4th subject at A-levels: Further Maths or Physics

[anoukis]

Hi all,

My DD who just got her GCSE results is considering changing her A-levels 4th subject selection from Further Maths to Physics. For university she is considering either something research related (biochemistry, biotech, biology, biomed, etc.) or medicine.

Her GCSE grades were as follows: 9 Bio, 9 Chem, 9 Physics, 8 Maths, and A in FSMQ Add Maths. She has already enrolled in the following subjects for A-levels:

1. Biology
2. Chemistry
3. Maths - Accelerated route, exam end of year 12 (NB. only those who scored A in Add Maths were allowed this route for Maths as there is a high curriculum overlap between A-level Maths and FSMQ Add Maths)
4. Further Maths

Her school says she can change from Further Maths to Physics before the 6th of September.

Pros and cons please? She does like both Maths and Physics so it's quite hard to decide. Which one would give her more flexibility and an advantage? We did look at the A-level specs for both and she said either is fine, but is undecided.

Thanks.

I mean they're both very impressive A Levels, she can't go too wrong with either if she is able to manage all 4.
I'm a maths teacher - I think further maths has lots of the really interesting stuff and think it can be slightly easier (if you're mathematically minded!) as a 4th A Level because it works closely with the maths A Level. I've not studied Physics myself so can't advise on that I'm afraid.

I would suggest that Physics keeps a wider range of biotech/medical engineering courses open. But it's a close-run thing.

I'm a little alarmed by the "exam at end of Year 12" thing. Many universities say that all results have to be obtained "in one sitting" (i.e. all in summer of the same year). Having an A/A-star on the UCAS form might help get an offer, but it might not then count towards that offer, if that makes sense?

I would look at possible courses and work back. Three sciences and maths will be hard and most don’t do it. Courses don’t require all three so she needs to think about what she really wants. Physics is usually required for engineering. Is that an interest? If so, what should go? Usually medics are not engineers.

I would suggest an 8 in maths isn’t good enough for FM at a high grade. So I would advise 2 sciences plus maths.

Thanks, she was off 2 marks of a 9 in GCSE Maths and got an A in FSMQ Additional Mathematics (which is a level 3 course). Her Maths teacher has no concern over her ability to do FM and get a good grade.

We now have an appointment with the head of the 6th form to discuss workload and timetabling.

The question really is, what direction of travel after A levels? No degree, as far as I know, requires all 3 sciences, so what’s the benefit of this? Most schools do M snd FM in tandem these days. FM dropped after 1 year if it’s looking dodgy. This still leaves 3 Stem A levels (M and 2 sciences) and that gives plenty of options. Not having a 9 might be the ? around FM. There’s a “warning” thread on the HE board about A level maths subjects right now. Take a look and see what you think, @anoukis

It is ridiculous to suggest that someone with an 8, an A*, isn't suitable for FM.

One of DD's friends who has an Oxford offer/admission, did Further Maths as a AS level, and Maths, Physics and Chemistry as A levels.

She felt that this was a good combination.

Theres nothing to be gained by doing a 4th A level. No university asks for 4. If she wants to stretch herself she’d be better off doing an EPQ where they learn research skills that wiill come in useful during university.

Personally, I would say I gained a lot by doing lots of A levels!

A long time ago, I did Bio, Phys, Chem & Maths(and general studies to possibly date things a bit).
I'm not sure how far through the Alevel syllabus the additional maths gets her, but doing the accelerated maths seems a step too far antop of the other. It's basically doing 5 "years" worth of A level courses when most are doing 3.

The bio - direction she seems to be heading towards won't have a preference for FM or phys, I don't think. Might be worth checking

She will need FM for uni if the course requires it. They only make exceptions when the school doesn’t offer FM

I have DC who have achieved high 8 in Maths GCSE and then secured high A at FM (and without the boost of Further Maths GCSE or equivalent). Sounds like OP's DD is starting from a stronger initial position.

My DC took FM in parallel to Maths but lots of schools do M/FM sequentially; there are fairly balanced pros and cons to both routes which is why not all schools approach this in the same way.

If your DC is considering sticking with Maths, Chem, Bio and FM, then perhaps check whether Further Mechanics is one of the options selected by the school to be covered in FM.

If there's a chance that she wants to study maths at university, she should do further maths. It's also less work tham an additional science as there's so much overlap with maths.

@user1494050295 How many actually require it? Not very many. Oxbridge, LSE, Imperial and a few others. The majority don’t but it can be useful. That’s not the same thing.

There are more future options closed off without Physics than there are without Further Maths. That is what my DS found, he took a year off and went back to do Physics.
Physics.

I did further maths and physics at A Level…way way back in the day and I enjoyed further maths much more and it was much easier and quicker to revise for the exams. Which would free her revision time up for chemistry and biology - which covers a large amount of material. But I think either will help her get into Uni to study the courses she wants to. And well done on her GSCE results.

I would worry about the 'at one sitting' thing. I think uni offers are likely to be based on the grades of the three she takes in Year 13.

I’m not saying FM isn’t possible with an 8 at GCSE. Of course it is. However more students get a B and C at A level with an 8 then get Astar and A. Of course if it all clicks, great.