What are your all-rounders doing at A-Level

[Emalex]

DD has just finished her A-Levels, she is a true all rounder type of kid and loves everything. Her GCSES were English, Maths, Triple Science, German, Geography, History, Classics, Latin (done as an elective in lunch and after school) and French (DH is French, both our kids do French Saturday School, speak French at home etc. so this didn't take much in the way of studying, just soe time familiarising wit question style etc.)
She is predicted 7-9 across the board, sciences were all 7, German, Geography and History 8, 9 for Maths, English lit and lang, Classics, Latin and French. She also plays competitive tennis to high level and just did Grade 7 Piano. (This makes us sound very pushy but it all comes from DD, she us a twin and DS Did 11 GCSES, predicted 6/7/8, quit music at 13 and doesn't love sports so will just about play football with friends once a week - we are proud of them bot and don't force DD into being busy)

Now DD has no idea what she wants to do, she likes the idea of working in Law or Finance, but also loves classics and thinks maybe researcher or museum work, also has an interest in politics so thinks maybe politics and economics might be for her then thinktank/policy advisor role. We aren't putting pressure on picking anything but she does need to finalise her A-Levels.

Her original choice was English Lang+Lit, Maths, Classics, Economics, but since then shes wanted to swap in Politics, Latin, History and Further maths. English and Maths are set in stone, she really wants to do them

So what are your all-rounder kids studying at A-Level as DD is finding it very hard to pick!! Any advice on what she should pick??

My daughter is also predicted 7-9 across the board. She’s not sure what she wants to do but probably something in film or TV. However, she didn’t enjoy media studies in Y9 so didn’t take it GCSE. She’s chosen to do English Lit, Music and Psychology. She was considering politics too but 4 A levels were discouraged at her school and she wasn’t interested in the IB options (as she doesn’t want to have to do maths again!).

My DD is doing History, Geography and Chemistry. And because she is only doing one science she also has to do an AS Core maths to go along the science.

She will already have an English Literacy A Level which she has done along side her GCSE's.

She may add an EPQ along side her A Levels.

She's not sure what she would like to do, but thinks it may be something along the archelogy / historian lines.

At my DCs' comp those students with the interest and aptitude in taking Maths A level with other options that are exclusively arts and humanities are encouraged to do so. It makes for a powerful and flexible combination for the right student. Your DD's GCSE Maths prediction puts her in that potential category.

My DCs' school also encourages those selecting exclusively arts and humanities A levels to take Core Maths alongside (in Y12); take up is good and means students keep quantitative skills refreshed throughout Y12 & Y13. So that is an option to consider also.

@PerpetualOptimist A 7/8 doesn’t really if other subjects are a 9.

Unless I am misreading, OP's DC is predicted 9 in Maths (as opposed to 7 in the physical sciences) and it is that aspect that underpins my observation.

Nevertheless, I agree with your general sentiment, @TizerorFizz, that Maths A level is not to be embarked on lightly.

Ah yes @PerpetualOptimist I was looking at sciences. However DD doesn’t need it and she doesn’t want to do it. I had a similar DD. A stars at most back in the day but liked what she liked. This DD is looking at 2 new subjects for A level though and that’s not always easy either.

There are 16 years between my dd1 and dd3 and gcses and A levels were stressful then but there seems a whole new level of stress nowadays. Obviously dd1 had As but now both 8 and 9 are considered As - and dd3's school require 9s in subjects she wants to do for higher level IB.
I did O and A levels over 40 years ago and certainly at O level a pass was considered pretty impressive. I actually only got a C in Chemistry O level and there was no problem with me taking Chemistry at A level. Universities interviewed all candidates and a lot of Russell group universities gave CCC offers. Most people didn't go to university so there was no pressure there either.

I did O levels too but seriously under achieved. These days for maths, they like a 8/9. So many get A and above at maths a level it’s difficult to know if it’s more difficult or not. Just different probably. DH did engineering degree with a C in it.

I think it’s time to go down the old “arts” route. The difference between 15 years ago and now is grade inflation, You really under achieve if you don’t get an A. When few got an A you didn’t expect one and frequently didn’t need it either. Schools pile on stress too and it’s just ludicrous. No one seems to be brighter. You cannot make someone brighter by testing all the time. A levels only test certain elements of a dc. Other things such a personality, work ethic, how quick you are to grasp things, problem solving and team playing are ignored. So a string of A stars at A level says something about a person but not everything.

Sadly you need to choose between Art and Science for A-level. There is so much overlap. It's hell doing maths without the sciences for example.

Nonsense. You don't need to choose. If you are good at maths and enjoy it then it is an excellent choice alongside arts A-levels and I would highly recommend it.

I did Maths, FM, English, Economics
My son did Maths, Economics, Geography
My daughter did Maths, English, German, Art (actually she just took AS Maths in the end, getting an A comfortably. She was finding 4 A-levels a lot and Maths was the only subject she could take AS in, but the overload was much more the fault of Art than the other three subjects).

None of us found doing maths without sciences to be "hell". I'd be more likely to question whether it was wise to continue sciences without Maths, certainly if there is any prospect of continuing sciences to degree level.

Maths is fine to add to arts subjects but dc needs to really like it. It’s not necessary for many degrees but Cambridge like it for law.

I am struck by the similarities between our DCs. Mine is also predicted 7-9 for everything, he is also grade 7 in an instrument, and also doesn't know what he wants to do but the areas you mention for your DD are exactly the areas he is thinking about. He likes sciences, maths and history/classics/music but hates English literature and isn't keen on French even though he is very good at it.

He is going to do music, history, maths and physics. He isn't completely sure about physics and may replace it with classics or economics if it isn't going great.

Grade inflation is ridiculous. Ds has just finished his 3rd year of his MEng at a Russell group university and he received his BEng results a few days ago. He is brilliant and got a first but nowadays it seems a first is pretty much what a 2:1 was when I was at university! In his first year he got a monetary prize for coming top in his course so he is very good but anyone getting a first 40 years ago when I did my degree would have been the bees knees!

On the sciences without Maths DD has done Physics and Chemistry without Maths (only one in the year with that combo) and hasn't struggled compared to the rest of the classses so it's not given that it makes things easier - however stressing again that OP's DD needs to look at potential degree choices before making a firm choice. If it's any version of a Physics degree then Maths is required alongside but for Chemistry it's not...........it would be a shame to do well in GCSE's and A levels only to find that your degree of choice isn't available.

DS all rounder predicted 8-9’s. He wants to do maths, further maths, physics and computer science. Honestly? I’m trying to help him keep his options more open and not have maths in every single subject and do the EPQ instead of further maths but it’s his life 🤷🏻‍♀️ he has also said he misses doing any art and doesn’t really understand how to draw so I’m signing him up for a couple of one day courses, and he also plays instruments and writes a lot so at least he’s keeping up his creative side

for your DD if she’s set on English and maths and is considering either classics or finance I’d be tempted to do classics/latin as the 3rd to keep that degree choice open then whatever she truly loved as the 4th is that’s possible (where we are all the 6th form colleges only allow further maths as a 4th - dunno if you’re private or state though so maybe that’s the difference)

History keeps more doors open. Classics not so much. Latin or MFL? MFL is favoured by Cambridge and Oxford for many courses. If you need classics or Latin, fair enough. History is the better door opener though!

He wants to do maths, further maths, physics and computer science. Honestly? I’m trying to help him keep his options more open

That's what my dd did. She did an EPQ - robotics, an artefact one so no maths to speak of and did involve design, maybe something like that might appeal to your DS, and his creative side (stem folk are creative btw, just have to do it within the constraints of reality, but for some it's more satisfying)

That set keeps lots of options at great unis open. Honesty, it's a great set if that's his preferred direction. If his aim is some of the stem courses at top unis then you will hinder, not help, if you talk him out of FM!

The A level system doesn't allow all doors to remain open, unfortunately.

I think the key is, what’s best for the greatest number of courses at uni. That’s why the old description of facilitating was used. It’s been railed against so much, but Cambridge still, in effect, use it in their advice on choosing A levels for their courses. For selective courses, they want to see two of the A levels they consider best prep. It’s best advice for elsewhere too. The other one or two A levels allow flexibility but Cambridge splits advice into two distinct types of courses. Makes decision making easier I think.

But the other still-valid meaning of 'facilitating subject' is those which are likely to be required (or 'strongly recommended') etc for specific degrees. If a student is at all likely to want to do history, then they should do the A level. If they're seriously considering medicine then likely wise to do chemistry. For a whole slew of stem subjects it's physics and maths ...and for the 'top' courses FM too.

A diverse selection of a levels can be appropriate for some students, particularly if they haven't figured out what they want to do afterwards like the OPs DD, but for others this approach would slam shut the door that they've already got their sights on - or make it harder than it needs to be.

If your daughter is interested in a legal career, a law degree is not a prerequisite. That might open up her options a bit. Perhaps a combined degree? Maths and French? Law and French law? PPE? History and French?

@ErrolTheDragon Absolutely. That’s why course info should be read too. Eg Engineers really need maths and physics. Not just physics to tick a science box. Earlier I was looking at Law at Oxford. No required subject but they say many successful candidates offer English History and MFLs. Clearly other subjects are not off the menu but it’s a good guide so why not do two of those? Then add a suitable third subject from their secondary list.? Cambridge more or less says the same. If you are competitive at these, you would be elsewhere.

It’s also been an issue that dc with less good A level guidance are told “do what you like”. No reference to what a uni course might like. It matters if the course needed chemistry and you don’t have it! This happened to a DD I knew. Dad insisted she didn’t need that subject - she did. It’s definitely better to choose wisely and look at sensible combinations.

Our local state school allows their students to do the most random selections and doesn't seem to advise them regarding what universities actually want. Dd3 is waiting for her gcse results and went out with friends who go there - she goes to a private school - I can't believe the combinations allowed.
Dd3 is doing IB in sixth form as she doesn't really have any career in mind. She is choosing maths, physics and chemistry as her highers with English, Spanish and philosophy lowers.

I'd have a look at the individual subject content of the A levels she's thinking of choosing. My DD couldn't decide between English Lit and English Language but reading the course content she realised that the Language content was far more interesting to her. I would also say the most important thing is to choose subjects she really enjoys. She might be a good allrounder but she'll know which subjects excited her the most and the lessons she looked forward to every week.

@Manthide It’s the oft repeated mantra of “do what you are good at”. This can be great if the choice is sensible but if it’s a random selection, dc need guidance. It’s fairly well documented that dc in poor schools get little advice and are more likely to do A levels that don’t give the best spread of courses.

How long ago did you sit A levels?

Most schools can't fit 5 A level subjects into the curriculum.
Also, they are linear in England now (AS levels have been decoupled from them), so instead of sitting 5 half A levels in year 12 and the other half in year 13 students sit full A levels at the end of year 13. Nearly all schools and 6th form colleges have dropped AS levels in England, but they still do them in Wales.

Re the point about 4 subjects. Very able students can and do sit 4 subjects - usually the fourth one being further maths. However, less able students are far better taking three subjects and achieving AAA or higher than 4 subjects and achieveing AABB because that is what universities want to see - even for medicine and vetmed.

@whatdidyousaaay DD1 took 5 AS levels back in 2009 and dropped one subject at the beginning of year 13.
She then decided to apply to Cambridge for medicine- she hadn't even settled on medicine until she got her AS results - all As over 90%. She was worried that Cambridge would include her further maths in their offer, it was the first year with A*s so she then dropped further maths. She did go to Cambridge.