is it possibly to eat entirely ethically without growing all your own food, and never eating out?

[MrsChemist]

I've been pondering this recently as I thought I would like to make more of an effort to eat ethically.

On the first day I fell at the first hurdle. It was my dad's birthday, so we went out to restaurant. I didn't know if the meat was free range, so thought, 'nevermind, I'll have the mushroom risotto.'
However, the mushroom risotto had cheese and cream in it. I didn't know if the cheese and cream came from free range cows.
There was one vegan dish on the menu, which was pasta in a tomato and basil sauce.
I suppose I could have asked if their meat/dairy was free range, but I'm betting it would have taken too long to find out (parents only have an hour for lunch).
There will be times when eating out that their meat/dairy isn't free range, and I will be forced to have the vegan option. I like eating things I can't cook at home when on nights out. Usually that involves meat. Veganism is like my idea of hell (no offence meant to the vegans. One man's meat is another man's poison and all that.)

Then we get into the ethics of vegetables. Organic locally sourced? Or from Sub Saharan Africa (or somewhere equally developing and far away)? Organic and locally sourced has less food miles and no pesticides poisoning the surrounding environment.
However, increase in demand for locally sourced food decreases the demand for food in developing counties, possibly costing people their livelihood. Losing ones livelihood in a developing country has far more serious consequences than losing ones livelihood here.

Don't even get me started on ethical alcohol or the ingredients of e-numbers.

I am clearly thinking about this too much, but I can't help myself. I need lentil weavery advice. I know a lot of you will say "get real, it's just food" and I would usually totally agree with you, but something has made me think twice about my food.

i think that you do what you can do.

we eat very ethically at home the vast majority of the time, it's nearly always vegan (!) because we're vegetarian and ds2 can't eat dairy/egg

if dp buys meat it is always free-range.

but you know what? there is no need to suffer for it. we buy trashy stuff once in a while becuase we LIKE it and it gives us a little bit of pleasure., if we eat out we eat stuff we like, because that's the whole point.

I don't think you need to do everything 100% for it to make a difference.
if everyone in the whole country ate ethically for one day a week it would be HUGE!

I would go for locally sourced any day of the week. the further away it comes fromt he bigger the carbon footprint either in airmiles, or from the shipping. the fruit/veg will be much older as well by the time it gets to you
I feel very strongly about protecting our ability to produce what we need in this country.

I agree that maybe this could affect people in developing countries, but tbh i don't think that payinglocal people peanuts to produce masses of fruit/veg for exporting is really a great thing for them to be doing anyway!
nothing is going to change in third world countries until their governments want it to

True, you are right about the governments. and I was only thinking about it more from the point of view of being exploited but paid, or not being paid. Didn't really factor in anything else into the equation.

I'm ok with not eating meat as much as I usually do. When I was a student, I couldn't afford meat much, so I know how to eat properly and tastily as a vegetarian. Just sometimes I Really fancy a steak or something equally meaty that hasn't been cooked by me.

One of the reasons I am picky about restaurant meat is that I used to work in a pub, and their chicken breasts came in a box, pre-cooked, with Thailand written on the side in big letters. It was a busy pub and a lot of people ate there not knowing that their chicken was cheap, pre-cooked intensively farmed chicken.

but it's ok to fancy a steak sometimes, and to go and have it.
though i do know what you mean about being unsure of where stuff comes from

i guess i'd search around, find local places that do source ingredients locally and try and be a bit more ethical about what they serve.

but i don't think that not-so-ethical steak once in a while is a problem

I suppose

To be honest, I don't eat out that often anyway. It's just I really go all out when I do.