BTECs Your views

[Blessthekids]

My dd1 has more or less decided she wants to take a BTEC extended diploma in music rather than do 3 A-levels. This will mean leaving her school, a very good one and going to a college. I support her decision but am still nervous so I would like to hear from those who have kids doing or completed BTECs. Did your children find them enjoyable and challenging, did it get them onto a good University course or into a their chosen career? What are your honest views positive or negative? Thanks

DD is in her second year of a BTEC in performing arts. She is absolutely loving it and has done so many things including making films ,producing recording a song, played two major roles in a Shakespeare festival (she'd never shown any interest in Shakespeare before) she is planning on applying to Thomas cook next year to be an entertainer in their resorts.
She might do some further education in a few years but for now she wants the experiences.

You won’t get into a Russell group uni, but if that’s not your ambition the BTECs at a good college are a fine alternative to A levels.

Is that a specific issue with the Music one? I got bored after googling 'university of btec' four times, but Birmingham, Leeds, Bristol and Manchester all say BTEC usually acceptable for a related degree subject.

A full BTEC national diploma, often counts as a single A level at universities with a more competitive entry. I’m afraid.

Hi, in answer to the comment regarding university entry requirements, a DDD in the BTEC Extended National Diploma is equivalent to 3 A levels at AAA. My DD was in the exact same position last year as your DC @Blessthekids and I checked with some universities that her choices wouldn’t be limited. Both Uni of Birmingham and Oxford confirmed the BTEC was accepted without the requirement for any additional A levels to study Music as long as she had ABRSM Grade 8 theory. A review of uni websites will confirm this as MarchingFrogs has found out.
Yes other BTECS, depending on the level or maybe even the subject studied, may need other qualifications but not the Extended National Diploma to study Music.

You won’t get into a Russell group uni, but if that’s not your ambition the BTECs at a good college are a fine alternative to A levels.
My dd is at Cardiff with a btec, her friend has got an interview at Kings College with the same btec.

And Dds btec is worth 168 ucas points, the same as 3 A* at Alevel.

Tbf, looking at the 'alternative' section on Durham's website (isn't it lovely how one of the newest members of the club has become the jewel in its crown, btw?), they do ask for an A level alongside the full extended BTEC where the requirements for the particular course are up at the A*+ end. But even at Durham there are courses which only ask for AAB (e.g. BA Music) at which level, there is no automatic requirement for an accompanying A level. So even there, some students may find themselves having to slum it with those 'with not very good GCSEs'. But perhaps they would be confined to a separate section of the dining hall, or something, or be made to wear a badge saying, 'BTEC entrant. Feel free not to sit next to me'?

(I've nothing against Durham, was just prompted to look at it after the suggestion that even though the universities I'd quoted were RG, they weren't the right sort of RG).

Agree with @marchingfrogs, it will be very much down to subject choice and chosen degree/uni. In some more “practical” degrees the opposite is true re entry requirements, in that the BTEC allows you to skip the foundation year whereas A level entrants can’t (Fine Art degree is one example of this at one uni I know). Every course/uni/degree is different and assumptions can’t be applied across the board that the BTEC on its own is not good enough.
@blessthekids my DD is doing an A level alongside and finds it perfectly manageable if that helps (and before anyone then thinks that this proves they aren’t hard work, plenty of A level students do 4 A levels).

That would depend on which Btec. if its the Btec Extended Diploma then that is the equivalent in size to doing 3 A levels and to do another A level alongside that would be too much.

However some colleges offer the smaller Btec Foundation Diploma which is the equivalent in size to doing 2 A levels and in that case it is usual to do either a 2nd Btec or an A level alongside.

My daughter's school also offers the smaller Btec certificate as an alternative to A level music and that takes up 1 option block.

The OP did say that it would be the BTEC extended diploma, i.e. the 3 A level equivalent.

Btw, avvording to posts on TSR, Durham is now making offers of BBB to get some candidates to firm for Geography and Psychology. The average BTEC entrant might not seem quite so underqualified, after all. Perhsps they'll actually demand their own table in the dining room.

As my DC is studying the same as the OP enquired about, yes you can do an A level alongside the Extended National Diploma. My DC is and finds it perfectly manageable and many students at her college are. I don't think any one of us is in a position to advise OP as to whether her DC should study an A level, we can only comment on how our own students have found the workload as it will all be dependent on the subject being studied and the individual student. I know of students at sixth form doing 4 A levels as the college think they are capable so this scenario is no different.

Thanks for all your opinions. The final decision is hers and I think she had decided this is what she wants. We have looked at University courses and all of the ones she is considering are happy to accept BTECs. I think on balance this is the right choice as she would be hard pressed to pick 3 subjects she would want to do at A-levels.

It sounds like you’ve done plenty of research and she is happy with her decision which is the most important thing. She will then enjoy the course and get the most out of her study. My DD has never once regretted her decision. Good luck to her

I’ve been looking at Bristol and they accept Btec for their music degree (it’s composition heavy which might suit ds as an alternative to music tech). They just ask you have either A Level music or Grade 8 theory alongside so I’m going to put him in for Grade 5 in the summer and then get him up to Grade 8 standard by year 13.

DD did 3 BTECs instead of A levels - got Distinction * in all 3. Got into her chosen career (not interested in university). There is no way she would have got high grades in A levels - she just couldn't cope with exams due to multiple mental health problems.

I teach BTEC Performing Arts. My Year 13 students have all had offers for university and/or drama school. Those going for the "big" drama schools have had more success than any of the A Level students I have taught in the past. One boy has had 6 offers including one from Oxford School of Drama. Even those not wanting to go on and do drama have had success - one girl has an unconditional offer to study law.

For certain subjects I strongly believe that BTEC is more appropriate than A Levels. Since starting the course with me, my students have performed in public, commercial theatres and have had to meet exacting standards. The assessment is pretty much continuous, which is much more like "real life" than A Levels.

The newer BTEC specs (updated in 2016) include external assessments. The one my Year 13s have just done includes tasks more suited to university. Absolutely not the easy option.

I believe bruffin’s DD is doing nursing at Cardiff. This isn’t the same as doing Civil Engineering at Sheffield. Therefore check what each university wants for the course you want. For example Sheffield want A level maths AND the BTech at DDD. Nursing doesn’t ask for AAA at A level and a BTech is obviously ok. After training, I really don’t care what pre degree qualifications they have! I just want competent nurses!

You could also check whether Oxford actually take music students with just a BTech and grade 8 etc. What is the real profile of successful candidates. One of DDs friends is a music grad from Oxford and he’s now a barrister. Definitely not a BTech entry student. However the stats would be very interesting!

The information you have from Oxford re music isn’t really supported by the music dept web site regarding applicants and entry qualifications. There is a difference between applying and successfully applying.

I agree with EvilTwins, the level 3 BTEC extended diploma ( 3 A level equivalent) is by far the best preparation for those wanting to go on to vocational drama school type training and performance careers. A levels are fine for university drama degrees which are more academic study than performance. However, there is great variation in the quality of courses offered at different colleges as they are internally marked. Check carefully what ex students go on to.

Also possible to do an A level alongside but very high workload and should only be done by a highly academic student. DD did A level Eng Lit alongside her BTEC and A at GCSE language and literature was required to be allowed to do this. Even so it was hard work and only recommended for real grafters!

OnGoldenPond: Prospective students have to do an A level as well it if they want MEng at Sheffield and for quite a few other high level vocational courses. Sheffield clearly do not see Engineering BTec as A* x 3. This is why everyone must check on the university pages. I also know lots of girls from my DDs schools who have gone to RADA, Guildhall and other prestigious acting schools - all with A levels. Again, do we know the stats regarding admissions? Plenty of A level students have done loads of acting via other clubs and schemes and have had drama teachers coach them. They must all prepare for an audition.

Bubbles, I have no knowledge of engineering course requirements and wouldn't pretend to. I know it is an academic discipline and it would likely be difficult to get into the better universities without top grade A levels.

When I say vocational training I am referring to specialist performance arts training. Entry to these courses is purely on audition so you want to do the sixth form course that gives the best preparation for this process. The BTEC with its emphasis on practical performance training gives better preparation than A level courses. Not impossible to get in if you are studying A levels but makes it harder as you have to fit in the practical training another way. That's why the top state performing arts school in the country offers BTEC Level 3 plus optional extra A levels in their sixth form. And they get the results.

Unfortunately for us none if our local schools or colleges allow the extended diploma plus an A Level, I’m guessing due to timetabling.

My dh teaches at a leading vocational performing arts college. They don’t care about A levels or brews, it’s 100% audition.

And many of our top actors come from top private schools who wouldn’t know what a BTec was! It is all about the audition and some schools prep their candidates extremely well - A level students or not. It all depends what talented teachers you have and it’s not all about the course. Great schools offer great performing opportunities with theatres and high quality productions for pupils so the course they follow really doesn’t matter.

My son is doing an Engineering BTEC with Geography A level alongside. It's not an easy option, it's proper tough! Get a bit fed up with the media suggesting BTECs are for people who couldn't cope with A levels - it's just not the case. I feel that each student needs to choose their own path and work out what is best for them. All I know is that my son is spending two years doing courses that he enjoys - life for many of us is not about the final destination but the journey. Going to Uni is not what it once was (I've been there, done that), so many young people do this now that a degree does not have the same impact with employers as it once did and many feel experience is far more important these days.

Bubbles - sadly a lot what you said in your last post isn't true.

The old stereotype of performers all coming from public schools and Cambridge Footlights etc is becoming a thing of the past as the new generation come through. It's all about proper professional training now and the graduating classes of the top performance arts training colleges ( Mountview, Central, Arts Ed, RADA et al) are snapped up by the top agents. A good agent is the key to getting professional work.

From DD's sixth form group who studied the extended BTEC level 3 diploma in performing arts, about 75% got places straight away in the colleges in that group, most of the rest reapplied this year and many have places starting this September.

To contrast, her old top private school got one pupil into RADA about 5 years ago despite their brand new purpose built state of the art theatre and reputation for drama.

There is no substitute for full time rigorous professional training delivered by respected industry professionals. It really does make all the difference. In such a fiercely competitive area you need more than talent and some extra curricular activities.