I have to put in writing that I am taking responsibility for the risk that my baby might die from not vaccination

[StarlightMcKenzie]

The exact words the nurse spoke!?

I'll put something in writing if that is what they want but not that.

Apparently they have a duty to inform the HV of the risks that I am taking and have I heard the recent news oday of all the babies dying?

I'm bloody cross with this nurse tbh.

I am sorry starlight that sucks

That was about accessing your medical records. Although I sure WC was horrible.

i got measles on a camping trip in August accompanying my parents who had taken a group of EBD kids away. The GP told my mum to keep my eyes out of sunlight in case i went blind . I spent a week confined to a hot tent scratching my skin off. Also nasty.

Thank you Badvoc. I think I just get riled by jobsworth professinonals throwing their weight about. I've had more than my fair share and well, just grrrrrrrr

Lougle Yes. Thank you. Just a quick note is probably sensible regardless of whether I am obliged to or not.

Yeah. I get that. Honestly.
Just write a quick note.
Bare minimum of info.
It is the sensible thing to do, you are right.
But I don't always feel sensible :)

I've never been asked to confirm anything in writing either - that's 3 different children and 4 different PCTs.

All accept (usually with a ) my reasoning without further questioning.

StarlightMcKenzie Do you have a link to the research on measles and DTP causing autoimmune renal failure? I've had a look on google scholar without any luck.

No Jo I haven't. I looked once a couple of years ago and because I knew what I was looking for found something on it but haven't looked since. I wouldn't really know what I was looking for to be honest or how many links there might be in the chain to lead the consultants to conclude what they did.

It is reasonable that u have to put in writing that you are willing to allow your children to catch life threatening diseases when their is a perfectly safe vaccine available to prevent it. This will also then cost the NHS and therefore us loads of money to try and treat them and keep them alive!!

'This will also then cost the NHS and therefore us loads of money to try and treat them'

Forgetting your first ignorant statement, do you really think this is what will happen? Because I can tell you you are very much mistaken. I have a child already damaged due to medical negligence and all we get is justifications for why we should live in poverty without support.

First google came up with these, mostly foreign, articles.

Jacquot, C et al, "Renal Risk in Vaccination", Nouv Presse Med, Nov 6, 1982, 11(44):3237-3238.
Giudicelli, et al, "Renal Risk in Vaccination", Presse Med, Jun 11, 1982, 12(25):1587-1590.
Tan, SY, et al, "Vaccine Related Glomerulonephritis", BMJ, Jan 23, 1993, 306(6872):248.
Pillai, JJ, et al, "Renal Involvement in Association with Post-vaccination Varicella", Clin Infect Disorder, Dec 1993, 17(6): 1079-1080.
Eisinger, AJ et al, "Acute Renal Failure after TAB and Cholera Vaccination", B Med J, Feb 10, 1979, 1(6160):381-382.
Silina, ZM, et al, "Causes of Postvaccinal Complications in the Kidneys in Young Infants", Pediatria, Dec 1978, (12):59-61.
Na, "Albuminurias", Concours Med, Mar 1964, 85:5095-5098. [vaccination adverse reactions]
Oyrl, A, et al, "Can Vaccinations Harm the Kidney?", Clin Nephrol, 1975, 3(5):204-205.
Mel'man Nia, "[Renal lesions after use of vaccines and sera]." Vrach Delo 1978 Oct;(10):67-9, [Article in Russian]
Silina ZM, Galaktionova TIa, Shabunina NR, "[Causes of postvaccinal complications in the kidneys in young infants]." Pediatriia 1978 Dec;(12):59-61, [Article in Russian]
Silina EM, et al, "[Some diseases of the kidneys in children during the 1st year of life, following primary smallpox vaccination and administration of pertusis-diphtheria-tetanus vaccine]." Vopr Okhr Materin Det 1968 Mar; 13(3):79-80, [Article in Russian]

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1676761/

Jo, Don't understand a word of the above but it shows that it's within the realms of research that vaccines can cause renal failure.

I guess the message is aimed at ill-informed people who haven't researched their decision properly, not well-informed people who have good reasons not to vaccinate, such as Starlight and Jimjams.

Sadly 13 infants have died so far this year from whooping cough. I imagine none of them had been vaccinated, as they were too young, which is why the NHS is now offering whooping cough vaccine to pregnant women. Vaccines never come with 100% guarantees for everyone that they work perfectly - no medicine does. But if you are pregnant and have no contra-indications or have a baby and no reason for concern about the vaccine, it would probably be in your/ his or her best interests to have it.

Lougle beat me to it!

And LOL because iirc that was exactly why she got her name.

Although, they are quite old. I'm sure I once saw something more recent on a renal failure support website, but who knows.

It's surprisingly hard to find any balanced websites with information. They seem to be mostly 'pro' or 'anti'.

I read somewhere that the single most important thing that parents can do for their child's health is to breastfeed. That the benefits of breastfeeding are higher than the benefits of vaccination.

Suprised that bottle feeding mums don't have to sign a disclaimer!

Such disclaimers aren't worth the paper they're written on and are pointless. The nurse simply needs to document that she has discussed benefits and risks of vaccinations with you and you've declined. And detail exactly what risks are. That covers her arse.

Or maybe no-one is allowed to publish anti-vacc publications? in case they get struck off?

just an idea........

Ah well, DS (5months) is currently bfing this second (and has been all day) and has had nothing but milk direct from breast since he was born. Should I include that in my letter?

for Lougle You can't get much better reviews of all the evidence than the Cochrane Collaboration. Sadly this abstract doesn't go into detail about adverse events, but if there had been a serious or widespread problem, it would have been flagged up.

Searching for 'balanced' websites is probably a fool's errand because any reputable medical site is going to give the actual evidence, which will be strongly in favour of vaccination - for almost all people barring those who have real cause for concern such as Jimjams and Starlight.