Neighbours’ new drive - will it kill our trees?

[DrBlackbird]

The digger is out there as I type.

They used to have a concrete path that was up against our fence so a buffer between their old drive and our property line. However that’s now being dug up along with the roots of our trees that grew under the fence. As it’s their property, I don’t think there’s anything that we can do, but will it kill the Yew and Birch that are right against the fence on our side of the property?

God. Poor birds. When neighbours took down several mature Oaks, the pigeons moved into our Birch and the blackbirds only returned last year after being decimated by magpies. Will they now lose these nesting trees as well?

Oh dear they sound like heartless Philistines That's awful to take out mature oak trees.

Perhaps you could put down good compost and water to help their roots come your way. The trees that are planted in the streets don't seem to have much space do they . you might be ok. (hopeful emojji) !

I think that trees' roots more or less mirror the branches above ground, so hopefully there will be plenty of roots left deep down.

I sympathise as our new neighbours cut down 8 large trees, some were very large, destroying a massive amount of habitat. Why move to a house with a mature garden and destroy it? There are lots of new builds with ready-cleared gardens nearby for a similar amount of money.

I wouldn’t have thought so, how deep are they digging?

You wouldn’t be able to do anything- they can remove all branches and roots that are on their land unless there are TPO’s.

Trees near houses can be problematic, messy, branches can fall and cause damage. It’s happened to us unfortunately, on more than one occasion.

Birch roots spread fast so it will quickly re-stabilise, but having said that, mine is planted next to a retaining wall and all the roots are on the garden side, they present no problem at all on the retained side (I'd know as the concrete panels have drainage gaps).

how deep are they digging?

Looks to be about 4 to 6 inches. The workmen tell me that they ‘have to’ dig out all the roots are they’ll push up and break the concrete.

Just heartbreaking to see so many mature trees cut down. Our own ‘tragedy of the commons’ whereby one house doing it, okay but a whole block and it’s sad for nesting birds, the environment and loss of a sense of green spaces.

Trees near houses can be problematic yes I do appreciate that. They’re near the drive more than the house, but we’ve always had the branches trimmed so they don’t go over the fence at all.

Thanks to those with suggestions that the root damage might not necessarily result in dead trees. I guess it’ll be a matter of wait and see as there’s no TPO etc. So they can do what they like.

Very doubtful it would kill the trees. But they are within their rights here you don’t have an entitlement to their property, above or below ground.

They will be very glad to see the back of your birch tree which is planted far too close to the boundary. I know from bitter experience the horrendous mess these trees make on the ground almost year round - it is horrific. However they grow like weeds and yours will no doubt recover. They are normally far too spindly for nests though so I'm surprised to read about pigeons making it their home.

Are the trees at the far end of your garden by any chance?

Those are really stupid trees to plant close to a property line. Birch are often fast growing and both can grow much too big. They are also messy trees. Birch can provide lots of food for birds but they aren't trees that's birds would typically make nests in (apart from maybe woodpeckers or similar)
I think birds are more likely to nest in the yew but, again, thats a really poor choice of tree for boundary unless it's a small tree.
Mumsnet always goes nuts about trees but there's nothing wrong with felling certain tees. Too many are the wrong type of tree planted in the wrong place. I felled a lot of trees in my very overrun garden when I moved in and replanted lovely native trees which now provide masses of food and habitat for wildlife.

As far as I know, contractors are not supposed to disturb tree roots within a certain distance of the trunk. Make sure you get the name of the firm off their van.

Call the tree officer at the local council as soon as possible.

@Fernandina

As far as I know, contractors are not supposed to disturb tree roots within a certain distance of the trunk. Make sure you get the name of the firm off their van.

Call the tree officer at the local council as soon as possible.

Ah, thanks for this information. It’s one reason I posted as I wondered if others had some knowledge on trees/processes more broadly. I didn’t know that. It may be too late as the damage is done, but I’ll call council tomorrow.

Are the trees at the far end of your garden by any chance? I’m not sure how this is relevant to my question?

Yes they probably were planted too close to the fence, but as we have a very small garden there wasn’t much choice of where to plant. And I agree birches aren’t the prettiest but it’s what was there when bought the house. Definitely it’s the Yew (which I hate for being so lethal) that is home for several species.

Are the trees at the far end of your garden by any chance? I’m not sure how this is relevant to my question?

I asked this because we have to tolerate birch trees our neighbour planted right next to the boundary, about 2 metres from our back door. Their house is actually around the corner so their very long garden is at right angles to ours - they have the pleasure of looking at a lovely view of trees in the distance while we have the chore of constantly cleaning up our patio, driveway, guttering and windows of all the detritus dropped from their trees. And of course the cost of pruning all the overhanging branches.

Sorry OP, I do love trees but you can tell I feel rather bitter about these ones and people who plant them without a thought for others.

If the tree isn’t covered by a TPO they can dig the roots, although arborists would recommend they observed the root protection zone but this can exceed 5m for some trees so unlikely they’d do it.

The removal of the roots can kill and/or destabilise the tree and whatever the works are that are undertaken may cause soil compaction which can kill them too. Faster growing species would be more tolerant of these impacts though. Think it’ll be a wait and see situation. May take a while to become apparent.

Yes they probably were planted too close to the fence, but as we have a very small garden there wasn’t much choice of where to plant

There are lots of lovely wildlife friendly trees and shrubs suitable for a small garden.

I think it's selfish to plant unsuitable trees on boundaries. You are obligating neighbours to have to clean up after your bad choice of trees and to pay out to have them pruned. It's a shitty thing to do

Yes they probably were planted too close to the fence, but as we have a very small garden there wasn’t much choice of where to plant

So if you don’t have the space you don’t plant at all right? If you or a previous owner did then they were Ill informed or out of line.

As said you do not have an entitlement to your neighbours land and bleating oh gosh the birds, doesn’t change that , you are not and never will be entitled to their land, no matter how many birds you put forward.

I do love trees but you can tell I feel rather bitter about these ones and people who plant them without a thought for others

Yes, I could get that frustration. This birch was planted (not by us) at the end of our garden which backs onto their drive. So yes some leaves would fall into their drive, but not by their house and we do pay to have it properly trimmed ensuring no overhanging branches on their side. Hard not to have a tree that has some impact on a neighbour unless you’re lucky enough to have a sizeable property.

@0blio

They will be very glad to see the back of your birch tree which is planted far too close to the boundary. I know from bitter experience the horrendous mess these trees make on the ground almost year round - it is horrific. However they grow like weeds and yours will no doubt recover. They are normally far too spindly for nests though so I'm surprised to read about pigeons making it their home.

Are the trees at the far end of your garden by any chance?

Pigeons nest high up with very rudimentary nests, they don’t seem to worry about visibility. We’ve had a pigeon’s nest in our neighbour’s birch.

I have always been amazed at people who get upset about the 'mess' that trees give. So what? I'd prefer the shade, wildlife, improvement in the air quality and view than the 'hard work ' of clearing leaves (which is not necessary if they've fallen on grass.) The worms remove them underground. or they make incredible compost.

Humans are arrogant,ignorant and annoying sometimes. (I do include myself but I try to think about the future and I garden with it in mind) it's not surprising that we've got 80 years left.

Birch trees don't just drop leaves though. They drop seeds, catkins, leaves, twigs, branches and sticky sap for at least 6 months of the year. In the spring and autumn I sweep up at least two shovelfuls of the stuff from my patio twice daily.

I find the seeds in my kitchen, all over my car, on my clothes and in my shoes!

If all that was dropping on and blowing about a large garden it wouldn't be noticed but it renders my small patio useless and I can't hang washing out for much of the year. It's a matter of finding trees which suit the location, not just your garden.

So just compost it all , it makes good compost. be thankful for the improved air quality.

Trees can be ‘inconvenient’ and pigeons poop constantly dropping on a car can be hugely irritating. But I agree with ppeatfruit that we’re willing to fell trees, dig up gardens, cut down hedgerows, and plant astroturf fake grass for convenience. Meanwhile little by little we destroy green spaces, air quality and wildlife habitat. Mostly though I feel sorry for our birds. We’ve had blackbirds nest in our garden going on 17 years and love their beautiful song. I’ll feel so sad if the Yew that’s been their nesting place dies.

I agree with ppearfruit. Can't believe people are so against nature.

Majority of roots are in the top 60cm of substrate. 4-6" won't do them any favours but unikely to destabilise them.

I think some people are missing the point here, I'm certainly not 'against nature'. Trees can be lovely in a garden, when appropriate to the surroundings. Although I hate my neighbour's trees, I have planted several of my own but they are smaller and won't cause nuisance to anyone. And I have a large variety of birds visiting my garden. My point is about consideration for others as well as for the planet and wildlife.

I think if the digging out of roots and the subsequent compaction of the soil from having cars driven on the driveway does result in the death of the trees, the positive thing is, that it will probably take a decade or two or more for the trees to die. So could you start planting new trees now as replacements? So sad about the oaks. I can highly recommend the book 'hidden life of trees' if you haven't read it