Why is nobody talking about how LITTLE kids go to college now

[Dadism]

I feel rather angry about our further education system. I have kids attending Oaklands College in St Albans, Herts. So far they go into college a total of 2 days a week. The rest is 'self-guided'. In other words, show us the money and get online and do it yourself.

Now I feel old as.. in my day... and at school, you go in EVERY day and get taught EVERY day. How is this good enough now?

Nevermind that Oaklands College doesn't even have up-to-date software to teach (it's only 5 years out of date but when you are a designer, why does that matter.. grrr).

I can't find an easy way of complaining that wouldn't put my kids in an awkward position and I can imagine when they leave just not bothering.

There are great websites for students to review schools, colleges and Universities, but not for parents, who often have a true insight into standards.

Anyone else found a way of complaining and who to or frustrated with this nonsense?

College isn't school though, so they will need to be self directed and motivated, as a preparation for uni / work.
Is it usual to pay for college?

You don't have to pay though. It will vary according to what is being studied and the facilities are available outside the guided learning hours. Dn had a pt job when not required to attend college and many are also on apprenticeship schemes.

what do you mean by 'little kids'? 6 or 7?
My son was at college when he was 14, it is relatively normal.
Not sure what your point is anyway.

oh lol - how LITTLE kids go to college - now I understand.

Preparing them for uni I suppose..

The op has explained what she means

Presuming the ‘kids’ are actually young adults as college is usually 16+ so it’s supposed to be the time that parents take a step back (in preparation for work or university). You say there are websites for students to review said college so if your DD is unhappy with the standard of education she can write her own review and/or take it up with her course administrator(s).

isn't Oaklands an agricultural college?

Oaklands college isn't just Agriculture. Teenagers is the age group. When I went to college (and all my friends) it was FULL time. Why isn't it any more? That's my point.

Curriculums and qualifications change. Over time emphasis has moved from formal taught lessons and workshops to classroom based, practical and independent learning. Some courses require more contact hours than others. If your dc were resitting level 2/gcse their structured timetable might be fuller. What are their courses?

I had exactly the same conversation with my son's College. I was told it was so students could have a part time job while they were at College.
They could actually run some of the two year courses over one year, because some of them have very little content.

We have a 6th form college in town and a school that has a 6th form in a local rural market town. If say two students at both places are taking the same number of A levels then theoretically they should both have the same number of contact hours.

The difference is that most students stay at the school during their frees because there is nowhere else to go other than Tesco. In town there are far more distractions, and the students aren't restricted to travelling to and from their education by school buses.

Also, the academic requirements for entry into the school 6th form are higher than the college, so the students at the school are more motivated to learn and pass their A levels. A lot of the less academic students at the 6th form college in town tend not to turn up to every lesson.

The government funds 16 hours of education a week - more or less.

It's not enough, we are short changing 16 - 19 year olds. This mostly impacts on young people who do vocational courses so no one cares.

I can see that if you are doing 'A' levels study time is essential, but some of the vocational courses do not require it.

MargaretDribble the vocational courses don't need it???

While A levels do?

That is the problem right there. Studying A level Media is SOOO much more important than Level 3 Gas Installations. No it isn't.

No it really isn't. Nope. No. You're wrong.

Vocational courses like Gas, Electrical and plumbing are significantly more important than A levels in Art, business or media. These people will carry out activities that are life threatening and impact on the safety of society. But you know A Levels matter more.

Vocational education is dismissed in the U.K. then we need to import Polish plumbers and people complain and vote for Brexit. The whole fucked up nature of U.K. society in one thread.

The further education sector has been decimated by government funding cuts. My local college has had their budget reduced by £5m per year. A lot of teaching is done online because they can’t afford paper and printing. Teachers are being paid by the hour to save money - few of them still have full time jobs with sick pay and holiday pay etc. Reduced classroom hours means they pay less wages to teachers. And it makes it easier to cut the opening hours for canteen and library etc, thus saving more money.

I doubt that the college has the money for up to date software. The teachers are probably as annoyed about it as you are, but if they want to get paid they have to work with what they’ve got. And if they update the software, they have to also pay someone to update the workbooks and teaching materials. Colleges don’t have that sort of money nowadays.

I remember doing my A levels at school over 30 years ago. I had no lessons from Tue break time until Wed lunchtime because of how the timetabling worked. It's nothing new really.

As PP said, at college they tend to only have to be there when they have timetabled contact time. Our colleges often have their Extended Diplomas (3 A level 'equivalent') over 3 or sometimes 4 days because they don't have to deal with multi-subjects like A levels, and it is a waste of time someone travelling in for an hour each way just for 1 or 2 lessons, so they compress the teaching with few breaks.

Moosemouse I think we are talking at cross purposes here. I was thinking about some of the courses that were on offer at DS' college, not plumbing etc. I would hope those sorts of courses would have quite a large practical element.

"Vocational education is dismissed in the U.K. "

It shouldn't be.

Something is odd about that college, mine attend 2 different ones (they didn't want to be together ) and both went five days a week from 9-4. There's free lessons within the day for self study but each a level had 5 hours of taught lessons, GCSEs 4 hours (other courses had various)

I work in Further Education. We offer BTEC (approx 15 hrs) - over 3 days ( leaving 2 free days for placement/self study) and A levels (approx 16 hours) timetabled over 5 days (so with some study periods) Plus enrichment and tutorial - another 3 hours. Some students also take additional qualifications, some also English and Maths retakes.
If following a 16-19 programme the student will have a personal tutor. My advice would be to contact the tutor to find out what the college is offering - could it be that your kids are choosing to do the minimum? I would do this before deciding to complain.

It 'requires improvement' according to the local newspaper. (June 2018)

From the summary of the Ofsted report it seems that the College has a number of problems with regard to the quality of provision. The College will now be under scrutiny to improve. I am guessing that your concerns are for a student moving from year 1 into Year 2. I would be contacting college - not to complain but to find out about progress and predicted grades for the end of year 2.

It's still NOT 5 days a week of college tutorial like it used to be. It's ridiculous. The fact that Oaklands college doesn't even have the right software to teach their students is mad. I (and my kids) don't think that for a second complaining to the college will help. I've already engaged with them and got flannel. If teenagers HAVE to be in education until they are 18 then it should be full time.. not part time like these supposed full time courses. 2 days a week is part time.

It's a creative course.

Yep, money is a big one. I would love to be a teacher but the salary is just so rubbish compared to having a job in the industry.