19, "Spanish flu," [Type A, subtype (H1N1)], caused the highest number of known influenza deaths: more than one-half million people died within the United States (nearly half of the deaths were young healthy adults aged 20-40), and between 50 and 100 million people may have died worldwide. Most deaths occurred within the first few days after infection, some deaths within hours of symptom onset, and other deaths occurred later as a result of complications.

I'm not sure if you're agreeing or disagreeing with me. I said that the majority of deaths in the 1918 epidemic were from pneumonia. Yes, the fatality rates were highest in the 25-40 group - particularly in men. As I said in my previous post, those 'healthy, young men' would have been fighting in the war.

According to this a minority of deaths occurred quickly (less than 5%)

"In most affected populations, 2 weeks after initial symptoms (5,17–22; Figures 1, 2). These findings do not suggest that an inherently virulent virus caused fulminant disease and rapid progression to death in high proportions of infected persons—or even in most fatal cases."

Where does your second quote come from? My link above does not seem to support that.

Have you even bothered to google cytokine storm 1918

Yes, I have. Have you read my post? The link I posted doesn't agree with what you were saying about it striking so quickly that it doesn't have time to work or that 'most deaths occurred within the first few days of the infection..." where did you get that information from?

that antibiotics don't have time to work *

Also, your first link suggested cytokine storms being responsible for the fact that the fatality rate was higher amongst younger people in the recent swine flu outbreak but that has also been attributed to the elderly having residual immunity to previous H1n1 flu strains.

Its clear you havent and you have misunderstood your own link. Just because they died 2 weeks after the first symptoms of flu doesnt mean that pneomonia was in those first two weeks.
The local case to me was a very young fit dancer. She was dead within 3 days of first symptoms. She was given strong antibiotics in the hospital but still died. There was another very fit man in our area died at around the same