can those of you who have lived in germany come and give me some advice.

[kerryk]

dh is on a posting just now (in the uk) but next year he is looking to get his sgt's tape and we are hoping this will mean a move to germany.

we have not had a posting abroad before so i am a bit nervous, have been near my family for 6 years now and see them most weekends but my biggest worry is having to move the dd's away from family/friends/school/clubs etc.

how did everyone else find the schools in germany? were you happy living there or desperate to get back to the uk?

another big factor is how bloody expensive this country is just now, we have been saving for our own house for a few years now but the only way i can see us making a big rise in our savings is to move away for a while and put away the extra every month.

is the cost of living really a lot cheaper out there as well?

We lived in Germany from 97 -05 and loved it, but we had no children and i worked full time.

We are not very close to our family so not to bothered about seeing them, but some people did find it v hard.

The primary schools are okay according to my friends but the senior schools are a different matter and the majority of our friends either used boarding school or moved back to the UK.

It has got more expensive out there now and in some ways like living in a goldfish bowlmore than the uk.

We lived in Hameln, Paderborn and Hohne and enjoyed all three places, they are all different.

We just put the LOA away each month by direct debit and were extremely good at saving, but know a lot of people who just spent the whole lot on socialising.

Do you have any idea where you are likely to go.

Another thing most of the quarters are Flats not many houses at all, which means communal gardens which can cause problems.

But we loved it there and would say go with an open mind.

We're in Germany at the moment and are moving to a different part of Germany next month.
You get paid significantly more than in UK, thanks to the LOA and the cost of living is actually less, especially when you take into account the duty free goods like beer, wine and cigarettes etc.
You also have part of your UK wage transferred into a German account every month, so you could technically keep the rest just adding up in your UK account.
You can also buy things in the German shops with a tax-free form through your mess, saving you about 17 per cent on the marked prices for certain things over 50 euros.
Like MWAY says, the junior schools are very good but the senior schools vary depending on where you are.
Where might you end up?

Ahhhh...BFG...the land of milk and honey. You will be CONSIDERABLY better off financially thanks to LOA (non-taxable so basically free money) and also Kindergeld paid by the German Govt to 'top up' your UK child benefit - this is for real bit of a mission to apply for it but not impossible the admin office can help you do it!! We were in Germany for 2.5 years 2004 - 2006 and loved every minute. In my opinion everthing is better, food, cost of living, opportunities for travel, family-friendly Germans, healthcare for the WHOLE family, tax-free shopping...I could go on. It's daunting at first (moving to a foreign country) but you should see it for the fantastic opportunity it is and make the most of the few years you are there. I would go back in a heartbeat. Cheap flights back with Air Berlin to Stansted...

oooh lucky girl... can we come? dd1 was born in Bielefeld - but I can recommend a few other places too! It's a bit more 'old school' than any UK patch, so if wives' clubs and coffee mornings aren't your bag then start learning german now... Leisure facilities usually better (some fab pools/ lidos to take kids to etc) and nothing like sitting outside a cafe in the sunshine watching the world go by... jobs can be tricky as you need security clearance etc, so if you fance working you need to register as soon as you arrive to get the paperwork started... Down to Bavaria in the winter - european summers... need I say more? SCE will give you info about schools, but generally ok - worth looking at the boarding options so you can make sensible decisions if yours are older...

You lucky thing...part of me would so love to return to Germany (I am german)....!

Where are you hoping to go?

i have no idea what area we are likly to end up in. it does sound good though. dc are 6&4 and i would like to go and be back in uk for dd starting high school. boarding will never be a option for my children no matter how much they beg (over anxious mummy!!!)

the thought of living abroad does seem like a huge step to take but it would be great for dd's to experience it.

can i say something negative.......

i dont think you are better off out there at all. we lost over £1200 per month, the loa does not cover very much at all. I was in hameln, there are not very many jobs for wives at all, and if you are lucky enough to get one, the pay is terrible. Also dont forget, that you may been making more phone calls to the uk, posting things back, travelling back to the uk, so the LOA doesnt really go all that far. Yes petrol,booze and fags are cheeper, but thats about it. I found clothes and furnishings to be more expensive, plus i did not really like the german things anyway.
Socially unless you are into wives clubs in a big way, its not great, and it is a far far smaller goldfish bowl that you could ever imagine.
Germany itself however, is wonderful, so if you do get a posting try to travel.

Hope that doesnt sound to bad, just felt i needed to balance the argument!

There are "cheap" phonenumbers, which you can pre-dial and then add the number you are calling and you will pay pennies for a long distance long phonecall.
And as for loss of money, I suppose it depends if kerry works in the UK and in what sort of Job , if a lot of money if any is lost...
Clothes are more expensive out in Germany, especially Kids clothes, but furniture, I believe isn't more expensive, unless it has changed a lot since I visited Germany last!
However, frocks for do's are cheaper in Germany and places like C&A have a really good selection.

we have been in Germany for 4 years now and I will be sad to leave. If you shop cleverly, you can save loads (eg my weekly shop for a family of 5 is ?70 - about £55). Your petrol costs will at least halve. There is loads to do for families very cheaply at weekends and booze and fags are very cheap. The schools are, I'm afraid, Hobson's choice - there are some good and some bad. if you are close to your family, it will be a wrench, but I am my dh both work here and the dependants jobs are quite sensible in terms of hours and child care is cheap.

I still get all my clothes from UK via internet, but H&M is very cheap here and the children get all their clothes from there. I find furniture very cheap if you know where to go and use the tax free forms from your welfare office which give you 20% of everything. As for the old fashioned patch, it really depends where you are - our last posting there was no rank among the wives - majors wives happily socialised with privates wives, here it is a bit more old fashioned, but the wives in question will move soon. Also, leisure is v cheap here - a four hour stint in our local swimming pool for 5 of us costs ?16 - and it is better than any pool I have ever been to in UK. But do try and learn a bit of german - it makes life much easier.

oh, I forgot about the kindergeld - on top of my UK child benefit, I get an extra ?200 per month for the three of them.

As most people say, there are good things and bad things about Germany. We are here now and love it!
Some things are cheaper, some more expensive, but generally car costs are very low -no road tax, tax free fuel -we pay about 7.50 euros for 10 litres, no tv licence etc and food can be cheaper depending on where you shop and what you buy.
Wages for dependents tend to be low and job can be limited.
On the downside it can be expensive settling here, you may need to buy new lights for your car and things like new plugs etc can add up. You also need to pay for your ferry over(afaik army will only pay for flights!)
As a sgt your husband should get a house. Ours is ok -not great but it has a good cellar and attic.
I have sent my ds to German kindergarten, but primary schools generally have a good rep. I only know of the Senior school in Gutersloh, but it seems ok (my friends who teach there are lovely!). The major downside is a long commute for some kids, and some have to weekly board as it is so far.
Lots of parks,swiming pools, zoos, safe cycle paths so lots to do for families.
Within the army community it can be a bit cliquey-not so bad where we are as there are a few regts so you do not have to socialise with your husbands work colleagues. Also the patches are very spread out so you are not always falling over people! We go to an international church and enjoy meeting people outwith the army circle and of course am starting to meet Germans at Kindergarten.
Let us know if you get an idea of where you might go and someone may be able to be more specific.

Kidergeld increases dramatically the more children you have by the way -I get an extra 37 euros for 1 child.

trock, which church is it- the bielefeld one?

It is yes -do you know it? Near the route 2/33 junction.

Hello you two. Will be joining you up there in a couple of months!

No tV licence? There's the GEZ - but you don't have to let them in when they come knocking, so theoretically you can get away with it. We don't have a TV and have repeatedly been nagged with letters, despite paying our radio charges. Horrible lot with horrible tactics IMO.

We (not forces, dh is German) live better here than we would in the UK on the same income. My deep and abiding sadness is lack of garden. But we are in Berlin. The lack of stigma to renting here is so refreshing. Public transport and healthcare excellent.

Kindergartens generally good, the school system has its (big) pitfalls - read our German Schools thread if you dare to get an idea. In general children are less 'looked after' here and the emphasis on pastoral care is worryingly low. As a parent you have to choose the school carefully and really keep an eye on things.

Berolina -afaik forces do not have to pay German tv licence (no one has asked anyway!) we only watch dvds anyway.
Scootergirl-looking forward to meeting you sometime? Hope the move goes well.

Glad the GEZ will keep away from your doors

c u soon scoots - looking fwd to it. Trock, I do know it - used to go there when we were in Bielefeld, but now in Herford. RU in Bielefeld?

We are in Gutersloh -come through to Herford for bible study on Tues btw. Not on here much atm as compter playing up.

I live in Herford, used to go to that Bible study - perhaps I know you?

Don=t think i know you.Have only been going since jan. Do you know Beatta? Always happy to make a new friend! Computer still broken, but will check in.