Miaou - My bread failures, please help!

[Gingerbear]

I thought I had the knack, but alas no.
1st batch I made I used dried yeast that needed to be mixed with sugar and warm water first (but omitted that step)
2nd batch I used a 'bread mix' of multigrain flour. It was like lead.
3rd batch - mistakenly added twice the quantity of yeast. Light and fluffy, but awful yeasty smell and horrid taste.
4th time lucky perhaps?
Or shall I stick with the local baker (Who does lovely bread, but quite expensive)

Do I need to 'knock-back' the dough and leave to rise again?

I never mix my dried yeast with water.

500g strong bread flour (warmed for 30 secs in microwave)
2tsp salt, 2tsp sugar, 2tbsp olive oil - stir in one sachet of dried yeast and add warm water, knead for 10 mins, prove until double, knead and prove again, bake.
I usually make rolls rather than a loaf so I know they are cooked in the middle!

oh add the yeast to the warmed flour before the liquid goes in - oops

I have used the sachets of dried yeast sucessfully, but latest was a tin of Allinsons Dried Yeast (tiny round particles) it says on the tin to prepare it like fresh yeast (I read the tin after my failure!)
Knead for 10 mins? My hands ache after 5!

Ah Gingerbear - that's the yeast we use. Really need MrMiaou to advise but he is not about. He mixes the yeast into (I think) 1/2 boiling, half cold water (ie mix up the water first then add the yeast, if yeast comes into contact with boiling water it will kill it). Leave until it has a good head on it, like a pint of beer! MrMiaou does this in a pyrex jug or pint glass. No need to knock it back (I'm pretty sure MrMiaou never does but I will check).

Re kneading - it's a technique which, as you do it more, you will find your hands don't ache as much. It's as much about turning the dough as pushing/pressing it - no need to get out of breath doing it . MrMiaou does his in the kenwood mixer with a dough hook.

Keep trying! You know what is going wrong each time, so it should work out!

or you could just chuck it in the food processor!

put flour, salt, sugar and oil in, whizz for 10 secs, put dried yeast in, pulse to mix, then drizzle 1/2 pint warm water in until makes a dough, give it 10 more seconds to complete kneading then leave it to prove as before.

I've done that this morning as I was feeling lazy - hope it works!

Hi Miaou, yes, i did the proper foamy yeast thing last time - but used 500g flour and 1 tablespoon of dried yeast (I think I should have used half that amount of yeast. It did rise rather well though!

I use dough hook in food processor for mixing, then knead for 5 mins.
Too much? If lucycat's method works I may try that.
(So glad I buy my flour in Lidl!)

Definitely worth another go then Gingerbear - you're nearly there!! And it's soooo worth it when you get it right

Ok - just had a word with MrMiaou - he says use 2 parts cold to one part boiling water. He also says he would use two teaspoons (or if you have very accurate scales, 10g) of yeast - a tablespoon is too much (as you have discovered!!).

Re knocking back - if you are in a warm house and the bread rises well in 30 mins, then that should be sufficient. MrMiaou then knocks it back and kneads it very briefly (30 seconds-ish!) then puts it in a tin and bakes it.

He also asked me to point out that it took a bit of trial and error himself to get to this point, but that once you have mastered it you will be able to almost do it in your sleep

Anything else just ask!

also if you use the dough hook in the food processor, just give it about a minute after it has all come together nicely and then no kneading is needed.

There are 2 types of dried yeast. The sort that needs to be pre-mixed with water etc and the sort that doesn't.

If you use the stuff that should be mixed with water dry it doesn't work well at all.

ahem, I use allinsons, and yes, to my dismay, I found that out on my first attempt!
Then followed the instructions on the tin and it resulted in yeasty bread (pongy too)

Good to see that it takes trial and error to perfect the art of breadmaking.
I shall report back after tonight's efforts.

this thread is really making me want to make some bread

I made that mistake and used the granule-like allinsons one - I found the sachets worked a bit better but the bread was still too dense and smelled of yeast

(am thinking I didn't knead it enough)

will be interested to see how yours goes gingerbread - if it works, would you mind writing out exactly (as if for a person who finds following instructions tricky ) what you did?

i knead for 10 mins
let it rest an hour
knead it again for 10
then rest an hour again

Tis in the oven now.
I made up 10g allinsons into froth, added all in food processor, kneaded for 5 mins, proved for 1 hour, knocked back then proved for 30 mins.
Will let you know in 30 mins.
DH has just piped up 'Wharburtons born and bred'
cheeky sod.

oooh... can I have a taste??

Loverlee!
Light and fluffy and not yeasty at all.
That was white bread.
Now have to attempt wholemeal and malted.
Might go for a 50:50 mix.
I am Mrs Wharburton!

excellent!! See I told you you had nearly got it!!

We do a mix of white and malthouse for our brown bread - I think we ended up doing about 2/3 white to 1/3 malthouse, but it's quite a strong malt so that's why 50/50 was too much. I would err on the side of too much white and build up from there iiwy.

Glad you persevered in the end!!

if you don't mind, could you post exactly what ingredients you used (how much flour etc.)?

I shall try some later I think

500g strong white bread flour
2 level teaspoon salt, 1 level tsp sugar, 2 tablespoons olive oil,
10g (2 tsp) Allinsons dried yeast, activated with 1 tespoon of sugar in 150ml hand hot water (mixed as per MrMiaou's instructions.)
An extra 150ml warm water to bind the dough

Add yeast to sugar dissolved in warm water. Leave for 10 mins to froth.
Mixed flour, salt, sugar and oil in Food processor. Added froth, then rest of water. blend for 10 seconds.
Turn out onto work surface and knead for 5 mins.
Put into greased pyrex bowl, cover with teatowel and leave on top of boiler for 1 hour.
knead again for a few mins, then leave to sise for 30 mins.
Put in loaf tin and bake for 30 mins in fan oven at 170 degrees.

thanks gingerbear

you are welcome.
I think we need a bread club

Gingerbear - look in member profiles I posted a piccy of my rolls last night!

Gingerbear - we are sharing tips on here: here
Tis a bit quiet at the mo because I can't bear to talk about food whilst in the throes of morning sickness! But I aim to get it moving again soon.