Chemist tested me for diabetes - sent me to the Dr TODAY urgently...please come and talk to me...

[MyHeadWasInTheSandNowNot]

These are my questions

1: The reading the chemist got was 20 - can anyone tell me what this means (ie how 'serious' it is) and if they think it could be controlled and/or preferably gotten rid of through diet and exercise.

2: What will the Dr do today.

The rest is whittering background.

Also, I just wanted to say that I'll have to go in about an hour and wont be able to get back on line until tomorrow afternoon, but I haven't done a runner and will be grateful for any help/advice.

[I'm a regular - I've namechanged because I'm not sure yet if I want to tell anyone or not and I have a few RL friends on MN. It's not that I mind people knowing as such it's just that I don't want it to turn into A Big Deal]

I have been wondering for quite some time if I might have diabetes. A few things have made me wonder about it such as

• Excessive thirst (always having to have a bottle of water on me)

• Eyes a bit blurry at night (been blaming the overhead light and the small tv screen with tivo bright red background and only a problem at night and spending too much time looking at screens)

• Occasional 'shakes'

• I am overweight and struggle with feeling like my 'blood sugars' aren't right

...but what made me 'man up' to getting tested was that last week & yesterday I had a couple of episodes of light headedness/feeling faint when doing things such as changing a lightbulb, I had also been having them in the shower, but put that down to it being hot/steamy etc

I called the chemist about a year ago to see if they did the tests, but ended up not going

I also went to my Dr about 3-4 years ago with constant tiredness and no real reason for it.... he put it down to my weight (which although I'm overweight was not stopping me doing anything, being reasonably fit etc), he really wasn't interested in looking further. I haven't been back, but am and have been pretty much constantly tired since before then. I know I should have seen another Dr but it's hard when you are overweight and they don't seem interested in seeing past that and accept their might be something other excess weight causing the problem.

I wonder now how long I might have had it for and thus how much damage I might have done already to my body, especially my eyes, that's pretty scary.

I was already overweight, but I was pretty fit - then something quite lifechanging happened and I've put on more weight, stopped exercising and I am not unfit. I'm certainly not can't move off the couch unfit - I could still easily walk 4 miles, run for the bus (i'd be panting but I could do it and would recover pretty quickly) - but something else I've noticed (just yesterday I really 'thought' about it) is that I have been putting off doing stuff like walking places (now I take the car), running up the stairs (now only ever walk), kicking the ball about with the kids etc and I realised yesterday it's because when I do I feel awful - not just tired/worn out but light headed and a bit pukey - it's been a gradual thing.

I am totally committed to exercising - a minimum of 30 minutes every day without fail (have just been for an hours walk - about 3 miles) and to improving my diet (which I fully accept hasn't been great for a while, since this 'thing' happened and for a wee bit before then).

I'm not looking for any magic cure - I just want to know if I can get rid of the diabetes through diet and exercise.

Thank you if you made it this far - or even if you didn't wade through it all but can help.

Yes Ilove DH was diagnosed a few weeks ago and has come up against the vagaries of the NHS. I was worried as I am overweight and carry most of it round my middle, but my readings are fine (at the moment!)

MrsHP No, I don't suppose I do need one, I just thought it might be interesting to see what me levels are. I know I could do essentially the same thing with lucozade or other sweet things, but I just couldn't compare it to the GTT results. Most people still seem to have them done, but I don't suppose it really matters... just curious.

Yes - my Hba1c was 10.9 (fasting 9.3) - both done on the same 'take' of blood.

I had washed my hands and rinsed them thoroughly, I rinsed them again - just to be sure - and the reading was higher. I think it was you that said it can depend on how deep you go and which finger though?? - though that makes no sense to me?!

Ilovesunflowers

Great fasting reading - looking good!! :)

If I were you, I'd try to 'properly' low carb to lose the weight & then if you still want to, try adding back the carbs a little at a time and see at what level you are able to lose that last little bit or maintain it. It would be much better to stay away from white carbs if you can - if you don't want to low carb, then try to eat the wholegrain things instead.

Chocolate - do you like the 75/80/85% stuff - it's much better for you then 'regular' chocolate.

With nuts and seeds - what have you tried? I don't like many nuts and they have to be roasted and salted, I can't abide them any other way (unless wrapped in chocolate - but that's a no go on so many levels now!). I only really eat almonds, macadamias & cashews (peanuts, but they aren't really a nut and aren't vg for lc). Would you be willing to experiment a little with nuts?

Seeds - pretty much as per nuts!! I like what I like and hate the rest!! I am eating the Food Dr Savory Seed mix and it's really good - honest!

Have you read any of BIWI's Bootcamp threads or the Bootcamp Recipe thread? There are loads of FAB ideas there for low carber, higher protein /fat meals - you might find a few things you are willing/able to try.

Do you eat bacon or ham (not great as both are processed, but make a change occasioanlly)? Prawns? Other seafood? Salmon? Pork?

Avocado? (I like it best with onion and cheese!)

How much do you need to vary your meals?

ExitPursuedByABear

Brilliant reading - go you!!! I expect your physical activity is helping with your levels too!

Poor DH though :(

What did he eat yesterday? Is he committed to helping himself diet/exercise wise or is he a bit more laid back and willing to take more metformin?

Swapping bread for Ryvita will help a little, most bread is between 15g & 24g per slice, Ryvita is 6g - but it wont help if he has lots more of them. It would be better to drop 'bread/crackers' altogether if he can, or at least drastically reduce them.

You can make lovely low carb fish pie and put mashed cauliflower or mashed celeriac (mash with lots of butter and some cream or cheese) on top - it's a LOT nicer than it sounds!

Have you looked at the Bootcamp threads? or the Bootcamp Recipe thread? Lots of good meals there that would make a nice addition to what you aready do.

ILove that was a good reading too - what did you have for dinner today?

MyHead. I really don't like any nuts (even in chocolate so they must be bad!). The only seeds I can eat are poppy.
I can eat bacon and ham but not great for the diet! I can definitely have it sometimes though. Dark chocolate is ok but not at 70% stuff...too bitter.

I hate avacado. God I'm so fussy. I will have a look at the bootcamp thread to see if any food stands out.

I am happy to not vary meals every day but will need a few different options if this is going to be a long term thing. Woman can not live on omelate and chicken dinner alone! Thanks for your ideas.

Dietician

I met with the dietican - and she was lovely.

She was really impressed with my diet, my weightloss and how much I have read/looked into the whole thing. She wasn't at all patronising - just genuinely lovely. She's even going to read Briffa :)

She said (after looking at my readings) 'I wonder if they ever reverse the diagnosis of diabetes?' (I was chuffed :))

About my diet she said -

• She didn't necessarily agree with Taubes etc that saturated fat isn't a problem, so thinks it's better not to have it when possible (however, the facts seem to stack in favour of Briffa etc).

• She was a bit concerned that avocados are high in fat & that I was having cheese as well - but when I explained that yes, it's quite calorific & 'fatty' but the rest of my day isn't... I only have 25g of cheese (and not everyday)and that I feel the 'good' outweights the 'bad' in avocado she was happy with that - I also 'gave a little' and said I'd have other things for breakfast sometimes too (Greek yogurt etc).

• She asked why I hadn't been having any fruit - so I said that I felt I was getting pretty much everything from veg that I could get from fruit and that I really didn't need the sugar in my blood! She agreed, but said it wouldn't hurt to have a banana or an apple etc ocasionally if I wanted it.

• She asked about beans/lentils/quorn/soya so I explained Briffa's view on them and said I have them occasionally.

• She said she thought there was room to 'up my carbs' to keep my levels stable - I just said 'Hmm, possibly'... she might not still think that if she does read Briffa (I was a little surprised she hadn't heard of him, but she had heard of Taubes).

• She said I was certainly getting my 5 a day - and someone else's!

She said she doesn't really think there's much she can do to help me as I have it in hand - but she would like to keep in touch as she found it interesting to see how much difference I'd made in a month, she said it's really rare to see - most people she comes across just go 'Oh well, I'll do as I please and take the meds to compensate' and that I can make an appointment if I do want to see her.

She also agreed it was terrible that I hadn't been given the opportunity to try to control it with diet/weightloss/exercise first as I wanted to (and am) and that she thinks I did the right thing in not taking the metformin and giving it a go - she said she was sadly unsurprised I wasn't getting that support and said if I wanted to, she could arrange some counselling through the surgery (for other stuff that's going on in my life as well as this).

So - all in all, very good and I feel she is 'on my side'

I just had THE most delicious 'salad' YUM!! (lots of rocket, radishes, peppers, mushrooms, slithers of stilton, seeds, avocado & some egg free mayo).

Doctors Receptionist Rang

I have to go and sit on the naughty step. I have been summons to see the Diabetes Nurse. I have been bad, very, very, bad :(

... I have requested another pot of testing strips.

I know - the shame

FGS - I got two pots (100) which if the prescription had come through as it should have next week, that would have been for around 25 days. You get the odd failure and allowing a couple to test the monitor etc - that's less than 4 proper tests a day.

Now, I test that much pretty much every day and then on top of that I retest if the reading doesn't seem right (and I'm normally right about that) I test more if I eat 'different' food, I've tested when I've woken in the night - just random stuff. Now, I have bought about 300 strips myself (some I've used already and some arrived yesterday) and I'm prepared to do that as I know they are hard to get on prescription for type 2's - but it's mad. If there was eye damage they'd pay for what was needed, they'll pay for drugs, they'll pay for hospitalisation from any complications arising - but they wont prescribe something that can help me to prevent this getting worse?? It's ridiculous.

However, the thing I resent most of all, is being treat like a naughty child and being sent to the headmaster Diabetes Nurse as though I've done something terrible?!

Of course, she probably overheard me and the dietician talking yesterday - even though we were talking very quietly and will now know I'm not taking the metformin, from my notes she will already know I've lost 6kg (1 stone) - she should also know that my levels are pretty good... so why treat me like I've been mainlining sugar or something??

Grrrrrr

Ilove

Bear with me Have a really good think about what nuts you have tried and in what form. I cannot stand walnuts, brazil nuts, pecans or any number of the other vile little things - bleurgh!! The ones I do like have to be either smothered in chocolate or roasted and salted - but the ones I detest you cannot disguise in any way and they will get spat out - they are that vile. What I'm saying - with all this waffle - is that before you completely rule out ALL nuts just make sure you have tried them all in different ways. Try those ones again - roasted and salted and NOT mixed in with any of those other nasty things!!

Same with seeds - there are loads of different types and they can all be 'prepared' in a number of ways. Some are VILE no matter what you do to them and some are lovely (Food Dr Savory Blend for example).... try to test a few carefully and thoughtfully, before ruling them out.

Avocado - how have you had it? Was it properly ripe? If they aren't ripe they are VILE, really VILE - if they are overripe they are bleurgh - but when they are just right, they are a buttery, creamy delight - especially with a bit of cheedar cheese :)

Do you like cheese?

Do you like quorn?

Yes - look at the bootcamp thread :) You will find things that are lovely I'm sure!

Glad your dietician appointment went well myhead. Did she think your fasting bloods would come down any lower?

With the GTT test though if you don't need it, surely it would be a waste of NHS money and resources to ask for it 'just to see'.

Believe me I have tried with nuts and seeds in many ways and with all types. I do love quorn pieces and quorn mince. Cheese makes me throw up instantly.

MrsHP - I don't think she would know. She was really impressed by the fact I'd got my levels down so quickly with diet alone. I think she just sees a lot of fat people and tries to help them lose weight - for whatever reason it's needed.

GTT - does anyone 'need' it? Plenty of Drs still use it to confirm a diagnosis of DT2, it's just another tool used to do an assessment isn't it. The Dr couldn't explain why my levels had dropped so quickly - she blamed it on a faulty monitor

However, after todays 'issue' I don't think I need to do one.

Yesterday I bought the Lidl Greek yogurt instead of Total as everyone on Bootcamp said it was good, I had 100g for breakfast this morning (nothing with it)... blood sugars 8.5 after an hour and a half - this is the only reading I've had over 7.8 (that wasn't a failed reading) :( It dropped again to 6.5 by 3hrs. I'll have Total for a couple of days then try again - to see if it was that though.

ILove - OK - so, no nuts, no seeds, no cheese - only chicken, eggs & tuna so far (with occasional ham & bacon) - hmm... this page here might give you some ideas too!

Faulty monitor! That actually made me giggle a bit even though it isn't funny really. Well wait until you get your next hBa1c, that'll show 'em!

GTT - I don't think are done as a matter I course now generally for diagnosis as hba1c better. They do for pregnant ladies they suspect of having gestational diabetes obvs as totally different situation an maybe there are other conditions similarly.

Tomorrow try after 2 hours and see if that makes a difference my lidos can fall rapidly between 1 and 2 hours after a meal depending on what I've eaten.

Faulty monitor! That actually made me giggle a bit even though it isn't funny really. Well wait until you get your next hBa1c, that'll show 'em!

GTT - I don't think are done as a matter I course now generally for diagnosis as hba1c better. They do for pregnant ladies they suspect of having gestational diabetes obvs as totally different situation an maybe there are other conditions similarly.

Tomorrow try after 2 hours and see if that makes a difference my lidos can fall rapidly between 1 and 2 hours after a meal depending on what I've eaten.

MrsHP - yes and the way she said it was funny too - it was all in the tone Sad really though, I can imagine it would have really shook the confidence of someone concerned about their opinion.

Yes - only a few more weeks until my next HbA1c, the count down is on!

I'm not having the Lidl yogurt tomorrow - I'll have the Total for a couple of days. My levels either stay the same or rise a little at 1 hr, higher at 2 hrs and back to 'resting' at 3hrs but not once, until today have they gone over 7.8.

However (and possibly TMI) my period finally arrived this evening and apparently it can affect some women quite a bit - so maybe on another day it would have 'only' been 7.8.

But who know? It's a mad old thing isn't it!!

I'm disappointed :(

For brunch I had

Mushrooms in butter
2 quorn vegetarian sausages
Half a tin of tomatoes

I checked to make sure there wasn't any added sugar etc, but there was citric acid.

Reading 1 hr after lunch 8.5 FGS. 8.5.

So, that's 2 things in a few days - neither of which I was trying to 'test the limits' - they were both things I thought would be fine.

:(

What are the two things that you're testing, MyHead?

BIWI - I wasn't 'testing' them - I thought both of them would be fine :( I don't really want to 'test' anything until I've had my HbA1c done again (another 6 weeks).

The other day I had the Lidl Greek Yogurt (full fat) instead of the Total one (as the posters on the bootcamp threads said it was nicer) and my reading was 8.5 :(

Today I had half a tin of tomatoes, checked they didn't have any added sugar but all the ones I had in, did have citric acid (foolishly thought it was always extracted from citrus fruit, but have just looked it up and it's made in various different ways - one being from corn!).

My weight is the same as it was 2 weeks ago. Which I wasn't too bothered about, figuring my periods only just started and hoping for a woosh soon after... but to now have my levels not good either :(

I'm so tired, so so tired. I have loads to do and just can't muster up any energy at all.

I'm feeling dangerously 'fuck it' :( (but I wont - can 't afford to have my levels any higher).

Do you know what your bloods were before breakfast? I make the breakfast you have total about 17/18 g of carbs. As a rough comparison two weetabix (no milk) is 24/25 and porridge oats without milk also about 24.

For me personally I wouldn't have had the tinned tomatoes I think. 8.5 isn't ridiculously high after one hour. All the information I have seen only really gives suggested levels for after two hours - maybe if you decide to test after one hour and high you could test at two just to see what is happening. Other than that I would consistently test at two hours so you can compare levels and effects of certain foods more fairly.

Are you taking a vitamin tablet - I find this helps me combat tiredness. Of course the other option is to take the metformin you were prescribed,,,

MyHead. Sorry to hear you've had a couple of high readings. Did you repeat them pretty much straight away to check they were right?

Perhaps time to more strongly consider the metformin (I can certainly understand why you are trying via diet first though but medicines are there to help too).

I've had a bad weekend eating wise but very good blood glucose readings. Just ordered more test strips but if these kind of readings keep up it doesn't look like I'll need them.

Back to better eating habits tomorrow (I blame the fact that my gym was shut this weekend!).

MrsHP Hi :)

I don't really know what it was before lunch, I took them at 10 and it was 6.6, I ate at 1pm. I had a friend over for brunch and I wanted something we could both eat. The TT's were reasonably low in carbs at 3.5 per 100g and no added sugar so I thought they'd be OK.

Yes - it was about 18, by my calculation too. Occasionally one meal a day is around that and the others balance it out to around 30 per day.

My 2hr was 6.5

I was testing +1, +2 & +3 but when they all seemed to be 'OK' I stopped testing so often. I think I'll go back to doing +1 and +2 this week and see how it goes.

No, I'm not taking any vitamins. I am trying to get a blood test done for iron, vit B & vit D at least to see how those are, so I don't want to start anything until that has been done.

How would metformin help with the tiredness?

I don't really know much about metformin but would the more stable blood sugars that you would get on these meds help with the tiredness? I don't really know though.

Ilove Hi :) Yes I did, I even used the control solution to check the monitor and tried again - then used the contour monitor, it was 8.5.

Brilliant news re your readings What have they been (and what were you eating beforehand?).

Hopefully your gym wont be shut too often