SenoraPostrophe's grammar workshop...

[SenoraPostrophe]

...go on, ask me anything.

it is perfectly ok to split an infinitive: it's another rule that was just made up by victrians who thought they knew best.

it's when you put a word in between "to" and the stem part of a verb, like "to boldly go" or "to carefully clean".

LIkewise I think it's OK to end with a preposition. Others disagree. (as Churchill said, This is the sort of bloody nonsense up with which I will not put. or something like that)

Victrians - were they aliens on Star Trek? (Noting your reference to boldly go etc.)

You shall go to the ball (Cinderella)

Isn't it imperative or emphatic or something?

(Scuse me for butting in, SP )

that's what I meant, wendy. it's not a simple prediction anyway.

gb: i believe so now you come to mention it. klingon has a very simple grammar you know.

last night, whilst watcging tv dh exclaimed
'it oozed all out'

i told him it was not incorrect but better english to say

'it all oozed out'

am i right? oozed all out doesnt sound right to me.

(i dont put my capitals etc in because i am lazy btw, not illiterate! have english degree for the record!)

Ohhh, sorry SP, hadn't spotted that you had been there already

I teach English as a foreign language in Germany (mainly to children, but I will soon start teaching adults).

Ok, where should the full stop go there?

I think I might print this thread for future reference! Very informative and amusing. SenoraPostraphe, you should write a book.

That full stop is correctly positioned but are the brackets necessary?

"I teach English as a foreign language in Germany, mainly to children but I will soon start teaching adults."

perhaps I should have called this "SenoraPostrophe's showing off thread".

Lady: I'd have said "it all oozed out" because all is part of the subject of the verb (I would have thought). But think [verb] all out might be a regional expression?

macmama: as you have written it. full stops go inside quotes but outside brackets I think. You'll like teaching adults. they pay attention and everything. and if you spend a week making a special role playing exercise for them they appreciate it.

I am a bit addicted to brackets. (Can't seem to help myself, almost every sentence has them)

Do I then need another full stop at the end of the bracket sentence??

If I am going to use so many brackets, I might as well use the proper punctuation.

i think the full stop goes after the brackets, but maybe wrong.... can't remember!!

• may be

I am a bracket addict too, macmama (honest!)

I am a bit nervous about teaching adults to be honest. They ask really stupid questions, eg. "Where should the brackets go?"

Can anyone recommend a good grammar book? One that even I would understand?

for tefl purposes, Murphy's English Grammar in Use or Advanced grammar in use are good. they have exercises for the students too. Or Swan's good grammar book is good too apparently

...also adults understand if you say "I don't know: I'll check and tell you next week"

SP - thanks for last night's advice, sorry I had to bugger off.

Thanks, will have a search for those in Amazon.de

Do you have a clear, concise explanation for 'that' and 'which'? I had it explained to me some time ago and am now at the stage where I do it instinctively, but that's not very helpful when trying to explain it to someone else. The thing about the comma isn't enough, IMO, because a lot of people misuse commas.

And where do you stand on the s/z debate - recognize, recognise etc.

Is the word 'whilst' redundant?

Lio - that vs. which. Essentially there are 2 kinds of relative clauses - restrictive and non-restrictive (parenthetic). Restrictive clauses are so-called because they restrict the nouns they modify, giving them some necessary information, e.g.

"The meat that I bought from the butcher was rancid."
Which can also be used in restrictive clauses, e.g.

"The meat which we eventually served was rancid."
Note, these clauses tend to drop the "that" in spoken language. If you can drop the "that" then it's probably a restrictive clause.

Non-restrictive clauses: It does not give necessary information, e.g.
"The meat, which was rancid, was nonetheless surprisingly tasty."
"I charged double for the meat, which I gave to the Scouts."

If you use "that" in the above sentences, you change the meaning, e.g.
"The meat that was rancid was nonetheless tasty."
(Implies there is other meat that isn't rancid)
"I charged double for the meat that I gave to the Scouts."
(Implies there is more meat that wasn't given to the Scouts).

P.S. I'm not a butcher by the way...

Full-stops and brackets/inverted commas

The full-stop goes outside the brackets/inverted commas IF the sentence starts outside the brackets/inverted commas.

BUT if the sentence is wholly contained within the brackets/inverted commas, THEN the full-stop should be inside.

I teach English as a foreign language (mostly to children, but sometimes also to adults).

BUT

I teach English as a foreign language to children and adults. (I am English, but I live in Germany.)

OR

It is written that 'the pen is mightier than the sword'.

BUT

'The pen is mightier than the sword.' This is an interesting concept which merits further discussion.

-s- or -z-

The forms with -s- (recognise) are UK English. The forms with -z- (recognize) are US English.

However, the forms in -z- are becoming increasinly prevalent and some UK publishers now prefer them.

The only one I really can't cope with with a -z- is 'analyze'. Ugh, that looks so wrong!

Sorry for hijacking your thread, Senora. Am trying to put off the 'real' grammar mistakes in the pile of essays sitting next to my computer. Must log off now!