Leo Blair's MMR

[Ems]

Do you think Tony and Cherie should reveal to us whether or not Leo has had his MMR? There is alot of debate about this at the mo, (not just in the Daily Mail!!) It is such a controversial issue, and for our Prime Minister to have a MMR age baby ........

I should have said, Marina, that the lack of a reference is not good. The research was done in early 2000. Although it can take quite a time to get articles into journals it may not have been published because the journal referees don't consider it to be of acceptable scientific standard. Also it isn't clear but I think the children studied may be the same ones seen by Andrew Wakefield.

If you are interested in reading more about autism you may be interested in www.healing-arts.org/children/autism-overview.htm#Vaccinations%20risk This has a lay guide to the various theories about the causes of autism. Wouldn't necessarily agree with all of the opinions but it is helpful in seeing what other theories are about.

Just to go back to poor little Leo for a minute - I'm still surprised that this matters so much to anyone. I've a lot of admiration for Tony Blair's political ability but he doesn't have a monopoly on wisdom. If Tony Blair (or Cherie) decided not to vaccinate their child that could simply prove they are as irrational as the rest of us. As Prime Minister he has to go with all the scientific evidence, as a parent he should be free not to. In fact they've gone as far as they can to say they've had it done without opening the floodgates to giving full details of the child's medical history.

Hmmmm, yes it does sound a bit dodgy that it's not yet published, particularly as it's such a hot topic. Lots of journals fast track papers which are felt to be important. If they are the same patients then it's not surprising that the same workers found positive results and it's not really very impressive that they are reviewing each other's work - hardly impartial. As someone who is currently spending all day reading scientific papers I also still find it a bit worrying that there is still no work from anyone else than AW and co that finds the same results. Obviously,I am trained to be sceptical (and I suspect that you are too Wendym) but it's a bit odd, which brings me back to my initial point that so much anxiety has been caused over one person's unsubstantiated opinion even in the face of a growing amount of conflicting evidence.

wendym - are the Blairs saying that Leo has had his MMR then? I'm a bit out of touch with events as have just got back from spending New Year at PIL's house (think, the Land That Time Forgot and you wouldn't be far wrong!)

wendym - yes, maybe TB is as irrational as the rest of us - but this isn't really about little Leo. This is about TB's government making it impossible to obtain single vaccines on the NHS - thus removing the issue of choice for those who cannot afford it - and the intense pressure that is put on parents, by TB's government, to have their children vaccinated. If TB then choses not to have his child vaccinated - or opts for single vaccines, he is a hypocrite of the highest order. It has been suggested that if the press win this one in fifteen or so years time they'll be trying to find out if Leo drank underage or has had underage sex. The difference is that those will be decisions that Leo will have to make for himself and as such his privacy should be respected - but the MMR is a decision that his parents have made and as such we should be told.

Why should our tax monies be used to pay for single vaccines for parents who choose to believe in a completely unproven risk?
If you want single vaccines, go ahead and pay for them. I get so annoyed by people banging on about their rights.
We are so fortunate in this country that the government has made it a priority to make available to all children a safe vaccine which in one jab protects against three potentially serious diseases. There is NO evidence to support the vaccine damage theory. But as parents we definately do have the option of being irrational ( some would say it goes with the territory!) so if you want three separate jabs ( which incidentally I think is cruel as well as irrational)go ahead but don't expect me as a taxpayer to fork out for your irrationality!
I realise the cost aspect is just a small part of this issue but I felt compelled to post this!

Jolene, I agree that the cost to the NHS is a factor. I have had my son immunised with the triple vaccine - but the point I was making is that not everyone who is concerned about the vaccine has the ability to pay for single vaccines. The upshot of that will be that some children of parents less well off will go unvaccinated. An easy way to get around this concern would be for Tony to just come out with it and say yes he has had Leo jabbed - then the very many parents who have been worried by his silence would hopefully relax and have their children done too. I also feel I should make the point that the government has made it incredibly difficult to obtain the single vaccines even if you are prepared to pay for them - doctors who are giving them out face major problems, remember the chap who had to face the GMC over this and the prospect of being struck off? Fortunately the GMC saw sense. So the single vaccine issue isn't just one of cost - it's about choice.

I have to disagree about the GMC "seeing sense". One of their members was going against accepted safe guidelines.It seems very sensible indeed to come down hard on that member.
Where do you stop with so called patient power? Parents have concerns. Fine. Some choose not to have the triple vaccine against all the evidence. That's fine too ( sort of, a bit cruel and irrational IMHO as I have said before) But choices like that have to be paid for and I object to paying for irrationality on the part of other parents who have decided they want single jabs for their kids, against the massed weight of medical and scientific opinion ( which we are also paying for).
I don't buy the moral argument that because some people want but can't afford single vaccines I as a taxpayer should pay for the single vaccine so their child does not go UN vaccinated. You can't run a health service or an economy based around bending over backwards to accommodate irrational people at every turn. And how strongly would a parent feel about the whole issue of triple/single vaccines if they used lack of money as an excuse not to get something for their kids they claimed to feel strongly about?
I actually have more ( but not much!)sympathy/respect or whatever with parents who choose not to vaccinate their children at all as this seems to have some kind of logic ( distorted and misinformed perhaps!)whereas the single vaccine camp seem the least rational of all, particularly when they expect the rest of us to cough up for their irrational fears.
Am I the only mum in the world whose only concern about the MMR was whether my baby would be distressed by the procedure?

The Vaccination Awareness Network has lots of fascinating info about MMR and other vaccines. Some of it is very technical stuff, way over my head, but anyone wanting to learn more will find it interesting. For instance, it claims that single dose jags may not be any safer than MMR and indeed could be less safe. Also that the cases of autism being diagnosed now are a variant type, different to the classical early onset autism previously recognised.

Jolene, I agree with many of your sentiments believe it or not - but if you take away the NHS cost factor, why is this government making it so difficult to obtain the single vaccines privately when that choice exists elsewhere. Myabe they aren't as effective as the triple vaccine - but surely something is better than nothing?
Also very interesting piece in the Sunday Times stating that more than 1,000 families have been given 1m legal aid to build a case under Eurpean Consumer law against the three main drug companies that manufacture the vaccine. About 2000 other families are waiting to join the action. Two of the governments' senior advisers are to be subpoenaed to give evidence.
Lawyers will also ask why a version of the MMR - Pluserix - was not taken off the market immediately when it was determined that it could cause meningitis. Banned elsewhere in 1990, it was not withdrawn until 1992 in Britain. Children died as a direct result of getting this vaccine that was supposedly safe - I know this for a fact. I have seen the evidence, I have interviewed the parents and seen confirmation of the damages they finally received from the vaccine damage board after years of fighting. That is not to say that the current vaccine is unsafe - but as with any vaccine there will be those who are damaged by it. It might be a tiny percentage - but this fact should be recognised. We are encouraged to vaccinate for the good of society. When things go wrong help should be available. Instead parents face years of fighting to prove that their children have been seriously damaged. I think the requirement is that your child has been 70% damaged - I know it used to be that percentage to qualify. My heart goes out to those children who didn't "quite make the grade" and to those who did.

Chanelno5 Sorry I missed the question before. Don't remember the exact words but Blair said something along the lines that they both had complete faith in the vaccine and to suggest that they hadn't had Leo vaccinated was thoroughly offensive.

If the scientific evidence on this was mixed so that the government had to decide between conflicting views then I'd have more sympathy for those who think he should have divulged his child's medical details. However even if he thought the scientists were stupid (and I can assure you they aren't - well not all of them ) as Prime Minister he couldn't go against an almost unanimous view. As a parent he should be allowed that choice and some privacy over it.

Although the government doesn't actually fund/ promote single vaccines there are organisations that will tell you where to get them if you want.

There are far more important questions about vaccination and its safety that what one person does - pity the press doesn't focus on them instead.

has any body see breakfast with frost this morning they had tony blair on and he as good as said that leo has had the mmr but did not say yes or no but said we have faith in it so that is that non news story put to bed

CAN ANYBODY RECCOMEND A CLINIC THAT DOES INDIVIDUAL VACCINES? I LIVE IN KENT AND AM FINDING IT VERY DIFFICULT FINDING SOMEWHER

LOOK HERE

cor this is an old thread

i am so glad i didn't get involved in this thread!

You could check choices healthcare they are based all over the country. We used them, expensive but good.