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Further education

You'll find discussions about A Levels and universities on our Further Education forum.

6th Form or college and why did you choose one over the other ?

82 replies

Hollywilloughbyfan1 · 13/05/2022 22:14

Evening all.

Did you choose 6th form or college and why did you choose one option over the other ?

OP posts:
thistimeiknowitsforreal · 19/08/2022 23:16

6th form should be scrapped everyone should go to college

jamimmi · 19/08/2022 23:37

No choice were we live nonschools have 6th forms only sixth form.colleges or colleges that are more vocational..inhave to say as a stepping stone to uni it works better and allows an amazing choice of subjects . No uniform and we need to pay for the bus though

TeenDivided · 20/08/2022 07:47

thistimeiknowitsforreal · 19/08/2022 23:16

6th form should be scrapped everyone should go to college

Oh don't be ridiculous. On this thread and your other thread there have been plenty of reasons given why a school 6th form might better suit some kids.

RampantIvy · 20/08/2022 10:21

I agree @TeenDivided. In our case the logistics of DD going to school on a 15 minute bus journey vs a 40 minute train journey on an hourly and unreliable train service, plus a half hour walk made it a no brainer.

Plus the viciously nasty bully who made DD's life an abject misery would have been on the same train (only 2 coaches, so difficult to avoid her).

thistimeiknowitsforreal · 20/08/2022 20:18

RampantIvy · 20/08/2022 10:21

I agree @TeenDivided. In our case the logistics of DD going to school on a 15 minute bus journey vs a 40 minute train journey on an hourly and unreliable train service, plus a half hour walk made it a no brainer.

Plus the viciously nasty bully who made DD's life an abject misery would have been on the same train (only 2 coaches, so difficult to avoid her).

That is sad to hear but both are on their way to becoming adults

RampantIvy · 20/08/2022 21:47

but both are on their way to becoming adults

Not sure what you mean by this. DD is 22 now and the long term effects of the horrible bullying she endured are still with her. And by all accounts, the nasty bully is still up to her old tricks.

thistimeiknowitsforreal · 21/08/2022 01:30

RampantIvy · 20/08/2022 21:47

but both are on their way to becoming adults

Not sure what you mean by this. DD is 22 now and the long term effects of the horrible bullying she endured are still with her. And by all accounts, the nasty bully is still up to her old tricks.

I don`t doubt the effects of bullying can stay with you for a long time.

Also if they are still up to their old tricks at that age that is very sad.

thistimeiknowitsforreal · 25/09/2022 23:46

RampantIvy · 20/08/2022 21:47

but both are on their way to becoming adults

Not sure what you mean by this. DD is 22 now and the long term effects of the horrible bullying she endured are still with her. And by all accounts, the nasty bully is still up to her old tricks.

Why didn't DD just stand up to the bully and tell her to grow up.

gohoggie · 26/09/2022 02:47

I went to college because school ended at 16. There was no sixth form. If you were academic, you went to one college to do your A levels, and if you weren't, you went to the other college to do a vocational course.

My eldest DC chose to go to a sixth form college. Around here, about half of schools have a sixth form, the others do not. She chose a college because she didn't want to be babied any more (supervised study, not allowed off site during the day, strict uniform policy etc etc). She also had friends who went to the college. She found she was able to do more courses at the college (3 A levels + 1 extra course per year) and is now at a RG uni, her first choice uni for her degree.

DC 2 will go there too. Reasons: wider range of courses, students are expected to be more mature / grow up and become more independent and I think mine will rise to that challenge.

I'm a teacher, and have taught in both settings (3 schools with sixth forms, 2 colleges) and have held leadership roles in sixth form. Personally, I prefer the college system because my experience has shown me...

  • Lecturers at colleges tend to be more academic. In my experience, it's rare to see a college lecturer with just a BA in their subject. Most I know tend to have MAs or doctorates, way more than many schools.
  • Lecturers can often be more specialist. Because they only teach A level, they can invest much more time into their subject and some will only teach part of an A level, specialising even further. All too often in schools, GCSE is the main focus of management and targets etc. A level teaching can be something that is bolted on for a few hours a week, rather than the teacher's primary focus. I've also found lecturers in colleges are much more likely to be examiners too, as when they start examining, most lecturers are on very limited teaching timetables. Whereas, in schools examining is done but is not the norm, as most teachers are still teaching. So it's usually a few who mark, rather than the majority. Expertise is also relevant for UCAS advice. Again this is bread and butter for most college lecturers, but I have seen some terrible advice and references written by school Teachers who just don't have the time to attend the teacher conferences or to focus on the latest UCAS developments in the same way.
  • Colleges have greater resources for students etc, subscriptions to academic journals, or click view, massolit etc, it won't be one of these but often several.
  • much wider range of subjects to choose from, including some of the less popular A levels like Art History or Classics. With the more popular A levels, students can not just select which course they want to study. Eg not just history or ancient history, but there might be diffferent eras or themes they could select, depending on their interest.
  • Colleges are often run as mini universities. Lecturers on first name terms, Freedom to just come in for lessons and to manage own study time, greater use of VLEs, a professional pastoral team that is separated from the teacher's role and so on. It's a good first step to uni.

Of course. I am comparing sixth forms in schools, to sixth form colleges here, not more general FE colleges, which can be quite different,

Because students come from such wide catchments, I think colleges can really help to raise aspirations. In schools, particularly smaller sixth forms, there can develop a culture to the sixth form... sometimes this is hardworking, sometimes not. But where expectations are low, it can become unusual to aspire for certain things. Whereas, the wide catchments of colleges can really raise aspirations - there will be some hard working / high achieving students in many classes, so students can't think that dossing in the sixth form common room fore what all students do on their frees. They can see this is not the norm for all. It can help raise aspirations.

Finally, I believe there is some research which suggests that students from colleges tend to do better in their degrees compared to sixth form students. I can't verify that now but management at both colleges I have worked in have referenced it.

There are negatives. I think the main ones being that some students are not ready yet for the greater independence college brings. And some can get lost in the system. Teachers don't know the students (this can be both good or bad) but that can make support harder to get initially. The large size and catchment can also make it difficult for some students to make friends, or to see each other outside of college. But overall, having taught in both, I think the sixth form college outweighs the school sixth form system.

gohoggie · 26/09/2022 02:55

Forgot to add that if can give students a fresh Starr too. Over the 15 years I've worked in colleges, I E taught several students who have shocked me by revealing that they were trouble makers at school. For whatever reason, they didn't like the rules, rebelled against teachers and so on ... but take away those rules and they've thrived. I can think of several A grade students here, and even a couple who have gone on to PhDs and academia...,

Moris2444 · 25/10/2023 12:18

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

SusieSussex · 25/10/2023 12:25

Mine stayed at school sixth form. The college is an hour away on the train and the trains are constantly striking or understaffed, plus expensive. The college isn't particularly better either. The eldest hasn't struggled in anyway at university as a result of staying at the school sixth form. I didn't either.

steppemum · 25/10/2023 13:18

we deliberately chose school sixth sixth forms when we chose secondary.

Lots of reasons but 2 stand out.

  1. many kids are not wanting to do a massive change at age 16. School sixth forms usually are slightly separate from the school, so you get some change but not too much.
  2. timings. At our local sixth form college you only have to be there for your lessons, so they could roll out of bed at 11 for a 12 am lesson. At a school based sixth form they need to be there during the day, so they continue that routine and also then work in free periods in the morning. The local college also doesn't have good on site work facilities for all the kids as they assume most work at home.

We have 3 kids, 2 now at uni. This worked well for both of them (2 different schools) Sixth form was very different, but they had lots of opportunities within the school (mentoring and tutoring and leadership) They knew the teachers, and in dds case they were nationally recognised in their subject, and it was absoilutely the right thing. No silly uniform either (can't bear business clothes in sixth form)

But dd2 is in year 11. She doesn't want to stay on at school, and we can't get her out fast enough. She has had a horrendous time with friendships. We alos think she is ND. We have been round 2 school sixth forms and 2 sixth form colleges.
Generally I would stand by the 2 points above, but would also now add:

  1. T levels, colleges seem to offer more for less academic kids and so more options. In some cases more subjects too
  2. entrance requirements, knowing that she doesn't have to get her schools very high sixth form entry equirements has massively taken the pressure off (she will get 7/8 in sciences and maths, but likely fail, english, esp lit, french and drama) She can start with no english and resit
  3. dd has changed a lot in the last year and a fresh start, opportunity to re invent herself is very welcome.
  4. Support for ND kids at both colleges is amazing, and she can access it even without a diagnosis. Less so in the schools.
  5. The school sixth forms were smaller, smaller classes and less chance of getting lost in the crowd. The colleges are both huge.

I was still concerned about the timings issue, but the one she has chosen is in the next town over, and because of buses, she will be in college all day, but there is a lunchtime bus if she wants to come home early, or is having a bad day and needs a lie in. For her that little bit of flexibility is very helpful.

So having sworn by school sixth forms, we have now chosen a college.

steppemum · 25/10/2023 13:23

Just to say that for my older 2 especially my ds, the openness of the college would have massively backfired. He needed the structure of the school, needed the discipline of having to get out of bed in the morning. In the second year, he drove himself, rather than take the train.

But for both of the older 2 sixth form was a wonderful time where they made a new group of friends who they have stayed close to. There were enough new people and enough of a change to change the dynamic.

Their school was a train ride away, and so they were used to being very independent etc, some of the things the first pp said, (which I agree are importnat) they had been doing since year 7.

steppemum · 25/10/2023 13:50

It is interesting reading the replies on here.
What stands out to me is that some of the school sixth forms and colleges being described are VERY different to the ones we have. for example:

someone said that the academic level was higher in college. Not here. In fact the reverse.
teaching and behaviour being better at one or the other, that is very dependant on the particular school/college and cannot be generalised.

But also, generally not all colleges are equal, some cater to highly academic A levels and others are mostly vocational.
It is so dependant on your area that you need to do your own research really.

Our school sixth forms are very different to the lower school, slightly separate site, big invlux/mix of kids, different atmosphere. They are not that different to a college!

TeenPlusCat · 25/10/2023 13:55

Here in Hants you don't get a choice as schools almost universally don't have 6th forms. Everyone goes to college whether it is to do 4 A levels and progress to Cambridge, or a Level 1 course.

The 'freedom' in the A level colleges can be a great stepping stone to uni for those that are ready for the responsibility, but also a massive distraction for those that aren't.

I do like that everyone has to make a positive choice about where to go and what to do next. No staying on by default.

Temporaryanonymity · 25/10/2023 14:01

My son stayed at 6th form because it’s around the corner and he didn’t fancy the long bus ride to college. He’s in really small classes which is a huge, unexpected benefit of staying in school. There’s only 7 in his politics class and around the same number in sociology. He’s been given a leadership role and is thriving. The 6th form operates as a school within a school, so very different from years 7-11.

I chose not to stay in school because I wanted to study the IB so obviously that meant a college (early 90s) otherwise I’d have stayed in school.

I’m not worried about my son needing a “stepping stone” to university as he’s already very independent and self-motivated.

MrsAvocet · 25/10/2023 14:05

A mixture of logistics, the DC's preference and results for us.
We live in a rural area with very poor public transport. The school bus literally stops at the end of our drive whereas the journey to either of the "local" colleges would be significantly longer, much more expensive and logistically extremely difficult.
The school has excellent teachers and facilities and achieves very good results in the subjects which my DC wished to study whereas neither of the colleges gets good results in my DCs chosen subjects. They do do well at some of their other courses and are, I'm sure, very good options for some young people. Had any of my DCs wanted to take courses that weren't offered at school or which were better taught at college we would have found a way round the logistics. Or if they had been unhappy with school and wanted to change we would have facilitated it somehow. But they didn't.
I would have to be deranged to spend a fortune and make the whole family's life far more difficult in order for my DCs to attend somewhere where they'd probably achieve less well, especially when they were perfectly happy with what was on offer at school. We didn't see any need to fix something that wasn't broken.

ErrolTheDragon · 25/10/2023 14:27

DD stayed at the 6th form of her GS - she liked it and it's an excellent school which served her well. But if she'd had a particular reason to prefer college that would have been fine - one of ours locally has a very good reputation and has subsequently opened a special maths/stem section in conjunction with a uni that she might have been interested in.

It really does depend on each student and the particular schools and colleges accessible to them, no one size fits all.

steppemum · 27/10/2023 20:48

Interestingly, in the past (10 years ago?) Alsmost all the schools in our area finished at 16. Everyone then went to FE college or sixth form college in the town.
Some went by bus to much better sixth from college in neighbouring town.

There have been 3 new schools opened in the last 10 years and all have opened with their own sixth form, and many kids transfer to one fo those schools rather than the (lacklustre) sixth form college. The trend seems to be for school sixth forms around here.

reluctantbrit · 29/10/2023 17:14

DD is at a 6th form. Our college is only for vocational courses so her academical A-Level choices aren't taught there.

She moved schools though and I think it was a good choice. She had a fresh start away from the same old and tried and tested of the last 5 years.

Her 6th form is huge, 300 per year and they are left a lot on their own, we don't really see a lot of teacher assistance and hand holding. That also means good choice for socialising, she already made new friends.

CissOff · 29/10/2023 17:20

Thanks for this thread - it’s been so useful.

I want DD to go to the local 6th form (which is where she went for secondary until yr9 but moved to a different school). It’s about 10 mins walk away and gets great results but she’s nervous about rejoining her old school and continuing wearing a uniform 😂

I am nervous about college because I never know went and I’m not convinced it will have the structure/pastoral care she needs. I am perhaps being snobby as in my day, the people who went to college from school did solely vocational courses and were generally consisted less able 😳 appreciate times may have changed!

ElleCapitaine · 29/10/2023 17:32

Better range of subjects, greater independence, school rated good but college rated excellent - and it is. The range of enrichment activities are way in excess of anything her school did. She’s now a qualified first aider, participates in activities like Model UN, has guest talks from top authors and civil servants, ‘top’ universities, etc. Schools just don’t have the critical mass to be able to offer opportunities like that.

shamoola · 03/11/2023 17:06

Interesting - where I am (a London borough) virtually every school has a sixth form and I would say 90% stay on at the same school.
College is only really for vocational courses and are looked upon as less academic. They definitely have much lower GCSE grade requirements to get in.

TeenPlusCat · 03/11/2023 17:29

shamoola · 03/11/2023 17:06

Interesting - where I am (a London borough) virtually every school has a sixth form and I would say 90% stay on at the same school.
College is only really for vocational courses and are looked upon as less academic. They definitely have much lower GCSE grade requirements to get in.

90% staying on - presumably to do A levels, sounds high to me.
(Or is the school selective?)