Can shouty/loud mums be foster carers?

[hazchem]

We would like to be foster parents at some point in the future. Several years ago we watched a show about social workers in Bristol and it had a profound affect on both my partner and I. There was one boy in particular that we would have offered to foster but we six month away from moving country and felt that was unfair on the boy. It did however begin the discussion that both of us would like to open our home to fostering if we were in a position to do so. We talk about the possibility of fostering every few months and it something both of us want to do.

I am a bit shouty and loud. I'm not nasty but I do raise my voice at my toddler. It is something I am working on. I would like not to raise my voice at DS.

I'd hate for a foster child to be placed with us and then feel scared or placed back into an emotional place because I shouted or raised my voice.

Is it a big deal? The shouting? Do I need to always keep my voice low and well not lose my temper ever.

I think that yes, you need to work on this. A child placed with you might have very negative experiences in which shouting was a part. I think the fact you refer to it as losing your temper, rather than controlled shouting is also an issue. These kids can work to push and test you more than you could imagine.
However, I don't think you have to be 'shouty mum' if you don't want to be, but it takes work. The fact you are aware of it is a massive strength.
I considering foster care as more than just a better home than they would have had, in many ways it is therapeutic parenting in which you try to minimise and repair some of the damage and trauma done.

Thanks. That is positive and constructive.

Earlier this year I did a stress management course and found I was a better parent during that so I think I might spend some time reviewing and trying to implement some of those techniques.

The term therapeutic parenting is really useful. It makes me think I need to be a "better" or more skilled parent to a foster child then my own DS. Hopefully the Circle of Security will give me better insight into what that might entail for a foster child as well as improve my parenting of DS.

It is probably several years before we would be in a position to foster but I think it's good for me to try to work out and work through the rough/bad/difficult bits of my parenting before we start down that route.

If it helps, I really struggled with my first DC as a toddler, but I grew and learned as a parent. Although I can be a bit crabby, I am very laid back and calm nowadays. I can't tell you how to change, just that you can learn a lot of skills as you negotiate your way through parenthood. It is a learning curve and nobody gets it right 100% of the time. Don't be too tough on yourself. You have great reflection skills, use that as a positive!
Good luck with your journey, fostering is blinking hard work but a mostly amazingly rewarding experience.

Thanks! It's really helpful. Bit by bit we grow and become better, I think, or at least I hope we do.

m.thenational.ae/lifestyle/family/what-effect-does-yelling-have-on-your-child

Shouting is considered to be a type of violence/emotional abuse.

But here are some tips to avoid it.

www.bhg.com/health-family/parenting-skills/when-kids-act-up/when-yelling-is-worse-than-spanking/

I am a foster carer. You do get lots of training in parenting, and the fact that you can reflect on your own patenting style is a really positive. It definitely wouldn't be ok to be snouty when fostering, but it can take time and practice. I was very shorty with my first born, 10 years into fostering i rarely do anything more than raise an eyebrow- being in control of your own emotions is very important! There are lots of general parenting courses around, but lots of them don't really work with foster children, we tend to avoid star charts etc because they can make children feel shameful. I would recommend reading Cathy Glass- she is a foster carer who writes about her work, and Kim Golding is good on parenting techniques for traumatised children. They might either put you off or really motivate you!

Watching with interest, as I am shouty.

laughing I read the article. I'm not sure it hit the spot. Obviously shouting "I wish I never had you" is harmful. But surely those words would hurt at any volume. Words and tone are as important as volume. And some of the suggestions like squirting squirty cream at the child or getting in their face "nose to nose" and putting your hands on either side of their head sound pretty questionable. One of the actually useful thoughts was "do you speak to your co workers like that?"

One thing I'm trying to use is in my head counting to ten. So if I ask DS to do something I count to ten in my head before repeating it. I've found I still have to repeat myself but don't get so frustrated as saying. please put your toys away 10 times really fast.

I do think I'm getting better at not shouting and I don't scream. It's more the "get off me it hurts", "stop throwing the X", "get out of the shed and leave the lawn mower again"

I'm pretty sure I haven't done any harm as we are involved in a research project where he has been assessed a couple of times on his emotions/attachment and stuff.

The links are useful but I did wonder about some of the techniques. I know that lots of my brother and my behavior is trying to appease my mother in case we have done something wrong and this She takes a deep breath, gives her kids "the look," then says, quietly, "You are in big, big trouble. If I were you, I would do what it takes to get out of trouble right away, otherwise...," and outlines what the specific punishment will be. She makes sure to follow through." Felt like the start of that behavior.

Parsnipcake thanks for the authors names. Reading peoples experiences would be helpful.

Bonzo77 - the article points that exactly what you're saying; saying there IS a difference between telling a child they're useless according to Lisa Pion-Berlin, president and chief executive officer of Parents Anonymous, Inc. - it's quoted in the middle of the page somewhere!

The point about "gently holding the side of the face" so the child has to maintain eye contact is something I'm sure I've seen the likes of Supernanny advocate over shouting. That gentle holding is not the same as grabbing in anger or pinning someone down.

Also the grabbing a can of cream and spraying at children in fun was a point made as an example of one parent who diffused the situation using humour once. The point being: using humour to get children's attention and stop yourself shouting can help, rather than go out and buy cans of squirty cream!

Marking place as I'm quite shouty too :-(

On a personal level I was yelled at and it can feel quite forceful, like you've been actually hit!

I try not to repeat myself too many times because; a) it's frustrating and probably leads to temptation to yell, and b) it teaches them that they can just switch off when you talk!

(When I remember), if I am ignored the first time I make a request, I go closer and say "put your toys down a minute please, I want you to listen". If I'm still ignored after that, toys are temporarily confiscated (and returned again immediately when I've been listened to).

Suits everyone better than raising the volume.

This thread is really interesting. I am not planning on being a foster parent but would love to find ways to get my 3yr old dc's attention without shouting.

I'd say that I am normally not a shouty mum at all but when dc keeps ignoring me and doesn't listen although we ask nicely, explain, empathise, sound firm and clear etc. we end up loosing our temper and shout .

Dh is the most patient person I know yet he looses his patience and temper when dc does not do as we ask (stuff like sitting properly at the dinner table, getting dressed, waiting a second till we load the car to go out, rather than running out on the street).

laughing I like your suggestion to go down on dc's level and ask to put toys down.

Any more simple but effective advice would be more than welcome .

Also I think we are usually very positive, encouraging and supportive with dc but when we do end up frustrated because we are not listened to and shout at dc, I feel dc doesn't get intimidated but actually snaps out of her 'daze' or what she is preoccupied with and actually starts listening to us. So it works but I absolutely can't stand shouting and obviously would prefer to get dc to do things (or stop doing them ) in a better way.

Is shouting lazy parenting?

Another technique I use is to count to 3. It's the same principle as outlined by hazchem's experience insofar as using a threat of consequences, except without the "look" being given.

Usually that countdown works for things like sitting at the tale for dinner or getting into bed. So for example "I'm going to count to 3 and if you're not in bed by 3 then there will be no bedtime story". I don't usually get past 2 as bedtime stories are popular!

I think the key is not to take behaviour personally and respond with natural consequences. 'naughtiness' is not usually done to get at a parent, and so separating yourself emotionally helps you respond rationally. I just keep my voice low and slow, and often don't respond immediately beyond making them safe. If you give yourself time to think and the child a bit of space it can mean you don't need to shout.

This seems to be turning into a "how to manage toddlers' behaviour" thread. We're hoping to foster in future, but so far only have experience with a pretty well-behaved two-year-old birth daughter; I realise that foster children may be very different. For what it's worth, here's what I've found so far:

I've very occasionally experimented with shouting, mostly in an attempt to get my daughter's attention, but it doesn't work for me. Maybe I'm not convincing enough (that may be a good thing).

Counting to five used to work very well (from ~12-18 months she thought it was a race, so no sanction was necessary, just counting). Then we had to add sanctions. Now sometimes she just joins in; she likes counting.

Rewards or sanctions can still work well, as long as it's something immediate that she can understand; anything that's more than five minutes into the future might as well be at the end of time for all the impact it'll have on her behaviour. Sometimes when I've warned her about a sanction, she doesn't change her behaviour to see whether I really mean what I say, and then we have to go through remorseful tears and whining, but I try to see that as having a positive outcome because it's a lesson learned and credibility gained.

Given her control over what's going on is good as well. She's much keener on getting dressed now that she has vests that she can step into, pull up, and put her arms into, so she has a role to play rather than it just being something that's done to her. Letting her choose her clothes for the day is a good way of getting the process started too.

But, by far the best ways of getting her do what I want (when I can muster the energy and imagination to use them) are distraction, humour, and intrigue. A few examples:

• If she says she's too tired to climb the stairs, getting her to chase a toy up them or telling her there's something waiting at the top for her (you then have to make sure that there is, e.g. a soft toy who needs putting to bed) can work wonders.
• She wasn't at all keen on having her teeth brushed until we turned the toothbrush into a puppet that she got to chat with about her day first, and then she looked forward to teeth-brushing; that worked for a couple of months.
• To get her to sit on her potty, we made up a special song that we can only sing when she's doing so.

Okay, so the examples range from the banal to the naff (and only work some of the time), but they're the kind of thing that's worked best in getting her on-side and doing what we want her to. The difficult bit is coming up with something that will engage her on the spur of the moment, so if anyone has any other examples or ideas to share, then please do!

I wanted to say since I post about the shouting I've felt much better and have been much calmer, using distraction, humor, and time instead.
So thanks:)