MMR - February

[robinw]

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Yesterday & today's news: the government now wants to study Andrew Wakefield's work and get him as an advisor. Yesterday's Mail on Sunday said that the makers of the MMR vaccine had donated £50,000 to Labour Party funds after advising Mr Blair not to say whether his son had had the vaccine or not...

MandyD I'm afraid I have as much faith in the headline grabbing Daily Mail as a mine of real facts, as the Sun!

Point taken - lol!!

Mandy and Lil, this is nothing to do with MMR - sorry - just the Mail on Sunday - did either of you read the "report" on "drug boy Pelly" being "rehabilitated" into the bosom of the Highgrove set?

What it amounts to is that all the "friends" who "said" that he was a bad influence and that Charles had banned him were either hangers-on or invented. I read the whole piece 3 or 4 times with increasing disbelief and rage. I mean Pelly may or may not be a bit of a rogue, though probably no worse than many others his age, but there is no evidence either way in what the MoS said (or the Express today) - worst kind of tabloid muckraking - what they used to call the yellow press I think. And this piece had somebody's name at the top! None of it even makes sense. You'd think anybody with half a brain would be ashamed to put their name to a piece like that...

The best bit is that on the weekend when all this blew up, Pelly was in hiding AT Highgrove with Prince Charles and Prince William. So what's that all about then?

(Sorry. Rant over. Back to MMR.)

Hi,
thanks for the info RobinW. But can you give me a more specific web address for CDC? Have traced back through the messages, but can find no other reference for it.
Many thanks

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A bit late in this conversation, I know, but this seems the place for my question.

I have seen all your varied opinions on the MMR vaccination, but what do you all think about other vaccinations? Do those of you opposing MMR still vaccinate your children for tetanus, diptheria, polio, haemophilous influenzae type B etc? Do you vaccinate against chickenpox? Have you vaccinated your children against Hep B??

I ask this now as I am due to have baby no 2 in about 9 weeks time and Hep B is now on the recommended vaccination schedule in Australia. The first vaccination is at 3 days old, followed by boosters at 2, 4 and 6 months. What are your opinions on this?

Generally I am pro-vaccination and have had ds vaccinated against pretty well everything to date (he caught chickenpox before 12 months so has not had that vaccine and Hep B was not offerred to babies when he was born but he will be due for 3 shots of this between 10 and 13 years of age), but for some reason vaccinating a 3 day old baby just seems "strange" (for lack of a better word) to me. Any opinions greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

Hi Chelle, Hep B is not offered routinely in the UK at present and neither is Chickenpox, although I believe the DoH is considering adding it to the MMR.
I hold my hands up here to be criticised for an inconsistent approach in that we had all the other immunisations done to schedule, not without a second thought, but confident that we were doing the right thing. Meningitis C, newly available in the UK, was especially welcome.
I did not have the same confidence about the MMR and as the main UK clinic offering them separately was literally round the corner, we opted for separate immunisations three months apart, with measles being done first and mumps last.
Bit of a dim question: surely a 3-day old baby would only need Hep B if it had been exposed to the virus in the womb? What is behind the Australian policy? Is there a serious problem with Hep B over there?
Hope you are keeping well.

Thanks for the responses. I would not say that Hep B is rife in Australia, and as Suew indicated, it can only be transmitted by exchange of bodily fluids (same as HIV) so the chances of babies/children coming into contact with the disease are very low. As explained to me, the idea is to immunise as many people as possible as a bit of a herd immunity thing, but also to prevent children inadvertently becoming infected via a needlestick injury or similar. DH and I would be pretty far down on the list of people likely to be exposed to the virus (neither of us have had Hep B or been vaccinated against it or lead the type of lifestyle that would be likely to expose us to the disease) and we live in the country so do not frequent city parks or beaches where our children may come into contact with infected syringes etc. I am not sure as to why they want to vaccinate 3 day old babies in the general population (mothers not infected with Hep B virus) but am continuing to look into it.

As Suew also said, it is quite easy to find information on vaccines and side effects (proportions of children affected by side effects etc, eg for Hep B it is 1 in every 600 000 vaccinated suffers from potentially serious side effects which is a much higher rate than the measles vaccine included in MMR) in Australia. I had not realised that this was not so in the UK so I have always been a bit surprised at some of the attitudes I see on Mumsnet with regard to vaccination. I suppose I would be likely to feel the same way if I felt that information was being withheld for some reason.

Sorry this is rambling a bit but I have never wondered before whether to vaccinate or not and find myself in a "strange" situation, as I mentioned before. Thanks again for your responses.

As I understand it, Hep B virus (HBV) is much more infectious than HIV, as it is a hardier virus to begin with, and its concentration in the blood of infected people is much higher. While it is true that the ways it's transmitted are in many cases the same, it's much easier to pick up through cuts and so on and can also be spread through human bites, as it is present in saliva.

The virus can survive outside the body much better than other blood-borne viruses and can survive in dried blood for over a week. So, you could get it from a toothbrush, razor or nailclipper, not just a syringe. For all these reasons, it's very common among people who live in nursing homes and so on, and staff at these are advised to get vaccinated, as are people who live with a carrier, and healthcare workers. I'd say it's wrong to think of it as a purely sexually transmitted disease, and so assume children are safe. The incidence in Australia is thought to be only around 2% though, which is low.

You're right about Hep B being easier to catch and hardier. I had to get vaccinated because of my job - delve into peoples personal belongings occasionally! However, it often doesn't "take". A number of colleagues, despite having the series of 3 injections, still have no protection. Don't know what they're meant to do now?

Thank you both for your repsonses. I did realise that Hep B is a sturdier virus than HIV (which is pretty wussy outside the host as far as viruses go) and that there are other ways to catch it, I guess my explanation was a bit simplistic .

Having a pretty good understanding of the disease itself, I am interested in others' views of whether to vaccinate a 3 day old baby or not. DH and I have been toying with the idea of Hep B vaccinations for ourselves, but do not actually see ourselves at being at risk, unless we continue to travel to countries where the prevalence is much higher than Australia (we have both been vaccinated against Hep A). By "not at risk" I mean (apart from things already mentioned) we do not work in human health fields, live and work in a rural area etc etc. And we are still contemplating having ds vaccinated between 10 and 13 years, as is the schedule for Australian children born before infant Hep B vaccination came into being here.