A second (dead) rat!

[zaffa]

Help! Today, I found a dead (small) is rat in the middle of the lawn. I’m at a loss as we have two cats (not hunters at all but roam the garden endlessly and can’t get out of it) we have successfully cut back all the weeds and the beds are clear. We do have a small patch of overgrowth beneath a couple of trees where the trees are sprouting shoots at the bottom that we are struggling to cut away. I’m fairly certain the rat has been poisoned as I can’t believe my cats killed it - although they spent the whole day staring at the back fence and I fully believe once dead they carried it about for a bit. Neighbours on one side have moved out and the house is empty and very overgrown - they were pretty bad at maintenance and the garden had a lot of stuff piled up in the back corner. However we recently put up some bird feeders and now I’m panicking that we’ve enticed rats from somewhere. Also although the weeds are pretty much gone there is a lot of ivy and bindweed coming over the fences from neighboring properties.
Despite all of this, I’m not keen on poison so I’m at a loss. Can I deter them naturally?

Note - this is the second rat I've seen in our garden - the first was last year and alive and was chased by my cats from one side to the other before disappearing(possibly beneath the shed and possibly to next door). I'm now wondering if we do have a rat problem ....

Shouldn't the rats be deterred by the cats? And us - we are always in the garden! How bad do you think it is? (And please don't pile on accusing me of being hysterical as people did on my last post - I have a new baby at home and the thought of her picking up diseases from any garden rodents is very worrying - maybe I am PFB about it but that's the way of a lot of new mums and I really don't think it's that unusual to not be keen on garden squatters of this kind)

Also - please send me your humane solutions!

Poisoned rats tend to die sick at home, so I’d be surprised if it was (I grew up on a farm, poison used occasionally and never saw a dead rat). More likely a predator.

Make sure your bird feeders don’t spill. Mixed corn is bad for spilling as birds pick out their favourite bits. Remove any cover but I wouldn’t overdo this personally.

You will never get rid of them entirely but food is the main draw, or somewhere warm to nest (do you have a compost bin?). We had an empty property next door but only saw rats once they started renovating.

The bird feeders are ones in tubes that hang - I haven't seen any spillage yet but we haven't had much interest in them. Might take down the one at the back fence which is where I suspect the rat has come from.

No compost bin, we do have a shed though. I suppose the rat could have been passing through our garden to get home - I'm struggling to believe they live in our harden and I've not found their nest in all the clearing out already. Unless it is under the shed - although the cats have no interest in staring under it at all and I would assume if there were rats they would be hovering over them all the time.

Next door was done up in January (they were in our garden a lot getting access to the roof) which is how I know what a mess the place was ( the guys were very forthcoming about the mess the place was left in) and I do wonder if they put down traps before they left or the estate agent had been managing it? Of course it may not be them at all - we may be the people with rats in the neighbour hood but I can't think what they're eating! There are no gnaw marks but the fences do all have the odd gap and knot that we blocked up from cats getting out but have let hedgehogs through in the past.

My husband took a pic of dead rat before disposing of it - can I just get opinions on whether you think this is a sewer rat or a roof rat? Or in fact something else entirely?

That looks like a common rat. Rats can get through incredibly small spaces, so make sure they cannot get into the house, particularly if you have a cellar. They love the spillage from bird feeders. If you have a cellar then put aluminum or steel on the bottom edge of the door, because they will eat their way through wood.
If they have been poisoned, then someone nearby must have an infestation.
Good luck.

When we moved into our house, the vendors had left a bird table with lots of birdseed on it. It attracted rats as well as birds so we got rid of it. I didn't think you needed to feed birds in summer though?

@wowdudge You really need to continue feeding the birds through breeding and fledgling season. The adult birds fly to and from the nest up to 300 times, searching for insects to being back to the baby birds. They can die of exhaustion if they don’t have a secure energy source for themselves. And Water. A bit like us they need some support with newborns 😂

To deter rats and mice, look for any (small) holes (they can squeeze through much smaller gaps than you might think). I use a strong mint spray (they hate strong human sweet smells). I use 20 drops of essential oil of mint mixed with 1\3 alcohol ,for fixing and fill an old spray bottle.

It works for us because we had something in the attic . I spray every 2 weeks or so it keeps it quiet!

I'd bet it was one of your cats though. they love to be out in these warmer nights.!

Sorry ...fill and old spray bottle with water!

About the nesting birds, I’m feeling sorry for them all at the moment. It’s so dry here. DH has started putting the sprinkler on the lawn and every night a blackbird comes to bathe and drink from this one pool that sits there (in a dip), and next morning a pair of blackbirds have come to pick up bits of muddy grass for their nest. I know DH shouldn’t be using the sprinkler really but now I’ve seen the birds getting the benefit as well as the grass I don’t want him to stop really!

Hope you figure out where the rat’s come from, OP. I am not looking forward to picking up the mound of prunings in front of our window in the front garden, it’s been there weeks as we have no compost bin and green waste hasn’t been collected for weeks on end. It’s just re-started so we will slowly get through thr backlog of stuff that’s build up but I wouldn’t be surprised if anything ‘s nesting under everything. 😖

Yes me too Curly We put a large shallow container out for our hedgehog, he paddles in it! Also the birds come down to drink it. You might have a hedgehog under your pile!

Poor rats what a terrible reputation they have . They keep the environment clean, they were here before us and will be here after us . We're the 'dirty, infectious ones .

Thanks for the tips - I had heard about the mint. And interestingly the previous owners have grown a vast amount of mint at the top of the garden near the patio and kitchen doors and now I am a little suspicious (it really is a lot of mint)
I don't want to kill the rats - I don't want to harm them and I don't want to have ended up luring them with bird seed only to then kill them. Really, I want a humane way to ensure they stay out of my garden - as I have seen two rats (one alive and one dead) during the day I think it's reasonable that I am concerned DD and I could be enjoying some garden time and spot a third. I just want them to move else where.

I am as confident as I can be that they are not in the house. No evidence at all (no noises, gnawing, scuff marks or cats acting suspicious). We have scoured the garden and also found no evidence of them so either my cat got lucky and found a weak one in the middle of the day somehow or someone else has a problem and is poisoning them (which I'm a bit against as it's an awful way to die IMO). I'm going to call someone out for advice next week so we can be sure that they don't live somewhere in the garden and they can give me more tips to deter them. I've changed the bird feeders and only kept the ones with a catch tray but someone said to me that rats can climb the fence or tree and get to them (as a squirrel would). Is this true? DH has really gotten into bird feeding and I don't want to take this away from him (but will do so without hesitation if the alternative is Rodent Squatters)

And thank you everyone for not making me feel hysterical - I appreciate that rats are expected in nature I just really don't want them in my garden and don't understand how I've ended up seeing two when I have a relatively tidy garden and two cats who are out there all the time making their presence known with endless toileting (despite a perfectly good litter tray or two
Indoors) and patrolling. I bring them in at night and now I'm giving real thought to getting a cat flap installed and letting them patrol all night too.

@CurlyhairedAssassin I hope you have a Hedgie! Be careful when moving it lest you disturb one. In the last house we had so many of them - I registered them on Hedgehog street and it was so good I did because they send you all this useful info all year round so when we found one late one night in December I knew immediately we needed to weigh it, bring it inside and ring the wildlife rescue as it was too small to survive over the winter.

I also had no rats that I am aware of. I often miss that (much smaller) house

I doubt there's a hedgie under our pile of prunings. Our pile is literally in front of our front bay window on some tarmac. Wouldn't have thought it would be a hedgie environment there.

Sorry, I must have missed it, why are you so sure your cats are responsible for its demise? And you are concerned you are going to be overrun? I am pretty sure we all live nearer to rats than we think. Last year, one of my cats had a run of killing rats and bringing them into the house for me to step on in the morning. He hasn't brought one in so far this year. A rat or two doth not a plague make.

@Guttersnipe my cats were indoor cats for about eight years. They are both 14ish and neither can jump. One of them pretty much sleeps on my bed all day and the other sleeps and patrols the garden. He spends his life staring at the birds on our fence and trying to stalk them when they parade on the lawn but he is slow and has never gotten close to one - and also can't climb so can't ever get to them on the fence or on the trees. He is also very white. So he must have found the rat in our garden (dead or alive) and I suppose I just doubt his ability to catch and kill it. I could be very wrong but he's never brought anything into the house before (although I did find a dead mouse on the lawn last year and he was hopping round it, I assumed it had died of fright rather than his intervention (definitely a mouse). So I suppose I just don't see him as a hunter. I think he'd like to, I just don't think he knows how.

Worried about infestation as it is the second rat in the garden - I've never ever seen rats in any property I've ever lived in before (although appreciate they are nocturnal so may not have cause to see them) but I had heard that if you see them in the day it's a sign of infestation somewhere (pretty convinced no infestation in my house though).

@CurlyhairedAssassin possibly not then - but the last house had them out the front all the time, not nesting but they would come every evening and I'd find them on the doorstep when we got home late at night and then give them food and water.

Two dead rats in a year isn't anything to worry about.

Remember rats will always be trying to expand their territory and access to food supplies, which involves trying a new area, then deciding it's cat-infested and going away again (if they haven't actually met the resident cat).

can I just get opinions on whether you think this is a sewer rat or a roof rat there are two species of rat in the UK, Rattus rattus, the black rat, and Rattus norvegicus, the introduced brown rat.

Black rat is a lot less common in the UK, introduced by Romans, lives in large buildings (eg warehouses), doesn't live outdoors. Yours won't be that.
www.mammal.org.uk/species-hub/full-species-hub/discover-mammals/species-black-rat/

Brown rat, much more common, introduced in 18th century
www.mammal.org.uk/species-hub/full-species-hub/discover-mammals/species-brown-rat/

Worried about infestation as it is the second rat in the garden -... if you see them in the day it's a sign of infestation somewhere (pretty convinced no infestation in my house though).

You've actually only seen 1 during the day - dead doesn't count. So one alive one during the day nearly a year ago, I really wouldn't worry beyond taking normal sensible precautions.

If you are worried about bird feeding, you could always get your DH to bring in the feeder every night, or fill it daily with just enough food to last the day.

Thanks - All of you. Your advice has been great and I am feeling much better about the whole thing. I have also noticed that the cats are once again stationed at the back fence studying and sniffing and staring very hard at it, so I wonder if there is some sort of activity there at night or early morning that they can smell - or if in fact there are rats in the garden behind us roaming in the daytime. Or maybe they just remember the glory days when they (potentially) actually found one and are desperate to relive...

We are going to have another going over of the garden and make sure there are no areas appealing - we do have a dripping tap and someone is coming Tuesday to fix that.

Thanks everyone!

Yes zaffa Poisoning them is not kind to them or the other wildlife (which might eat one) and then get poisoned themselves.

We had them in London (under the floorboards) and I wanted to use humane methods to get rid of them but the person we used was not interested in humane\ecological methods, it was 20 years ago. The mint spray does work , I recommended it to someone else on here and it worked for her.