MMR did your child have bad reaction?

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i don't want to kick off an anti MMR thread but genuinely wondering how widespread reactions are.

dd2 due for MMR on monday and after reading some threads i'm wondering if i should postpone till after xmas.

nurse at clinic only ever says 'give calpol' so no way of knowing how extreme a normal reaction may be. i've read that some reactions can occur days later. have many people found this to be true?

ds1 had large red swelling at site and dr said probably reaction to base serum and advised not to continue MMR boosters, that was 17yrs ago. so we didn't but i assume he has no immunity and wonder if he should try again before going off travelling. i'm sure i've heard the MMR composition has changed

dd1 had all vacc without problem. but dd2 seems to suffer more reactions. hardness around site on legs and unusually tired, inconsolable crying.generally not herself for max 48hrs.

so did your children have reactions and can you describe them please?

Actually bruffin, you're the one that giving out advice that goes against current recommendations, based on treatment specific to your own son who, as you pointed out yourself, is a very unusual case. My advice is based on current guidelines and I've also suggested that Goldys speaks to her doctor about her son's individual needs so I'm not really sure what you disagree with (although based on your attitude on a few threads I think you just like to take any opportunity to be rude). Please remember that you are not a doctor either and what may work for your son is not advised for all.

Goldys, If you want to check the guidelines yourself they are on the NHS website and NICE. they both state that you should not use antipyretics to prevent convulsions and appear to be up to date so I'm not sure why bruffin's consultant is stating otherwise unless he was being specific about bruffin's son.

The first thing the ambulance paramedics did was give my dd an antipyretic - (this was in 2009) but she was over the convulsion by the time they arrived. They would have been unable to give anything to her while she was actually convulsing obviously!

An antipyretic would have no affect on the 'convulsion' per se, but it lowers the temperature that causes said convulsion - so it is preventative. I know some people don't like to give their children any paracetamol or ibuprofen or whatever, and that's their choice - but having been through that experience with dd I wouldn't hesitate.

Sabrina, I don't think they're saying don't treat the fever - just that antipyretics don't prevent further convulsions so don't use it for that sole purpose iykwim. It's the rise in the temp that causes the convulsion, not the temp itself.

Sorry I don't really understand what you are saying?

I treat any fever with calpol/calprofen to prevent a dangerous spike in temperature that could cause a febrile convulsion. Therefore it can prevent a further convulsion - by keeping her temperature under control.

I think the idea that you should give paracetemol for every fever 'just in case' is what they are advising against. It is the sudden rise in temp that causes the convulsion so it will often happen before you've even realised they have a fever. You can't really prevent them unless you can predict when they are going to get a temp. Fever is actually one of the body's defenses against infection so it is a good thing and current guidelines say you should only treat fevers if they are causing discomfort.

Bumbleymummy doesn't understand the issues involved Sabriana.
When ever DS has been to hospital with a febrile convulsion ,the first thing they do is give him paracetamol, it's normal treatment.

"http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Febrile-convulsions/Pages/Treatment.aspx this is the NHS advice for treatment of Febrile convulsions]] dated november 2010

it actually says

"Paracetamol and ibuprofen have been shown to be effective in reducing a high temperature. Removing any unnecessary clothes and bedding will also help to lower your child?s temperature"

When they are talking about regular medicines in the link they are not talking about antipyrectic but drugs like phenobarbitone. My sister who also had GEFS+ (as did my mum and grandmother) was on a daily dose until she was 10.

I told my consultant that i heard you should not use anti pyratics and she laughed at me, it was not specific to my son.

What bumblemummy doesn't understand is that the febrile convulsions is the sympton of an illness it is not a seperate issue. It is very unlikely that a child that ihas had a febrile convulsion is not in discomfort. They are ill from things like flu, ear infections,virus all illnesses that cause pain and discomfort which you would medicate for anyway She should not be using in scaremongering tactics to tell parents not to be using antipyrectics, when there is no warning that they shouldn't use them in these circumstances.

It is patronising in the extreme to believe that parents are giving children antipyretics just in case they get a temperature, they would be giving them everyday. It is pointless advice, but she just likes playing doctors on these boards.

Don't want to get involved in any arguing here, I really appreciate all the support on here and obviously keep in mind that everyone comes on here speaking from there own perspective and experience. I'm not medical and haven't done loads of research but both the consultants in the hospital and my gp have advised that I use both paracetemol and ibuprofen to control his temp although can't always know when it will spike which I have been told is the point when convulsions can happen.

sorry link

Bumbleymummy, you got me a bit worried so I looked up on the NHS Direct website:

www.nhs.uk/conditions/febrile-convulsions/pages/treatment.aspx

Says quite clearly to treat the temperature which is the underlying cause of febrile convulsion with paracetamol/ibuprofen - but that other medications to prevent febrile convulsions are not advisable except in very rare circumstances.

I have heard that 'fever is one of the defenses against infection' etc but after what she went through in 2009 I'm not risking her getting a temperature so high that she goes febrile again.

What is your interest in this - have your children suffered febrile convulsions?

My DD had no particular reaction to any of her vaccs.

Goldysmum sorry didn't want to get into an argument, but bubbleymummy brings up the same advice someone mentions febrile convulsions.

We have always used ibrprufen and paracetamol together as well, but NICE don't recommend it because they feel parents are too stupid to do the doses properly and will overdose. The hospital always calculated doses by weight rather than age.

3 kids, no reaction

Ooh lots of cross-posts there!

Agreed Bruffin - nobody is suggesting giving calpol on an everyday basis to prevent convulsions. Goldy - I have had the same advice from my doctors too (as recently as a few months ago) - just keep doing what you're doing, it is all we can do!

But - you can usually tell when your child is getting a fever (obviously there may be times when it is so sudden you can't) but there are plenty of signs that they're getting a fever. I know the signs to look for instantly - my dd goes grouchy, hot head (she's like a little hot potato!), I check her temperature and then only if it raised, I give the calpol.

I'm leaving this now - Bumbley's interest in this is a little odd.

I have not said don't treat the temperature. I said treat the temperature if it is causing discomfort. (as per current guidelines) The current guidelines also say that antipyretics do not prevent febrile convulsions and should not be used solely for that purpose ie. Your child has a slight fever but is otherwise fine (which can happen bruffin, not every child with a fever is miserable and in pain) and you immediately start giving them paracetemol because you are afraid they are going to have a convulsion. I'm not sure how that is any different to what you have said so I don't see why you found it difficult to understand.

Bruffin, I'm really not sure why you think that I consider a convulsion is some seperate issue not caused by an illness. Would you like to point out where I've given any indication of that or where I've given advice rather than just pointed out current approved guidelines? I think you're just being petty but please, prove me wrong.

Sabrina, not sure why you think it is odd, except that bruffin has said it is. Yes, I have an interest in it due to a young cousin's recurrent convulsions. They are actually now looking into other causes for if because it has been happening more and more often so there has been lots of reading going on and plenty of discussions with several medical professionals. A very stressful time for all concerned. Have I proved myself worthy of having an interest now?

Bumbleymummy- you know it is not only me that has a problem with your posts - there were at least three completely different threads last night many posters told you that you are annoying, patronising and smug, that must tell you something.

Bruffin, you haven't answered my question. I'll keep waiting so I can find out what your particular issue was with my posts on this thread. Otherwise, it just looks like you've decided to be petty because you disagree with my posts in general. I have a feeling that is the case.

DD2 had 13mo MMR and ended up in hospital next day on drip after severe vomiting. Hospital played down any link.

DD1 had 3yo booster and fainted :0

I was also advised by nurse not to give calpol routinely unless temp got too high whereas when dd1 was a baby we were given a prescription for calpol and even advised to give her some an hour before her jab. Not sure how that relates to treatment of actual convulsions though.

That must have been so scary sooty How is your DD2 now? Did she react to any other vaccines or was that just a one-off incident? I hope it was!

DD2 is prone to vomiting bugs and has had some problems since birth but that one seemed different to the others, more aggressive for want of a better word. She's actually vomiting again today but nothing serious and it was her only reaction to a vaccine so far.

we didn't give anything and DD had no reaction and DS had a minor rash that didn't bother him.