Taking Money From Pensioners to Care For Them... do you all know what goes on?

[Fangache]

Can't bring myself to post all the details here. But are you all aware that the government take ALL your money off you when you go into a home?

My Gran had £51k profit from the sale of her house. She also had her state pension, her NHS pension (she was a Nurse) and my Grandpa's work pension. Within 3 yrs of her being in a Nursing home they have taken ALL of her money and are now taking ALL 3 Pensions from her. Leaving her with £17.50 per week. Of that they take off £4 per week for some girl to come and do her hair!!!! WTF??

She smokes.... no way she can give up now, she's 83 and has advanced Parkinsons. She can't even afford her cigarettes now. She can't buy any of her 2 children, 8 grandchildren and 2 great grandhchildren birthday or christmas presents.

She worked all her days in the NHS. My Grandpa worked until 65 as an Insurance man.

What is she left with now? Nothing. Its a disgrace.

Just wanted you all to know that this happens.

Bozza - So sad isn't it.

But TBH I thought this was fairly well known.

And FAngache - yes it is. The individual is very lost in the system.

Bozza - No it isn't. The amount of people that are really shocked by whats happened with my Gran.

Its not so much the money from the house.... its the fact they are now taking all 3 pensions away from her and giving her a shitty amount of pocket money. How degrading.

Oops... I mean No it isn't very well known!

Usually, yes, the assets have to have been tranferred a certain amount of time before the owner falls ill. That's why seeing a solicitor is so important - optimally upon retirement, so it's clear where everything stands.

In the case of transferring a house deed, this can be done quite easily and then the former owner rents it from the new owner/trust/corporation for a nominal fee.

Other forms of assets - shares, for example - can also be re-assigned or sold, for a small fee, to a trust or corporation made up of one's relatives and then the former bearer can draw off them as himself or as the corporation he has formed of himself, depending on his position w/i the trust or corporation.

Pensions are trickier, b/c employer-sponsored pensions are generally paid into by the employee w/pre-tax income, so the government is going to want its cut no matter what. Private pensions, however, have different rules.

If I were you Fang, I'd be taking great issue with the nursing home about not having a member of staff to sit with her. That surely should be a priority.

I was going to start bleating on about how expensive all the care can be, but if they can't even accomodate that, they aren't earning their money properly IMO.

She should not have spent all of her savings on her care. When her savings reduced to £20,500 ( the current limit) she would have been entitled to assistance from the local authority. She would then have to pay a tariff income of £1 for every £250 above the lower limit of £12,750. When savings reduce to this lower limit she should not pay anything more from her own savings. The current personal allowance that a person in residential/nursing care is entitled to is £18.80. She should also be getting her nursing care paid for by the local Primary Care Trust.

Justmummy - She was allowed to have 11k. But when they did her financial assessment they said she had spent that on gifts etc etc and even implied that my Mum had taken it from her!!!

So she should only be allowed to keep £18.80 a week from her state pension, work pension and my grandpa's pension?? It came to around £140 per week.

Whats the point in paying a pension?????? If she has just had the state pension she would STILL be given the allowance of £18.80 per week!

Thank Feck I cashed my pension in!

Exactly, you're no better off in the end having any money. If you end up in residential or nursing care anything you do have will be used up in fees. So it's best to spend it all and enjoy life or sign it all over or give it away a long time before you need care.

Justmummy
Do they consider paying for your own funeral in advance - including buying a burying plot - over and above the level of savings a person can have before qualifying for assistance?

Sorry not exactly sure on that one. If you're in scotland anyway different rules apply. You can download the CRAG rules from department of health website. These are rules which have to be followed when carrying out a financial assessment for someone in this situation.

Expat - Never thought of that!

So sorry to hear of your Gran's predicament. It sounds very similar to the situation that faced my Gran when she went into a nursing home. However with the help of Age Concern who recommended a solicitor we went down a similar route to the one Expat mentioned whereby the house was sold and funds signed over to my mum and brother (although some of my Grans care fees had to still come from it).
Try Age Concern or Socail Services Eldery Persons Team for advice, or at least the name of a good solicitor who deals with cases like this.
Good luck.

Good idea, hornbag!

The government is forever carping about how people don't save for their pensions - no mean feat nowadays when you consider taxes, high cost of housing (including rents) and living (even public transport is far from a minor expense for most) and student debt levels. But then when you do you're stuffed on less than £20 a week like Fang's gran? People are going to start wondering why they should bother . . .

Bump - Just want to keep raising awareness of this issue!

But I thought that if they had savings under X amount (not sure what it is atm) then they don't have to pay?

I know when my gran died last year, for 1 month (while grandad was working out which cheques had to go to who) he was 'over' the limit (becaues it had been a shared account, but then changed to his name only), they're trying to get 1 months worth of money out of him for it. But once his account dropped below the X amount (think it's around 20k) he hasn't paid anything since

Once the money is gone QoQ they just take all your pensions off of you! They have taken the pension books from my Mum who used to collect my Grans pension for her.

Disgusting!

so how come my grandfather is 'sitting pretty' on 10k (which they know about) and no paying anything? and still getting his pension all to himself.

My Gran had £11k QoQ, but they said over the last 3 yrs she has spent it all...and more! So now she owes them all this money. So they will take her pensions from her now.

that doesn't sound right???

my mum is 78and still in good health and in her own home thanks God, but this is an issue that she really worries about. We looked into her transferrign her house to me but it really isn't possible at this late stage. The Age Concern website is really good for finding out info.

one of my dad's best friends recently died (aged 56) and it's thrown his mum into a right quandry. As he was still living at home (eligble batchelor and all that ) and her husband died about 20yrs ago, she'd put the house into his name 15yrs ago - expecting him to outlive her.........unforutantely of cousre ne died first - and now the house has come back to her as the closest living relative !

She's now in the process of trying to redistrubie nearly 500k worth of assets (house, premium bonds - he was buying £500 of those a MONTH, and all his massive savings) around friends and family so inheritance tax won't have to be paid twice when she dies!

QoQ, your grandad should be still contributing towards his care from his pensions. His savings - if below £10k will not be touched. Unless he is very ill and fully funded by the health authority.
Fangache - your gran must have been assessed as having this £11k and then when reassessed social services would have wanted to know where this has gone. If it has been gifted to family this will be classed as deprivation of capital.
I don't think that the weekly personal allowance is by anywhere enough but i do think that people should still have to contribute from their pensions. After all if they're in residential care they don't have housing to pay for and bills to pay. Someone has to pay for their care - which is very expensive and there just isn't enough money for government to pay it all.