SenoraPostrophe's grammar workshop...

[SenoraPostrophe]

...go on, ask me anything.

Good Lord, DrDaddy, there is so much to learn about language! I wanted to do an A level in Eng Lang a while ago (as a grown-up I mean, rather than while I was at school) but it wasn't offered at my local college. Might still keep my eyes peeled though, as these are my favourite sort of MN threads ( at my geek-dom)

Apostrophe question

Old Boys' Club is abbreviated to:

OB's Club or OBs' Club

Tricky. I wouldn't use the abbreviation in the possessive, e.g. I'd write, "Old Boys' Club, of which he is an OB." Both ways look odd.
FP is less perjorative by the way. Unless you are talking about a club of old codgers!

But, of course, I defer to the OP (rather than OB), as I realise this is her workshop and I'm just interloping....

This came up in real life in the context of an alumni association I've been involved with but don't want to mention and they are referred to as Old .....s.

I'll see if I can find the specific context.

ooh, ellbell and drDaddy, shall we form a clique? interlopers most welcome.

DrDaddy, I agree about restrictive and non restrictive relative clauses, but you can only drop "that" if it refers to the object and not the subject of the clause. so you can say "the meat we eventually served" but you have to say "the cat that got the cream".

But I'm sure you know that.

Sue - I suppose OBs' club is better but it looks very clumsy. Can't you use OBC?

Can you tell me a good way to remember when to use 'effect' and 'affect'. I never know.

SenoraPostrophe - Indeed! Your clarification is quite right and correct. I'm such a grammar pedant; I drive DW mad!

Effect/Affect: "Effect" is generally the noun, e.g. MN has had a great effect on me,
while "affect" is the verb (to have an effect upon sth), e.g. DrDaddy has been considerably affected by MN.

However, effect is also a verb (i.e. to cause sth to come into being), e.g. DrDaddy was able to effect a change in MN posting policy.

And affect can also be a noun, but the stress is on the first syllable, so it is easily distinguishable from the verb,
e.g. DrDaddy displayed a considerable lack of affect.
These last two examples are much less common than the first two, however.

not exactly simplifying it though drdaddy!

I used to remeber it by thinking that you can't have two e sounds - i.e. something can be affected but not effected

except you can ,as drDaddy says, but that's a much less common word.

Oooh, a clique!

But I do use effect quite a bit - such as "we effect change". We are effective people. The work led to good effects.

only the first of those examples was the one I'm talking about though xenia,.

ellbell - shall we have a secret handshake?

[very over-excited emoticon]

Have never been invited into a clique before.

im so exited ive forgoten how to rite gramatical.

this is MNet, I believe there is only quiche here and no clique
Just wanted to share my fantasy that SA is Stephen Fry - whom I love!

Now should that be whom or who??

ha!

I'd like to see him cope with 3 under 5s. well, 3 under 6s since last week.

whom is right though.

He'd love this thread.

SA - thanks for the welcome. This is a great thread! BTW Ellbell and I discovered on another thread that we're both medievalists, although, in my case, no longer in a professional capacity.