One Nation Conservatives

[ItsPrettyGoodReally]

Hi,

I wondered if there is any chance that some of the current Conservative Party folks will now move over to Reform UK, leaving the remaining Conservative Party to be reclaimed by the more moderate tories like Dominic Grieve, who left over frustration at no deal Brexit?

I'm only asking out of interest and don't have a view on it. I'm a life long Labour voter, but I was quite impressed at those people like Dominic Grieve who left on principle. I would be glad to see them back in parliament.

I would too. I'm naturally left of centre, but I have many friends who could be classed as One Nation conservatives. We agree more than we disagree. And none of them are voting for the current crop of Tories.

A country needs a good opposition. If the Tories are electorally obliterated, as the polls currently suggest, we won't have that and that isn't good for democracy. I would love it if a One Nation conservative party could rise from the ashes of the right wing shitshow we have now.

Agree. A one nation Conservative Party without an obsession for free markets and a reluctance to shame the poor and vulnerable, minorities etc. A bigger understanding of poverty and inequality maybe ?

I would too I'm a floating voter who's slightly right of centre. I despair of the lunatic fringes in both major parties.
At least the greens and Lib Dem's are soaking up a few of wilder members !
I'd also like to know who Rishi Sunaks advisors are. He seemed quite reasonable until he called the election and now appears demented. Who on earth advised him to leave the DDay memorial early. He left David Cameron and Macron to get their photos with Biden. Massive own goal. I think his team must be trying to make him fail.

Me too. Another Labour supporter but had a lot of time for Rory Stewart and his ilk. Morderste, sensible policies that just had a different way of tackling the big issues than the left. An excellent opposition.

What does "one nation" mean in this context?

Yes I would too and I hope that this happens. It could take quite a while though.

I'm honestly not sure, but people seem to say that when they mean "those sensible guys who never get a word in edgeways any more".

Wasn't David Cameron a one nation Conservative ?

Weren't we all in it together?

But we weren't. Austerity left whole communities depleted and a few rich people a lot richer.

One Nation Conservatism is centred around the belief that the rich have a duty to help look after the poor, so they believe in the welfare state. They also don’t believe in an absolute free market, so are not theoretically opposed to legislation that protects worker’s rights, nationalization of certain industries or government intervention during recessions and depressions.

Its usually contrasted with Thatcherism - which is big on individual responsibility (so generally against anything but minimal welfare) and takes a laissez-faire approach to the markets.

This is the thread for me 🙂

@AmpleFatball thank you for explaining that. I've always wondered. I think of the Conservatives at the party of Margaret Thatcher, and I saw first-hand what her policies did to the ship building community where I grew up. The community has never recovered and it's very clear to me that the "One Nation Conservative" values that you mention were not part of her approach to that community. I wish they had been as those values sound really good.

How do we find these One Nation Conservatives and get them back in parliament? Is it possible that they are now spread between the right wing of the Labour party, and that group of Tories who got shown the door during the Hard Brexit manoeuvres?

Iain Dale on LBC said he hoped he could help rebuild the party if he became an MP but has fallen at the first hurdle. I don’t know if he’s ONC but he certainly doesn’t agree with Suella Braverman et al.

One Nation Conservatives are becoming about as rare as red squirrels.

I hope that will change over the next few years.

The good guys all left and were pushed.

@ItsPrettyGoodReally some of them sit within the Lib Dem camp too. It used to be that the centre ground in the UK was crowded, which was why Labour lurched left - which didn't work for them. Now the Tories have leapt full on into the far right swamp, having thrown their sensible people to the alligators, and there's more space in the middle. (Apologies for the abuse of metaphor).

Another lament for the vanished One Nation liberal conservatives. It would be marvellous to wrest control away from the toxic maniacs that currently call themselves the Conservative party. Until they do, I am struggling to vote at all. Where's are the Monster Raving Loonies when you need one?

It's from Benjamin Disraeli and his notion that the poor and vulnerable should be cared for. A sort of Noblesse Oblige.
Every town has a park or a museum paid for by some Victorian philanthropist. That's One Nation Conservatism.
Superceded by Thatcherism.

Spot on.

I think David Cameron presented himself as such, but he was still a neo-liberal.
Theresa May was more ONC.

Very good points.

The Green Party is very radical in many respects, very left wing and somewhat controversial re: women's rights. I agree with you about the Lib Dems.

We need a conservation zone!

I'm nearly 70 years old and I have never, ever known a Conservative government that stands for anything other than the pursuit of money and the denigration of the poor and vulnerable. They have vetoed every single reform of workers' rights, welfare reform and stood solidly in the way of social justice since they were formed in 1834. This includes their unanimous opposition to the NHS. Why do you think the Labour party came into existence? Nobody in this country would enjoy anything resembling the rights or privileges we do today without the Labour party. Credit must also be given to the old Liberal party which at least created a form of state pension and stopped child labour.

One Nation Conservatives my fucking arse. What does that even mean.

@ginasevern , someone, in any economic model, has to be the responsible competent big cheese who makes hard decisions. Who to employ? What work to do -- and what to turn away? Which risks do you take with your savings or those of your family who have lent to money to get started? The folk who are willing to take the worries and the decisions home after work should and do expect to be paid (or profit) more than the person who fills the bag and seals it.

You can snipe all you wish, but I would put solid cash on a bet that you don't meet a payroll for six employees every month, from a business you started from scratch, and that pays roughly £150k in VAT on sales every year, plus corporation tax, pension fund contributions for all employees and the employer element of NICs, at 13.8% of earnings. Plus rent on the premises and several insurance policies, and the utilities, and business rates. That is the small and medium entrepreneur, that employs all the people who work in garages, and corner shops, on markets and building sites, and hairdressers, or beauticians, and garden centres and farms, and the rest.

It is very easy to castigate business if you define it as Amazon, giant supermarkets, big Pharma and Thames Water... all of which need their feet holding to the fire, I agree ... but look around you. How many people do you personally know who depend for work on small companies? Or do you mainly know people earning money from big public sector organisations? Where do you think the tax is paid from?