Welsh Labour or Plaid?

[Viscoelasticity]

These are the two main parties in my constituency and I can’t decide which to vote for.
I don’t feel strongly about Welsh independence because I don’t realistically think it will happen.
I do feel strongly about public services, sustainability and the environment, and about Welsh interests being represented in Westminster.

Which of these two will you be voting for and why?

Diolch

Why are Welsh perspectives and interests any more important than Cornish or Irish or Yorkshire or Manchester or Highlands perspectives and interests? There will be 32 Welsh MPs, representing the proportionate number of people living in Wales. Why should there be a disproportionate number of them, which there would be if there were more Welsh people?

My original "why" was in response to your statement "the more Welsh people in Westminster, the better." I don't think you've really answered that.

Would you really rather see more Welsh people in parliament with policies you despised rather than English people with policies you agreed with?

I think that is where nationalism becomes very dangerous.

I think you've misunderstood the post re more Welsh People in Westminster - its not at the expense of English/Cornish/Irish/Scottish. There's been a lot of noise about labour and the tories parachuting candiates from outside Wales into safe seats - meaning that local people are not being represented by people who know the area.

Also due to Wales' population and the new boundry changes (meaning we have 8 less seats) it means that Wales' voice needs people to advocate for it on a UK level.

Labour seems to have becktracked on a lot of what its previously supported for Wales - more devolved powers and the HS2 funding so I will be voting PC on this basis.

In the last UK parliament, there was indeed an unfair representation of Welsh voices. But not in the way you suggest.

6.4% of all MPs elected in 2019 were born in Wales, compared to the nation’s 4.8% of the UK population.

Does this mean the English should be on the streets demanding fewer Welsh people in Westminster? Of course not.

An MP in Wales represents their part of Wales. They should advocate for what the people in their constituency want. If they fail at representing then properly, then they won't get reelected.

Voting for someone who knows the area is reasonable. Voting for someone just because they are Welsh, or wanting more Welsh people at Westminster just because they are Welsh is petty nationalism of the Farage kind.

I mean if you believe that having more Welsh people to represent the people of Wales is the same as Facism then I can't help you.

Will be voting Labour. Our candidate, the former MP, is excellent.
I have voted Plaid in the European elections and possible the Senedd but this constituency has only ever been Labour or Tory and I don’t want a repeat of Tory.

I’m another that thinks Mark Drakeford is a man of integrity. I am not a fan of Vaughn Gething and voted for Jeremy Miles in the leadership ballot.

A neighbouring constituency has a ‘parachuted in’ candidate and although it’s a shame there was no one local, he’s immensely capable and if elected will likely be in the cabinet in years to come which will potentially be good for the constituency and the area’s profile.

I think the key problem is that rural Wales in particular is distant from Westminster both geographically and socially/culturally/ economically. Personally I think the better solution is more devolution, but it's also important that we have Westminster MPs who understand the place that they're representing.
Of course the same is also true of eg rural Lincolnshire, and you can see politically how unrepresented people feel through the lack of support for the main political parties there.

The dominance of London & the south east in political discourse is a big problem generally I think for a healthy political environment.

Totally agree and well-articulated.

Someone earlier mentioned the misogyny issue - Rhys ap Iowerth is taking strong measures to deal with this, including suspending a member TWO years after an alleged incident because he wasn’t the leader of the party at the time but is now and wants to make it unequivocally clear that this is completely unacceptable: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-68490882

If you can't see a difference between "the more Welsh MPs advocating strongly for Wales in Westminster" and "the more Welsh people in Westminster, the better", then I worry for you.

Of course not. Some of the best Welsh MP's have been born outside Wales but they have integrated themselves in the community and therefore understand local issues (and on a Wales wide basis as well) and are representing the people of Wales. That's what I mean about havung Wales' voive heard.

Labour. The Tories have to go.

A lot of people do Labour for national elections and Plaid for locals.

I am voting Plaid. Ben Lake current MP and he is good on local issues. With the change in boundaries we are now in his constituency. I have never voted Plaid before but like him. I would have voted Labour otherwise.

Nobody has said that Welsh perspectives are more important than anywhere else, I’m not sure where you got that idea from.

It’s reasonable for everyone to want to be represented by people in their local area.

Thanks to everyone so far who’s shared the reasons for their votes.

I want people who actually live in Wales to stand because they understand the local issues. However, I don't want some idle intellectually challenged person in Westminster. I'd rather have a parachuted member as they've been given in south Wales.

Drakeford was a bully with his team, shutting them up if there was dissent. He was worse than any Westminster whip. He wasn't democratic.

I'm friends with an assembly member going back four decades. He's no Geraint Morgan believe me.

If I still lived in Wales, I would vote for Plaid. I know it won't happen in my lifetime but want an independent Wales. I also want Welsh interests to be represented, which for those which are not common to the rest of the UK won't be otherwise.

Again, there is a significant difference between "wanting to be represented by people in their local area" (reasonable) and "the more Welsh people in Westminster, the better" (unreasonable).

Okay, you’ve made your point.

I take it you are not voting for either party asked about in my OP? Or if you are, I would be interested to know which one and why.

It’s a bit deeper than that though, these are Starmer loyalists being parachuted in, following prior promises that this wouldn’t happen and with the excuse being now that “It’s a time crunch and no other options.”

I believe in a meritocracy and I find it fairly astonishing that in Welsh city locations in particular that there isn’t a single other person with proper links to Wales AND brains who could have been put forward. I think it speaks volumes when the candidate is not the choice of the local constituency party - talk about riding roughshod. Also have friends in the Senedd.

I'll vote Labour or Green. Haven't decided yet. Labour had a 15k+ majority in my constituency last time, so will walk it this time.

Gething wasn't the choice of the members either. We're just an arm of Westminster and the unions. Starmer want to reign us in I suspect. Gordon Brown stirs the pot behind the scenes down here too much for my comfort.

Oh I know, I totally agree.